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I really can’t see any more of my pay check given to the government. Do you see how the government runs things already!?! I certainly don’t want my healthcare ran by them.
Who is paying for this anyways? Doesn’t Canada have insanely long wait times to see doctors?
There's a silent, non-violent civil war going, it's been going on for some time now, with polarization. It's also happening in other countries in the world, notably Poland.
An imaginary wall has been created, you stay on your side of the wall, I'll stay on mine.
I've lost a number of relatives and long-standing friends over the last 3-4 years and let them stay on their side of the wall, I want nothing to do with them. In fact, ever again!
Even in my 55+ community, there's a notable division. I told one of my neighbors of whom her other neighbor supported and? I'll never talk to her again! Up goes the wall.
Another poster suggest the possibility of secessions and I think that's the best idea out there today. CA is the same size as Germany, which stands alone, and TX is much bigger than France, so why are we keeping 50 states together when it not necessary.
If you're talking about a physical civil war, this would prevent that. The Blue West Coast states I all but view as foreign countries, and I'm sure others feel the same way, so let's them unite and call the country Pacifica.
I personally try and distant myself from people who aren’t on the same page politically as myself.
I really can’t see any more of my pay check given to the government. Do you see how the government runs things already!?! I certainly don’t want my healthcare ran by them.
Who is paying for this anyways? Doesn’t Canada have insanely long wait times to see doctors?
No. Years ago, I took my family on a trip to the Maritime Provinces of Canada. My son became ill with stomach problems in the province of New Brunswick. I took him to a clinic and the doctor there was concerned enough to admit him to the local hospital. All this took place in an hour or two. There was no waiting for diagnostic tests including a CT scan of his abdomen. After three days, his problems were resolved and he was discharged from the hospital. Since I was an American I had to pay the bill in full for the doctor and the hospital. Total cost to me for his three full days of hospitalization? About $3,500.00. In America, that would have been $30,000.00.
Canadian healthcare is not perfect, but I sure get tired of "brilliant Americans" who are just sure it is "second rate" or "untrustworthy". Its on par with what we get in America, but cheaper.
Harris is on the record for stating that she'd support abolishing the electoral college. As are Elizabeth Warren, Beto O'Rourke, Bernie Sanders and Pete Buttigieg.
As were over two-thirds of all Americans, regardless of party affiliation, throughout almost the entirety of the 20th Century.
This is more divided along party lines. Doing away with the electoral college would give the power to the mostly democrat run cities over the conservative rural areas. And that is what the electoral college prevents. And as a Constitutional Patriot preventing that is a good thing.
This is more divided along party lines. Doing away with the electoral college would give the power to the mostly democrat run cities over the conservative rural areas. And that is what the electoral college prevents. And as a Constitutional Patriot preventing that is a good thing.
First: [mod edit: Don't even post abbreviated profanity on this forum.] is a "Constitutional Patriot?"
Second: But that's the problem. You asked for links proving my assertion and I did. Personally, I put a lot more stock in how the vast majority of Americans, regardless of party, felt about the EC from the late 1940s through early 2016 than I do about how things have shaped up in just four years. All the links you posted just show how things have changed relatively recently. But we know that. And that's my point. Most of these people now defending the EC weren't doing so in 1950, or 1970, or 1990, or even in 2001. It's only now.
I know this because I've personally felt pretty strongly about EC abolition for quite a while. I can remember talking about it in the '90s. Lot's of people agreed, lot's of people didn't have strong feelings one way or another. There were a few people who wanted to preserve simply based on tradition, but there was certainly no, "But I don't want those city folks tellin' us rural people what to do" arguments being made. This just seems like a way for justification to me. And this was also during my staunchly conservative, card-carrying Republican days, so it wasn't like I was just insulating myself with like-minded fellows.
Last edited by Rachel NewYork; 09-28-2020 at 06:15 PM..
No. Years ago, I took my family on a trip to the Maritime Provinces of Canada. My son became ill with stomach problems in the province of New Brunswick. I took him to a clinic and the doctor there was concerned enough to admit him to the local hospital. All this took place in an hour or two. There was no waiting for diagnostic tests including a CT scan of his abdomen. After three days, his problems were resolved and he was discharged from the hospital. Since I was an American I had to pay the bill in full for the doctor and the hospital. Total cost to me for his three full days of hospitalization? About $3,500.00. In America, that would have been $30,000.00.
Canadian healthcare is not perfect, but I sure get tired of "brilliant Americans" who are just sure it is "second rate" or "untrustworthy". Its on par with what we get in America, but cheaper.
Canadian healthcare is affordable because of 30-40% provincial and national taxes on everything. Also, they rely on U.S. to be the "healthcare locomotive" that they can benefit from American medical inventions and innovation. Most medical innovation by the way happens in the U.S.
Also, for years the Canadians have come into the U.S. to get timely medical care, despite the higher cost. If you have an elective or non-critical surgery, you can wait weeks if not months in Canada, whereas in the U.S. the wait is far shorter (assuming you're not super picky about which surgeon, etc.).
Quote:
Originally Posted by djsuperfly
As were over two-thirds of all Americans, regardless of party affiliation, throughout almost the entirety of the 20th Century.
Regarding Electoral College: these polls are mostly meaningless, because most people don't even know what the EC is. Most people probably couldn't tell you what the First Amendment is. Nor could they tell you where and when the Declaration of Independence was signed, nor who signed it (even just the top 2-3 names). Probably 50% of Americans would struggle to name the first President.
Now suppose Hillary had won the EC but lost the popular vote in 2016. Would those same 2/3 of people polled still say "Oh yes the EC is terrible and we must abolish it!" I HIGHLY DOUBT IT.
Canadian healthcare is affordable because of 30-40% provincial and national taxes on everything. Also, they rely on U.S. to be the "healthcare locomotive" that they can benefit from American medical inventions and innovation. Most medical innovation by the way happens in the U.S.
Okay, take what you pay in all taxes: federal, state, property, sales tax, etc. Now add in all healthcare premiums, deductibles, co-pays, etc. (If you had student loans, don't forget to throw those in too.) I'm going to go ahead and bet that that number is higher than 40% of your income. I know it is for me.
Quote:
Also, for years the Canadians have come into the U.S. to get timely medical care, despite the higher cost. If you have an elective or non-critical surgery, you can wait weeks if not months in Canada, whereas in the U.S. the wait is far shorter (assuming you're not super picky about which surgeon, etc.).
As a resource with obvious limitations on the supply side (time, number of providers, etc.), it's not possible to have a perfect healthcare system. Now in nations like Canada where there is more demand due to the affordability, those limitations do force prioritization of more critical issues. In the U.S., we've simply decided to deal with it by reducing demand through price constraints.
Additionally, that waiting forever for elective surgeries is a bit overblown due to resource issues. Yes, if you live in the middle of nowhere in Saskatchewan that is true. It's not nearly so true if you live in suburban Toronto simply due to the much larger number of facilities and providers.
As for the part about Canada leaching off the U.S. system of innovation, it works both ways. They also lose a lot of their medical providers, especially the foreign-born, due to the fact that they can receive cheap training in Canada and then move to the U.S. to make more money.
Quote:
Regarding Electoral College: these polls are mostly meaningless, because most people don't even know what the EC is. Most people probably couldn't tell you what the First Amendment is. Nor could they tell you where and when the Declaration of Independence was signed, nor who signed it (even just the top 2-3 names). Probably 50% of Americans would struggle to name the first President.
Now suppose Hillary had won the EC but lost the popular vote in 2016. Would those same 2/3 of people polled still say "Oh yes the EC is terrible and we must abolish it!" I HIGHLY DOUBT IT.
Cheers,
Blister
Meh. I'd argue that Gallup began those polls in the late-1940s when I'd venture to say Americans were far more knowledgeable on the subject and were demonstrably more politically engaged. But, frankly, even if that isn't the case, I don't think it really matters. Sure, some/many many not exactly understand how the EC works (although I'd certainly argue that that is definitively not a point in the EC's favor), but they do understand that the EC is not "one-person-one-vote."
As to the last part, maybe/maybe not. It seems in this polarized environment that so many are willing to sacrifice their beliefs and standards just to see their side "win." Personally, I believe in standing by convictions, even if that may mean your preferred viewpoint loses repeatedly, but I realize I may be in an increasing minority with that.
I will say that if your scenario came to pass that it would have meant that in 16 years (5 elections) each party would have been bitten by the EC once a piece, so it possibly could have created a groundswell of bipartisan opposition to the EC, but, who knows? The interesting thing, though, is that the 2000 election did cause a slight, temporary decrease in Republican support for the EC (although not huge). It's only in the wake of the 2016 election that the EC, like nearly everything else in America, has become a partisan issue.
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