What is attracting California and west coast folks to DFW? (Dallas: foreclosure, rentals)

[DWong]

Originally Posted by _Charles_

I work in a highly specialised area of IT. The medium salary (and I am higher than the medium) for what I do in both SoCal and DFW is $93k a year. The $$$ goes further and affords a much higher standard of living in DFW.

I had assumed LA county was slightly higher than Dallas county - which I was right on no? I clearly stated, private sector jobs are about even or maybe more in Socal.

Maybe a better measure is salary.com
Yes, a bit more here, but doesn't go as far - but again why's that a big surprise. We're paying for more than "just a nice house and yard".

And in general DFW is not lower per capita income wise then SoCal - check the stats - they are available all over the web.

I did and I say ace's post. Again, they are pretty much all about even.
I wrote this just a bit ago, but our biggest growth is service jobs. Not exactly high paying either.

Point being, my numbers make sense that 5% of our population can afford a home here (in major Metro area) being that median here you're in a shack or renting a room. We added just as many people (from God knows where) as TX did last census so we all aren't leaving yet.

But to answer the poster, jobs and cost of living - anyone else got another idea whey people are moving there?

[lh_newbie]

Originally Posted by DWong

But to answer the poster, jobs and cost of living - anyone else got another idea whey people are moving there?

To be hundred of miles away from you?

[DWong]

Originally Posted by aceplace

Well, you're right about the Grand Canyon being closer to SD, but my DeLorme puts it 8 hours driving time from SD, whereas Dallas is 16 hours to GC. Still pretty accessible from DFW. A closer destination to DFW is Santa Fe and the New Mexico mountain country.
Everything is accessible thanks to DFW and IAH .
Sante Fe from TX is a far trek drive wise.....
Point being in CA, you'll see a little of alot in a short distance - it what makes it unique to it's own. Naturally beautiful, variety like no where in such a short distance.

Glad you like Big Bend and Padre Island. You really should check out Guadalupe and its adjacent park Carlsbad Caverns, though. The Davis mountains state park is definitely worth a trip and the nearby Balmorhea State Park with its natural spring swimming pool is a pleasant diversion. In the Texas Panhandle, Palo Duro Canyon state Park is on a level with a Western National Park, and the Caprock Canyons State Park is actually pretty good and scenic. Texas has some pretty good state parks.
Well, padre wasn't my thing and is for the most part empty. Good for families - LA/SD better for party crowd, which I'm slowly getting to old for. Big Bend is similar to our northern CA parks. Good fact to know.... Mt. Whitney is the highest point in Continetal US.... not to mention we also have the lowest... death valley

I bet it does - I guess here in Socal, in a 1 hour radius I have a beach, forest, lakes, a bay, snow capped moutains, a desert and sand dunes.. anywhere in the world say that? (any geography majors?)

DWong, the median incomes are a real problem for Southern California. It doesn't matter if a California county is more populous than Collin county, its people suffer if they have to pay high prices with similar wages to Texas. Yes, there may be a small group of people with literally no limit to what they can spend on themselves, but even most millionaires have limits to their spending. If you're in a solid financial position in relation to your income and your expenses, you are fortunate.
My wife and I have decent jobs (by no means are we well off), but to say 1in30 people is a small group - well.... to me it's not.
Peolpe here live in smaller spaces (like metros outside of TX), and for not much more. This place like NY, Miami, or Chicago would disapear if cost of living and jobs were the only factor.

If you like San Diego, you should stay there, definitely. Personally, I enjoyed what the city has to offer, but I prefer a larger city with a more diverse offering of things (and adventures). I moved from San Francisco to Dallas because DFW was big enough to replace what I had in SFO, and didn't have the things that annoyed me about SFO.

larger city? SD is about on the same scale density wise as DFW and that's bc of our natural barriers, it feels crowded at times. Well to each his own.... again thesis being, if you can afford to live in SoCal or NoCal - is the bigger house all worth it... it's all preference

[DWong]

Originally Posted by lh_newbie

To be hundred of miles away from you?

hey that wasn't nice

How bout a thought out response. I'll be visiting TX in 3 weeks so we're now neighbors...

[USA_Mom]

Maybe people move HERE because they don't want to be THERE. Like I stated upthread I find it crowded and I didn't like the "rush rush" feeling there, it seemed like there were more superficial people generally there, and I didn't want my kids raised around that. I thought of a few states, but this one gave me the best opportunities in all areas.

[DWong]

Originally Posted by lh_newbie

Actually, even if you provided a reference (other than you quoting it) for the data, it would be irrelevant. Having millionaires in an area doesn't mean they MADE their millions there.

Agreed, they didn't make their millions here. Just the same way alot of $$ in florida didn't come from FL either (NY being the biggest contributor probably).

And the whole wages thing is lame. You quote the median incomes, which are about 4-5% higher. Normalize that data for income tax and sales tax and we're about even. You can't cherry pick one sector and then say your area makes more money. Median incomes show that it's within the margin of error - and doesn't include the state income tax factor.

Agreed. Then y'all property tax offsets it as well. Point being, 4% more income here doesn't help u buy a house here

[aceplace]

The question is not why people are moving out of SoCal, but is actually why so few? You'd think they'd be fleeing like bats out of hell.

One consideration is there is a limited pool of potential buyers. The SoCal society has convinced itself that their houses are worth XXX dollars, but in reality they are worth what a buyer will pay. And there is a shortage of people willing to come in from Kansas or Missouri or wherever and pay the XXX. The only remaining market is local buyers who refuse to leave, and are willing to pay in order to stay.

Why are local buyers willing to buy at outrageous prices? Because of the delusion that house prices will continue to rise to the stratosphere. Perhaps instead of paying 60% of their income on housing, people in the future will be willing and able to pay 70% or 80%. Fat chance.

The local people say that you are paying extra for proximity to a beach, or proximity to mountains. In the case of San Diego, you are paying for a climate in the 70s. But is the price reasonable?

[DWong]

Originally Posted by USA_Mom

Maybe people move HERE because they don't want to be THERE. Like I stated upthread I find it crowded and I didn't like the "rush rush" feeling there, it seemed like there were more superficial people generally there, and I didn't want my kids raised around that. I thought of a few states, but this one gave me the best opportunities in all areas.

I completely agree and CA like NY, Miami, Chi isn't the best place for kids, TX undoubtably by far is.

And for any people migrating to TX is does give you a great deal for the working class family. Crowded in SoCal - hey I've been on the 35 in TX before, seemed crowded as 5 did here. Anyways, we do have places not as crowded a short 25 miles from the city, thing is it's so pricy most can't afford it.

[DWong]

Originally Posted by aceplace

The question is not why people are moving out of SoCal, but is actually why so few? You'd think they'd be fleeing like bats out of hell.

One consideration is there is a limited pool of potential buyers. The SoCal society has convinced itself that their houses are worth XXX dollars, but in reality they are worth what a buyer will pay. And there is a shortage of people willing to come in from Kansas or Missouri or wherever and pay the XXX. The only remaining market is local buyers who refuse to leave, and are willing to pay in order to stay.

Why are local buyers willing to buy at outrageous prices? Because of the delusion that house prices will continue to rise to the stratosphere. Perhaps instead of paying 60% of their income on housing, people in the future will be willing and able to pay 70% or 80%. Fat chance.

Rise as they did 25 years ago they will again, it's just life down here. Then again, most people here rent (anyone find the % of owners/renters here?) I'm sure it's outrageous.

I have a close friend from the area living in a $189k house sold it, making decent salary come here to rent a room for 2 years. It's all how you choose to live.

I think people will have a hard time getting approved for a loan that gobbles 70% of their income, so I don't think or hope that's not happening.

[aceplace]

Originally Posted by DWong

Rise as they did 25 years ago they will again, it's just life down here. Then again, most people here rent (anyone find the % of owners/renters here?) I'm sure it's outrageous.

I have a close friend from the area living in a $189k house sold it, making decent salary come here to rent a room for 2 years. It's all how you choose to live.

I think people will have a hard time getting approved for a loan that gobbles 70% of their income, so I don't think or hope that's not happening.

There were some news articles today about renters being forced out of their houses when a bank forecloses on the house owner.

The percentage of the population that can actually qualify for one of these overpriced houses is getting smaller and smaller. The opportunity to strike it rich by selling one of these houses is being possible for fewer and fewer people. Because fewer and fewer people can afford to be buyers. Sort of like a classic Ponzi scheme.

For those unfamiliar with the reference, a Ponzi scheme is something like an investment scam where the initial investors in the scam are paid out of the money from those who invest later. Eventually the scam runs out of money when it runs out of suckers. The California housing scam will collapse since there will be fewer and fewer individuals able to funnel money into the houses, and the price appreciation will evaporate.

Or maybe not. We could just as easily have a vicious cycle of bubbles followed by corrective bursts, with a new crop of sadder and wiser fools at the inevitable end of each cycle.