Des Moines' population growth outpaces state, Midwest (Dubuque, Janesville: how much, assessment)

[atler8]

"I recall when I lived in Chicago in the mid-1970's the rampant "tribalism", as it's being called here, that was evident as that city tried to move past the Second City moniker & actually beat out L.A. to truly remain the second city.
When the Chicago Symphony Orchestra under the guidance of conductor Sir George Solti was suddenly recognized world wide as the world's greatest orchestra, the city went nuts. Something like 50-60,000 people crowded into the Woodfield Mall to welcome them home from a triumphant European tour that had burnished the orchestra's reputation.
Speaking of Woodfield Mall, every Chicagoan was happy to let you know that the newly constructed mall was the world's largest.
When construction of the Sears Tower was announced & it was to be the tallest building in the world, the city once again popped it's cork in joy that it could top New York & take the"tallest" tower title.
I could go on but you get the point. Even the large cities can have heir own level of insecurity & a need for reinforcement or affirmation that they are vaild as a center of this or that. Often, to my chagrin, they had to make their point by making fun of Iowa.
I remember the time on an inbound United Flight about to land in Des Moines, an attendant from the Chicago-based crew made a crack over the intercom system about how exciting Des Moines was. I would never sit still & let her get away with that type of remark today because I know where it comes from & that it is just c**p.

[tollfree]

Notice they never break down the percentage of race in these population growth statistics, might be too many Hispanics. They always leave that out.

[funksoulbro]

Originally Posted by atler8

I remember the time on an inbound United Flight about to land in Des Moines, an attendant from the Chicago-based crew made a crack over the intercom system about how exciting Des Moines was. I would never sit still & let her get away with that type of remark today because I know where it comes from & that it is just c**p.

A crack? You mean as in a "joke" or statement of obvious comedic jest?

Yeah...I'm sensing all the Des Moines people here can't take a joke. At all. They'd rather get sanctimonious and judgmental, then once that combination of emotions get old, they'll switch to the good ol' self-righteous indignation.

[GraniteStater]

Originally Posted by steel03

It has grown more since 2010 than all of those cities.

Based on 2010-2012 MSA population change:
Des Moines: +3.40%
Madison: +2.53%
Omaha: +2.34%
Minneapolis: +2.19%

That percentage growth rate is incorrect for Madison even with Columbia County included.

[atler8]

I just found a census bureau estimate for early 2012 that gave metro Des Moines a population increase of 17,500 & Madison to that same time point an increase of 11,000.
I also found a July 2013 estimate that said that metro Des Moines was up 3.4% to 588,999. The metro Madison data is somewhat skewered for July 2013 because the bureau also then included metro Janesville/Beloit in a combined Madison MSA. It was up 15,300 for a rate of 2.53% increase. The inclusion of Rock County (J'ville/Beloit) data had pushed the total up to almost 621,000.
All of this was from the U.S. Bureau of the Census.

[atler8]

No, it was not a joke but rather a crack made with the intent to denigrate us hick, small town & small city Iowans. I was on the flight and there was a general look of embarrassment on the faces of many of the passengers as nobody had the chutzpah to speak up & put the flight attendant in her place. Better believe it, I would do so now!
As I explained here earlier, when I lived in metro Chicago I constantly had to deal with all of the myriad of versions of Iowa put downs & gradually came to realize that it was largely due to their own insecurities about Chicago & their own lives.
You are projecting here that it is was a joke probably because you want it to have been one so as to strengthen some point you want to make about Des Moines but it's a situation that you did not repeatedly experience apparently.
For decades, Iowans have had to put up with being made fun of & if you don't know that & lived here or traveled, then you were not paying attention.

[geog-fanatic]

Originally Posted by RonnieJonez

Chicago, which could actually make the claim of being on NYC/LA level, for the most part, knows it's not quite there (mainly due to being in the midwest). You do meet people who think it's the greatest place on earth, but there isn't nearly the same level of civic fanaticism that mid-sized cities have.

I guess my question to this is ... so what? I have been reading your posts for a long time in this forum, and I also see you pop in to the Omaha forum on occasion with similar statements. Now, I do understand where you are coming from and have personally witnessed the enthusiasm these people have for their cities. However, I don't see the problem with it. Okay, so they gush a little about their art museums, zoos, and other cultural activities, like the State Fair. Why does it matter if they are not on the same scale as similar establishments in New York, Chicago, or LA? The locals like them, and they are proud to have these entertainment options in their cities. Wouldn't you think the average person looking for a better life would rather settle down in a community full of people that are very happy to list out all the positives they see instead of a community full of chronic complainers that gripe about everything? Maybe those positives are not always on par with the options in a larger city, but for many, there is a big trade-off when you consider the overwhelming number of negatives that come with big city living.

My own personal experience comes from Atlanta. For example, every time I attempt to go into the heart of the city to do something "cultural", I first have to face the annoying traffic to get there. Then, once I'm there, I have to find somewhere to park, which usually costs a minimum of $10 for a secure location (and more for special events). Next, I typically have to stand in line to get into the place I'm going (e.g. The High Museum of Art, The GA Aquarium, etc). By the way, the costs for these entertainment options are also much higher than similar venues in the mid-sized cities. Once I'm inside said location, I have to stand in crowds, sometimes 3 people deep, in order to try and see what I paid so much to see. At the same time, the other people in the crowds are becoming more negative and ranting about how crowded it is and how unimpressed they are. I'm sure you can imagine that this would take away from the experience. When I go to similar places in the smaller Midwest cities, I do not have to fight the rude crowds, and most everyone seems very happy to be there. This alone makes the experience better, even if it is on a slightly different cultural scale.

In other words, I think I would relish the thought of living somewhere with a greater sense of community pride. Such behaviors tend to feed into other things, like cleaner streets, better walkable cities, and even small aesthetic improvements that give the community a nicer feel. I really want to understand why this "Narnian" behavior, as you call it, is so problematic.

[tollfree]

It makes for good vaudeville. Most mid-sized cities have reached a cult-status that not even Scientology is near, and it's unknown to the world which makes it interesting.

I also think it only occurs in the US. European & South American mid-sized cities are not like this.

[Drewjdeg]

Originally Posted by atler8

Drew
You are making assumptions here as to the op's original intent by missing that the thread title came from the newspaper article out of the Des Moines Register that supplied the basis for the op's thread. It is based on a census bureau estimate, purely & simply, not a wishful figment of someone's imagination here.
When the latest nationwide data recently became available, all across the country newspapers were full of new census estimate info & threads on the topic popped up on city-data. I even ventured to look at a population estimate thread here out of West Virginia as well as one on the Twin Cities. So, it was not a thread title for an uncommon topic dreamt up by someone here at the forum who was "cocky".
Have you not seen all of the other threads from other states & cities that talk about their own superlatives? If you spend time here, you will also see that problems & issues are also brought up in thread topics so it's not as if it's only some sort of Shangri-La-only forum.
Also, from the most current data, the city proper of Des Moines is growing slower than both Madison & Omaha but, hold onto your hats, you who are naysayers here as looking at the growth in metro Des Moines on a percentage basis, you may be surprised to learn that during the decade from 2000-2010, it grew 18.3% and was the 28th fastest growing of the 100 largest metros in the country. During that same decade, metro Omaha only grew 12.8% for a rank of 49th, metro Madison grew 13.3% for a rank of 46th & metro Minneapolis/St. Paul grew 10.5% for a rank of 56th.
Not bad at all for a small place in "Flyoverland" called metro Des Moines!

Yes, but at what point does it sway from a simple analysis of the facts to some type of boosting contest where a city is compared and perceived as the winner because it had a larger percent of growth within the MSA. Honestly, des moines is growing, that's great news and I'm happy to see Des Moines success but at what point does this just become stupid. This thread has turned from des moines population growth to Des Moines vs Madison. Does it really matter all that much? Lol

[atler8]

Well said, geog...
I'm in metro Atlanta too & I said said earlier in this thread, I never would have left Des Moines well over 30 years ago if I'd known what I would eventually think of the rat race in Atlanta & Georgia. I won't even attempt to go into the various issues that now make me rue my choice to relocate in 1979.
My appreciation of metro Des Moines is far higher now than it ever was when I grew up in Iowa & eventually moved to Des Moines.
My goal is to eventually retire to Des Moines or a university city in the state or even in a beautiful Mississippi River bluff setting in Dubuque.
As for Mr. Jonez who you were addressing, & now Jonezx2, no matter which Des Moines or Iowa thread he enters into, he always manages to achieve a manipulation of the topic over to his viewpoint where he can tell us everything that is wrong, cultish & small-minded about Des Moines & Iowa. You'd think that he would have new material or have moved on by now. Bu some folks are just that way. We all grew up with classmates who were like that.
I'm appreciative that an outsider has now called him on this & can see through his game.