How about this "Minnesota Ice" vs. "Minnesota Nice" stuff?? (Minneapolis: wedding, school)

[Camden Northsider]

Just wanted to mention- part of why this whole generalization has always been somewhat absurd to me is due to the high amount of transplants to this state from various states and/or countries as a result of its reputation of being a very accepting and welcoming state. Two specific groups come to mind (outside of half the population of my generation from SD and a number of other groups):

(1) persons in need of alcohol and drug treatment from around the country and all walks of life, albeit this population often creates communities of their own through AA and other programs; and
(2) the East African (and more specifically Somali) population in Minneapolis (not to mention other immigrant populations of Hmong & Hispanic persons)- interestingly, a large part of why so many Somalis ended up settling here was due to a number of groups originally encountering extreme intolerance in places like San Diego, Atlanta, Maine (not sure what the draw there was), etc. vs. the acceptance and civility found in MN. Part of why Minneapolis has the largest Somali population of any city in the world outside of Mogadishu, Minnesota is due to it having a high "secondary migration" (persons originally settling in other areas but choosing to migrate to another state) rate of refugees- they come here because others like them have been very successful in gaining employment, starting small businesses, and generally being able to support their families and make a better life for themselves (and they have fit in well with the MN ethics of hard work and friendliness)- so much so that Minneapolis has become a model for cities throughout the world in integrating/ resettling its refugee and immigrant populations into (and thus improving) the local social fabric, and helping them to have ownership of their communities (local leaders, both Somali and native-born MNans, are often asked to travel to other countries/ cities where they haven't done so well with this issue- MN leaders will be presenting at an upcoming conference in Sweden this fall on this very topic).

One thing also comes to mind about the above groups- they all came to MN extremely motivated to create a better live for themselves, which may have impacted their overall attitude and desire to succeed here.

[rgb123]

camden...those are all good points. But, that doesn't really have much to do with making friends.

MN is a good place to go and make a life for yourself...even better if you can take your family with you.

People will accept you and live next door to you. And be nice to you. But it doesn't mean a friendship will develop.

[Camden Northsider]

I don't get it- I'd like to know where everyone is living and/or working (or spending their free time) that is having this issue- when we moved to our current neighborhood, we quickly became friends with several of our neighbors- and yes, we are "real" friends that hang out with each other on a regular basis, dogsit and share house-keys with eachother, etc. I've become "real" friends with people represented in the groups I've talked about in my above post since coming here through work activities, and my native-born/raised MNan coworkers have not only also befriended me and now my wife, but introduced us to people (that we have also become friends with) in their long-time social circles as well (and we have done the same). This doesn't even mention the relationships we've developed with people involved with our neighborhood association, other committees/ volunteer activities we're a part of, etc.- and we still maintain our college friendships (and a couple of high school as well) with people that live in the cities. However, I would never have expected anyone to go out of their way to sympathy-befriend me because I wasn't from here - that would seem really artificial and strained, although we ourselves may be guilty of having done this on occassion...I think people just need to be active, quit feeling sorry for themselves, and just put themselves out there you know?

[cityrover]

It is not a discount but rather a scope check of what small moves vs big moves are really like. There are exceptions to every case but generally the more away from your comfort zone you are, the harder and weirder things are.

While it's all relative, there are general trends that make certain aspects easier or harder. It doesn't mean it is ill mannered either; maybe just lack of awereness of how specific actions are viewed.

Originally Posted by uptown_urbanist

Me? Moved "for real?" Yep, done that, assuming you mean several times across the country, as well as various point in between. That includes a small town, a suburb, and multiple cities of varying sizes and with varying level of transplants. I know what it's like to move somewhere new and have to work to meet someone. I don't think these issues are Minnesota-specific, and I agree with Camden that in the city of Minneapolis, at least, you run across many, many people who are not originally from Minnesota, or even from the USA, for that matter. I haven't done an international move, at least not yet, but I would imagine that someone who has moved, say, to China could look at someone who made the move from New Jersey to Arizona and scoff "you think that's a move? What are you complaining about?" Some moves are harder than others, but any relocation to a new city comes with a learning curve. To discount the difficulties in making a relatively short move is to overlook the fact that people are still forced to meet an entirely new group of local friends. Three hours away is short enough to still see from time to time on weekends, but isn't exactly local, either.

I think is safe to say that there are some pretty big differences between life in Minneapolis and life in, say, Minot, North Dakota. I had far greater culture shock moving to a small Virginia town than I did to any of the multiple cities I've lived in. I agree that those who haven't experienced a move should make an effort to understand why it can be hard, and to reach out where possible to new arrivals, but again, difficulties with finding new friends can happen anywhere, and not everyone in the Twin Cities is either a native or is "booked up" with friends.

[Senor Boogie Woogie]

My father is from Iowa, but moved to Tennessee nearly 50 years ago. he was an airline pilot with the now defunct Northwest Airlines (NWA) out of Memphis.

Every year, my father had to do training in Minneapolis, and he just loathed going there. He thought the people were the biggest jerks ever. He just hated the place.

[rgb123]

Originally Posted by cityrover

It is not a discount but rather a scope check of what small moves vs big moves are really like. There are exceptions to every case but generally the more away from your comfort zone you are, the harder and weirder things are.

While it's all relative, there are general trends that make certain aspects easier or harder. It doesn't mean it is ill mannered either; maybe just lack of awereness of how specific actions are viewed.

this is SO true. Moving to Texas for me was like moving to a foreign country! Going to school in Minnesota was easy by comparison because not only was it in an easier driving distance to home....there are regionalisms that the two places have in common.

When you move to an entirely different region, you are going outside your comfort zone. Even little things....different grocery stores, different restaraunt chains....rules of the road, it all adds up to seem like another planet.

I think over time it can really wear a person down...when absolutley nothing is familiar to you, your brain just starts to short circuit or something.

I've moved around enough to understand this....and even if I am happy in a place (for example, California is my kind of place and I enjoyed living there and would love to live there again) I felt the need to get on a plane or in my car and GO HOME...not just to see friends or family. But to drive on familiar roads...to know exactly where I was going no matter what direction I turned...to see the trees, the earth...everything I "knew" just to register it in my brain and feel connected again.

It may sound crazy to people who have not had these kinds of experiences. But it all adds up.

[uptown_urbanist]

The thing is, live somewhere long enough and the new roads DO become familiar, the restaurants become familiar, the place becomes "home." For me it typically takes about a year to feel at home in a place, as once you start to head into year #2 you've been through all the seasons, you have developed routines, you have your favorite spots, you know your way around, you have a doctor, a pharmacy, a library card, maybe you volunteer somewhere, you've voted, if you have a garden you've started to figure out what works and doesn't work in the new climate, etc. It becomes "home," or at least a second "home." (the Pew Research people call those with loyalties to two places, often people who have relocated from one place to another but feel connected to both, as "dual loyalists." I can relate. Interestingly, dual loyalists are also more likely to be involved with their adopted communities. Interesting stuff)

[applesoranges]

People in the South and even Colorado, having lived in these places, are much more friendly, laid back and HAPPY than the people in the upper midwest, who are cliquie and judge people. I too, loath living or even coming to the upper midwest, not fun, BORING as heck.

[Isabel_009]

There is much unintended irony in your post. And it is instructive in that it serves to remind people -- like myself -- to take the gross generalizations they read here with a big heap of salt. The people who think that all people in a geographic region are "not fun", "boring", "cliquie", and "judgemental", may have their own baggage which skews their perception.

Anyway, I look forward to moving to Minneapolis in less than two weeks and drawing my own conclusions, although I will try not to jump to any. The people I have "met" on this site have been very friendly and helpful, so it gives me hope.

Originally Posted by applesoranges

People in the South and even Colorado, having lived in these places, are much more friendly, laid back and HAPPY than the people in the upper midwest, who are cliquie and judge people. I too, loath living or even coming to the upper midwest, not fun, BORING as heck.

[Oscar25]

Anywhere you are if you go looking for "nice", you will be greatly dissapointed. There are good and bad people everywhere and Minnesota is no exception. It will be hard for anybody to move to a new city with no family member or close friend. You will just struggle period because people will wonder why you are so eager to make friends. Everyone everywhere is just extra cautious and rightfully so. Its can be a dangerous world full of angels, wolfs, good samaritans and parasites.