Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Education
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 06-23-2023, 10:59 AM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,780 posts, read 24,289,888 times
Reputation: 32918

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by StealthRabbit View Post
Hint... it won't come from a very 'comfortable' academia who has led us down this rabbit hole.
It seems to NOT be parents, who have followed the Piped Piper into this trap.

Not convinced that government intervention for career direction is a win. (having lived in Singapore where the Government significantly influences career and academic choice (?) And just spent a few months with EU grads who are none too happy with their government 'skilled trades' tracts.

The answer, I'm afraid... rests with the student (as it always has in USA).

Due Diligence is not a 'subject', but is very important in decision making. (EDU, HC, investment, career, spouse!!!, kids...)

Equip your kids, grandkids, neighbors, and students, the decision(s) is theirs. It can be well informed, we are not lacking for data.
We aren't Singapore.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 06-23-2023, 11:14 AM
 
Location: western NY
6,430 posts, read 3,137,370 times
Reputation: 10085
The way I see it, the "trades" aren't heavily promoted, because in this day and age, working with your hands isn't glamorous. Therefore, everyone wants to sit behind a computer screen/keyboard, and make their living. They have yet to learn that the computer won't work without electricity or connectivity to the 'net, so without a tradesman to hook them up, they're going nowhere.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-23-2023, 12:36 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,780 posts, read 24,289,888 times
Reputation: 32918
Thinking back on this whole discussion:

Why exactly should any school heavily promote themselves? If I want to be an electrician or a welder...I should go out and find the best education available for what I want.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-23-2023, 01:31 PM
 
Location: Shawnee-on-Delaware, PA
8,060 posts, read 7,429,348 times
Reputation: 16314
Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
Thinking back on this whole discussion:

Why exactly should any school heavily promote themselves? If I want to be an electrician or a welder...I should go out and find the best education available for what I want.
OK, but why are the rich and powerful people who run our society exclusively promoting college? Why is it only Mike Rowe out there promoting trade school? Why is "tuition money for college" promoted as the best reason to join the military?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-23-2023, 01:35 PM
 
28,664 posts, read 18,775,862 times
Reputation: 30944
Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
Thinking back on this whole discussion:

Why exactly should any school heavily promote themselves? If I want to be an electrician or a welder...I should go out and find the best education available for what I want.
You won't want it unless someone tells you about it. You're not going to choose something you don't know about.

Like everything, it's got to be effectively marketed. Government (including public schools), the education industry, and the banks have been heavily marketing a bachelor's degree to the exclusion of anything else for the last 50 years.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-23-2023, 01:37 PM
 
28,664 posts, read 18,775,862 times
Reputation: 30944
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtab4994 View Post
Why is "tuition money for college" promoted as the best reason to join the military?
And a whole lot of veterans don't even know--it's not advertised--that the GI Bill will also pay for trade school and technical certification testing.

Last edited by Ralph_Kirk; 06-23-2023 at 02:40 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-23-2023, 02:25 PM
 
12,837 posts, read 9,041,939 times
Reputation: 34899
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph_Kirk View Post
You won't want it unless someone tells you about it. You're not going to choose something you don't know about.

Like everything, it's got to be effectively marketed. Government (including public schools), the education industry, and the banks have been heavily marketing a bachelor's degree to the exclusion of anything else for the last 50 years.
When looking at this, I'm not sure government, other than the Education Department, has pushed college that much. Even going back to when I was a kid, it was the education industry, which includes public and private schools, education publishing, and academia in general, that pushed college for everyone. For the past 50 years the job of academia (school and college) has been to prepare students for a job in academia (school and college). It has not been to prepare students for the world of work.

But yes academia has effectively marketed itself for those 50 years. I remember getting book covers even in elementary school that explained the advantages of college. Parents have been drilled from their own days in elementary school that their kids need to go to college. It's taken a couple of generations to drill that in there, but it's there now and hard to even discuss that not every kid is best served by college.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-23-2023, 02:39 PM
 
28,664 posts, read 18,775,862 times
Reputation: 30944
Quote:
Originally Posted by tnff View Post
When looking at this, I'm not sure government, other than the Education Department, has pushed college that much. Even going back to when I was a kid, it was the education industry, which includes public and private schools, education publishing, and academia in general, that pushed college for everyone.
Public schools and their faculties are agents of the government...the Supreme Court has said so. They're not the same entity as the education industry, although they are certainly emotionally tied to it.

Quote:
For the past 50 years the job of academia (school and college) has been to prepare students for a job in academia (school and college). It has not been to prepare students for the world of work. But yes academia has effectively marketed itself for those 50 years. I remember getting book covers even in elementary school that explained the advantages of college. Parents have been drilled from their own days in elementary school that their kids need to go to college. It's taken a couple of generations to drill that in there, but it's there now and hard to even discuss that not every kid is best served by college.
Yeah, that's my point. I observed that transition happening while I was in school in the latter 60s into the early 70s. The "No Child Left Behind" program actually penalized schools that had vocational tracks.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-23-2023, 03:13 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,780 posts, read 24,289,888 times
Reputation: 32918
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtab4994 View Post
OK, but why are the rich and powerful people who run our society exclusively promoting college? Why is it only Mike Rowe out there promoting trade school? Why is "tuition money for college" promoted as the best reason to join the military?
It's just people stating their opinion...just as you and I are.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-23-2023, 03:14 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,780 posts, read 24,289,888 times
Reputation: 32918
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph_Kirk View Post
You won't want it unless someone tells you about it. You're not going to choose something you don't know about.

Like everything, it's got to be effectively marketed. Government (including public schools), the education industry, and the banks have been heavily marketing a bachelor's degree to the exclusion of anything else for the last 50 years.
Okay...so people who are hiring want a certain qualification, and they state what that qualification or qualifications is/are. They're the people hiring. They get to decide who they want to hire. What is so complex about that?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Education

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top