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A great post. I do not know why some can't accept cities have something special and that's it. I respect Toronto. It's the main city of a nation. I feel bad how Montréal lost because of Separatists. But there was a reason it ROSE FIRST. It is a awesome city with more European flavor the virtually any other North American city but Mexico city possibly? Don't know it never was there.
I looked through Forbes list of influential cities bit spyware is terrible for omen sights. But a porn on got through. But the PICTURES OF SOME ASIN CITIES JUST MIGHT PUT CHICAGO AND TORONTO TO OLD SIMPLER BUILDING CITIES? THEY BUILD LRGE SCALE?
So in reality why should sister-cities as Toronto and Chicago argue ? Others surpass BOTH. LOL. Some just can't be civil and understand why older well established cities still stand out. Nothing takes their history and contribution away. Not even accusing of in decline.
Can't rep you again sorry.
Toronto and Chicago are sister cities that should work together for the prosperity of both.
But don't be fooled by Asian cities like Shanghai, Beijing, Shenzhen, they have scale, but they are not as well planned, built, or designed as North American and European cities.
Those building designs have been around for at least 2 years now and still nothing yet.When its competed THEN it can be discussed properly. https://www.dezeen.com/2014/07/03/fr...apers-toronto/
Yes I recognize it as Toronto syle but its a variation of Victorian which exist indifferent forms everywhere.In Toronto its always brick.In the South and West,its always wood with more elaborate designs.
Here is a typical Queen Anne Victorian in Atlanta's Inman Park dating back to 1880;s.
Loved you pictures of those stately Victorians. Some by me in the Northeast. I just would hate to heat them up north. I hate winter LOL.
Just so much ALL cities have to offer. We dwell on arguing my city or just favorite one is better, bigger, more the and that?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atticman
Frank Gehry was born in Toronto and has designed a two tower complex which has been approved for construction and will exceed 300 metres in height.
It might not be "known around the world", but Toronto's 'bay-and-gable' style of residential architecture is unique to the city and immediately identifiable as Toronto.
These styles of housing are what link Toronto to the Northeast. Especially the Mid Atlantic states like Pennsylvania. In Philly they are called Duplex-Doubles. But in most of the rest of PA to Pittsburgh into Cleveland the term Half-Doubles is used. Common in my hometown with peaks. But not necessarily the gabled effect. Some areas they are more wood-framed not brick. Depends on the region.
These styles are UNCOMMON in most of the Midwest US. East into Ohio yes. Chicago has some Victorian rows. But most of the city is far more separated housing. Even if just inches. Some North of downtown have some Victorian Rows surviving or separated Victorians and Chicago Greystones . Many sadly were in South side areas where these were lost. Terrible for sure.
Some old Greysones on left here plain ones actually and Old Cottage homes on the right in a ORDINARY un-gentrified neighborhood on the North side. Still the neighborhood looks good.
OK some on the Southside Racially African-American area and higher crime. Though not the worst in gangs. Don't look bad at all. City still cleans streets. These are fancier and signs of cleaned and taken care of homes too. But other blocks can show lost housing.
***NOTICE STEET SWEEPER WET MARKINGS JUST WENT THROUGH PROVING CITY KEEPS UP SERVICES LIKE STREET CLEANINGS ALL THROUGH THE CITY TORONONIANS CALL IN DECLINE? Sorry had to note this. https://www.google.com/maps/@41.8544...7i13312!8i6656
OK NOW BAD BAD NORTORIOUS ENGLEWOOD NEIGHBORHOOD FURTHER SOUTH. 10+ MILES FROM DOWNTOWN.
Usual Chicago city layout with front green-space hones set-back. NOTICE THE RED X ON THE CENTER COTTAGE HOME. DENOTES CITY BOARDED IT UP AS ABANDONED. SO SAD. GOOD HOUSING AWAITING REVIVING. https://www.google.com/maps/@41.8544...7i13312!8i6656
THESE NEIGHBÔHOODS WILL OVERCOME AND INFILL AGAIN. In time and I hope sooner over later. But the city still services them and they re not forgotten. Key is jobs to move in. This is a different nation and has issues Canada does not.
LOL,I love where Im at in the U.S.Love living here and other than to make money off diversity craved Torontonians,I have NO desire to live in Toronto.Its way too cold and way too expensive for what you get.to
I do have much love for Montreal but again too cold but worth the cost to me.
However I also love to live in Savannah one day but not diverse enough and still a little lacking in amenities I like.
Im concerned about crime in Chicago of course.Who in there right mind would not be,but all that I have mentioned in my several post is WHY its an ICONIC city loved all over the world despite its MANY problems.
Toronto DOES NOT rank ANYWHERE I have seen as one of the most beautiful or architectural cities in the world like Chicago has.That is a fact.
You guys from Torongto seem to really get annoyed with any criticism.Questioning and ganging up on posters that dare defy your idea of your city.
Fact is not ONCE have I said you were wrong about any of what you said.Its just NOT important enough for me not to like the city.Apparently its not enough for you either as you keep trekking yourself back there.
You guys are so desperate to make TDot so much more than it is in the minds of people everywhere that you have to showcase what is obvious because you have no other points but the obvious.
Its pathetic.Like watching and animal caught in a trap fighting to escape before it passes out.
Chicago is an integral part of the U.S. history and present today.U.S.and the world would have far ranging implications without Chicago's financial institutions.research laboratories,Corporate power and cultural institution
Um I brought up a LOT more than Historical contributions but because it fits your narrativeand because you cant acknowledge the rest because then you would have to admit the obvious that Chicago is more of everything than Toronto will be even with its population boom.
Houston will surpass Chicago n population with its 600 sq mi but will NEVER be as ICONIC as Chicago JUST LIKE TORONTO can grow with thousands more people and STILL be a city like Houston that has a lot of economic clout and robust growth but never be in the stratus of Chicago's brand.'Another reason I posted the world ranking of "city Branding" which Toronto was very low.
Yall dismissed it but it confirms exactly what I feel and others.Next time you go out of the country ask people what they know about Toronto that have never been.Then ask them about Chicago,
In fact ask people what they know in Toronto about Chicago and then ask the same in Chicago about Toronto.
So comments of Chicago's"decline" would have to be tied o decline of the U.S. like when the Auto industry failed in Detroit which oddly enough is doing more than well as well as our national economy..
Chicago role in the U.S. is less because there simply is competition from everywhere that did not exist before.
SF and LA created a new industry that around the world including Toronto and Chicago are active in the race for STEM jobs like everywhere else from Houston to Miami to Seattle.
Every city is not that city.Philadelphia ,Chicago,Boston are as much blue collar cities as they are white collar.Philly has the same type of educational environment Boston has.Chicago has top schools but no where near the amount and prestige of the many schools in those cities.
Chicago will never be allowed to fail unless companies stop moving there.Why do you think the city is gentriying everywhere including parts of the Southside?
Chiago is ranked 4thin the US in construction projects but you persist thats some how not relevant.
Toronto DOES NOT rank ANYWHERE I have seen as one of the most beautiful or architectural cities in the world like Chicago has.That is a fact.
You guys from Torongto seem to really get annoyed with any criticism.Questioning and ganging up on posters that dare defy your idea of your city.
They're not getting 'annoyed', their rebutting your assertions with their own selective facts to support their contentions. I thought that what debate was all about? Who ever said when arguing a point that each participant shouldn't be allowed to make reference to the facts or studies or surveys that bolster their positions and seek to undermine those of his adversary? That's kind of what one does when chewing on a bone of contention.
I get the feeling from reading your stuff that you think it utterly preposterous that anyone would even think of placing T.O. and chicago on the same plane whatsoever. Some people beg to differ with your assessment and simply tried to put forward their case. No need to getting miffed about that or to take it personally.
I, on the other hand, agree with you; Toronto is too bland and insipid for me personally and the people here don't really care to place greater emphasis (and money) into making grander and more imposing and iconic. I really disagree with the consensus view on that but I'm in the minority. In Toronto, pragmatism and practical considerations rule.
You guys are so desperate to make TDot so much more than it is in the minds of people everywhere that you have to showcase what is obvious because you have no other points but the obvious.
City boosters are, that's for sure. Maybe some of the people on C-D are involved in real estate or tourism sectors and it's part of their jobs to promote the city. Who knows?
But seriously.Its not even an original Gehry design and its ONE.Still impressive I admit.
Toronto City council recently gave the green light for construction start on the two Mirvish and Gehry supertalls, at 82 and 92 storeys, by Frank Gehry. The builders have already started marketing and condo sales on King Street West. It will be built on top of the existing Princess of Wales Theatre.
As someone mentioned earlier, the amount of buildings going up in Toronto is quite impressive. I bumped into a recent Toronto Star article that created a picture rendering of all the major projects currently under construction in Financial District, Midtown Toronto, Dundas, and Yorkville areas - keep in mind that the labels all indicate buildings currently under construction, not existing building stock nor mid-rise/low-rise constructions:
Financial District Under Construction Pipeline:
Downtown South Core Under Construction Pipeline:
Yorkville Under Construction Pipeline:
Dundas/Central Downtown Under Construction Pipeline:
When the dust settles in 2020: Toronto Financial District, Downtown, South Core, Dundas, Yorkville, and Midtown Eglinton Districts:
One city declined to a much lower ranking, while the other city not only rose to a higher ranking, it passed the other city which declined. Can you guess which city is which? You could always click the link for the answer.
You know I saw this link you posted and wondered to myself why there are no other list lie this.
Then I saw this after a bit of digging:
Quote:
the Martin Prosperity Institute, a University of Toronto think-tank created just for him
Him is Richard Florida of The Atlantic Cities which is now CityLab.
Let me be clear,I dont think Toronto is ""small time".
You guys go overboard with th e extremes and generalizations about what I and other posters have said.
However cities like Chicago are entrenched in the worlds financial,economic,scientific ,research communities and cultural institutional societies at large.
Yes Chicago has and will like every city decline as the world catches up.I remember when even London was no where near NYC.London was always a distance behind NYC.
Its mainly due to the formation of the European Union
So London being #1 does not mean NYC is not major relevant in the world.
The U.S. is an extremely competitive country.We compete against each other before we compete to the world.
States vs States cities versus cities
Chicago was never a behemoth like NYC so all the upstarts like banking capital Charlotte have taken some of that sector from Chicago ,Atlanta,San Francisco Florida and even NYC,Bank of America USED to be a California bank for over 100 years.
Wells Fargo?Ditto
Chicago is still a major logistic capital for the U.S and the world.It had the number one airport in the world but now surpassed years ago by Atlanta.
Cities that did not boom more than 60 years ago now will grow faster as they are expanding economies.Chicago has already been at that point.
As someone mentioned earlier, the amount of buildings going up in Toronto is quite impressive. I bumped into a recent Toronto Star article that created a picture rendering of all the major projects currently under construction in Financial District, Midtown Toronto, Dundas, and Yorkville areas - keep in mind that the labels all indicate buildings currently under construction, not existing building stock nor mid-rise/low-rise constructions:
Financial District Under Construction Pipeline:
Downtown South Core Under Construction Pipeline:
Yorkville Under Construction Pipeline:
Dundas/Central Downtown Under Construction Pipeline:
When the dust settles in 2020: Toronto Financial District, Downtown, South Core, Dundas, Yorkville, and Midtown Eglinton Districts:
Love this. I saw these on Urban Toronto recently.
Looking back, I wish the Oxford MTCC buildings went up and looking back a bit further I wish the Sapphire Tower was built (2007?). But hey, I'll take these dozen of skyscrapers any day of the week.
Toronto DOES NOT rank ANYWHERE I have seen as one of the most beautiful or architectural cities in the world like Chicago has.That is a fact.
You guys from Torongto seem to really get annoyed with any criticism.Questioning and ganging up on posters that dare defy your idea of your city.
They're not getting 'annoyed', their rebutting your assertions with their own selective facts to support their contentions. I thought that what debate was all about? Who ever said when arguing a point that each participant shouldn't be allowed to make reference to the facts or studies or surveys that bolster their positions and seek to undermine those of his adversary? That's kind of what one does when chewing on a bone of contention.
I get the feeling from reading your stuff that you think it utterly preposterous that anyone would even think of placing T.O. and chicago on the same plane whatsoever. Some people beg to differ with your assessment and simply tried to put forward their case. No need to getting miffed about that or to take it personally.
I, on the other hand, agree with you; Toronto is too bland and insipid for me personally and the people here don't really care to place greater emphasis (and money) into making grander and more imposing and iconic. I really disagree with the consensus view on that but I'm in the minority. In Toronto, pragmatism and practical considerations rule.
You guys are so desperate to make TDot so much more than it is in the minds of people everywhere that you have to showcase what is obvious because you have no other points but the obvious.
City boosters are, that's for sure. Maybe some of the people on C-D are involved in real estate or tourism sectors and it's part of their jobs to promote the city. Who knows?
No.I welcome the debate but when it comes to Toronto its ALWAYS defensive from the moment dont agree with you.
They whole things started when "Mr.Burns" made remarks about Chicago in "decline" do to population loss and crime.
while I agree that will slow growth and eventually prosperity,this is not the case with Chicago now.
Evidence of other cities success is not evidence of Chicago declining.
Mjun18 tried to bolster the argument by incorrectly saying that nicer parts of the city are now decaying when in reality,the area he mentioned was experiencing redevelopment.
Im a very logical person and dont mind being wrong because I dont know everything. One of the reason I love C-D so much as I do learn things that I did know know before as well as I share my knowledge.
So if you say to me "Chicago is in decline" only to show crime statistics,very minor population loss or stagnation in mainly already depressed areas such as the Southside,but then ignore job growth,corporate relocations,re-gentrification of several neighborhoods and construction projects that rank among the most in the country, then what apparently is a logical assumption is met with resistance because any admission would somehow invalidate Toronto as a world city is absurd.
In fact as I have said in the beginning of this entire thread,Chicago has crime issues and population loss/stagnation is part of that but lets be clear,we are talking about the "Chicagoland" meaning not just in the city but the equivalent of Toronto and places like Mississauga.Many of the core areas of the city are booming as what I provided in several pages with links showing how much construction and re gentrification is going on.
Here is a interactive map that shows you. 2010 U.S. Census: Illinois Population Change Map ? Chicago Tribune
As someone mentioned earlier, the amount of buildings going up in Toronto is quite impressive. I bumped into a recent Toronto Star article that created a picture rendering of all the major projects currently under construction in Financial District, Midtown Toronto, Dundas, and Yorkville areas - keep in mind that the labels all indicate buildings currently under construction, not existing building stock nor mid-rise/low-rise constructions:
Financial District Under Construction Pipeline:
Downtown South Core Under Construction Pipeline:
Yorkville Under Construction Pipeline:
Dundas/Central Downtown Under Construction Pipeline:
When the dust settles in 2020: Toronto Financial District, Downtown, South Core, Dundas, Yorkville, and Midtown Eglinton Districts:
This doesn't show Yonge at Eglington, which is its own cluster. It only goes up to yorkville.
No.I welcome the debate but when it comes to Toronto its ALWAYS defensive from the moment dont agree with you.
They whole things started when "Mr.Burns" made remarks about Chicago in "decline" do to population loss and crime.
while I agree that will slow growth and eventually prosperity,this is not the case with Chicago now.
Evidence of other cities success is not evidence of Chicago declining.
Mjun18 tried to bolster the argument by incorrectly saying that nicer parts of the city are now decaying when in reality,the area he mentioned was experiencing redevelopment.
Im a very logical person and dont mind being wrong because I dont know everything. One of the reason I love C-D so much as I do learn things that I did know know before as well as I share my knowledge.
So if you say to me "Chicago is in decline" only to show crime statistics,very minor population loss or stagnation in mainly already depressed areas such as the Southside,but then ignore job growth,corporate relocations,re-gentrification of several neighborhoods and construction projects that rank among the most in the country, then what apparently is a logical assumption is met with resistance because any admission would somehow invalidate Toronto as a world city is absurd.
In fact as I have said in the beginning of this entire thread,Chicago has crime issues and population loss/stagnation is part of that but lets be clear,we are talking about the "Chicagoland" meaning not just in the city but the equivalent of Toronto and places like Mississauga.Many of the core areas of the city are booming as what I provided in several pages with links showing how much construction and re gentrification is going on.
Here is a interactive map that shows you. 2010 U.S. Census: Illinois Population Change Map ? Chicago Tribune
Far cry from Detroit or a city in "decline"indeed.
LOL. Typical.
"Oh there is population growth in this neighbourhood" .... "Oh there is only crime in this area".
Nitpicking Chicago neighbourhoods and neglecting others to hide the overall decline in the city of Chicago isn't going to work unfortunately.
This is a city vs city thread. Not a "neighbourhood vs neighbourhood" thread.
And looking at the city of Chicago as a whole, things are decling. Again, there is nothing wrong with decline and I'm not sure why you have an issue with this.
You can ask with the thousands of people that are leaving/have left , the ones that complaining about the insane crime rate, declining public school system, nearly 700 homicides, super high property taxes, etc. and so on. I can keep going but I'll stop right there.
Choosing the small amount of Chicago neighbourhoods that are not declining and focusing your replies on those ones... in a city vs city discussion... isn't going to cut it.
And pointing out the 44 buildings under construction to portray the city is not in decline = lol.
Are a large majority of those buildings not all within the loop area?The area you nitpicked? How many of those 44 buildings are outside the loop?
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