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I agree. And I would never spend $1800 for an apartment. This city is very expensive but you dont need 120K to live here (I'm assuming you were talking about a single person). I believe you can make it on 60K even 50K if you have no debt and no dependants and living in the outer boroughs of course.
I don't believe you have to spend a lot for entertainment either thanks to living social and groupon.
This reminds of an old thread where the OP said something like "why would someone live here if they couldn't afford to see broadway plays". Not everyone likes that or expensive restaurants.
^^^^ this. Most people make somewhere around 50-60K, NOT 120K lol. You can live pretty comfortably on that, admittedly maybe not perfectly but it most certainly can be done. Staying debt-free is the name of the game if you have a modest income. You can find decent apartments for $1200 if you are willing to stay out of the trendy areas. Combine that with not having a car and you offset most of the cost. And there are always cheap fun things to do, all over the city (many of which may be far more fun than a Broadway show). If you are creative and not caught up in glitz and glam you can fare just fine on 50-60K. Don't believe the hype. 120K may apply if you were to live solo in Manhattan. I personally have grown fond of outer borough living. It is much calmer and I can actually sleep at night, don't have to wait on line for 10-15 minutes for a simple overpriced tube of toothpaste lol. I don't think I would want to do Manhattan again, even if I broke six figures. It's too crazy now. It's just not worth it to throw away on rent, not worth it for what you get in return. Spending $2,500-3,000+ doesn't make sense to me unless you're a millionaire or very close to it. I'd rather put my money in my Roth IRA and take a few vacations a year. So it makes sense for some to stay here, the ones who don't fall for gimmicks and the marketing machine. Once you've been here a few years it starts to amaze you how gullible all of the newcomers (my former self included) are.
I know the reality is that I probably will be making around 80-90K for some time and am very average (maybe slightly above but that's probably what everyone thinks of themselves lol). That doesn't bother me, I work hard but also live pretty well. Now, if I was a person making 35K with student loan/credit card debt I'd probably GTFO lol. I lived on about that for awhile when I first got here and still, to this day, am fairly sure I have some mild form of PTSD from it. It was rough but I had to keep going as I knew I'd have to as NYC is the capital of my industry and where my professional future was/is at. All depends why you're here and what your game plan is. It is a really difficult place to stay if you can't find a way to break that 50K threshold. I think that is why so many people leave. You can only endure that kind of hardship for so long before it eats away at you.
Last edited by EastBoundandDownChick; 09-05-2013 at 08:08 PM..
I agree. And I would never spend $1800 for an apartment. This city is very expensive but you dont need 120K to live here (I'm assuming you were talking about a single person). I believe you can make it on 60K even 50K if you have no debt and no dependants and living in the outer boroughs of course.
I don't believe you have to spend a lot for entertainment either thanks to living social and groupon.
This reminds of an old thread where the OP said something like "why would someone live here if they couldn't afford to see broadway plays". Not everyone likes that or expensive restaurants.
u can prolly make it on even 30k, the question is QOL is subpar
^^^^ this. Most people make somewhere around 50-60K, NOT 120K lol. You can live pretty comfortably on that, admittedly maybe not perfectly but it most certainly can be done. Staying debt-free is the name of the game if you have a modest income. You can find decent apartments for $1200 if you are willing to stay out of the trendy areas. Combine that with not having a car and you offset most of the cost. And there are always cheap fun things to do, all over the city (many of which may be far more fun than a Broadway show). If you are creative and not caught up in glitz and glam you can fare just fine on 50-60K. Don't believe the hype. 120K may apply if you were to live solo in Manhattan. I personally have grown fond of outer borough living. It is much calmer and I can actually sleep at night, don't have to wait on line for 10-15 minutes for a simple overpriced tube of toothpaste lol. I don't think I would want to do Manhattan again, even if I broke six figures. It's too crazy now. It's just not worth it to throw away on rent, not worth it for what you get in return. Spending $2,500-3,000+ doesn't make sense to me unless you're a millionaire or very close to it. I'd rather put my money in my Roth IRA and take a few vacations a year. So it makes sense for some to stay here, the ones who don't fall for gimmicks and the marketing machine. Once you've been here a few years it starts to amaze you how gullible all of the newcomers (my former self included) are.
I know the reality is that I probably will be making around 80-90K for some time and am very average (maybe slightly above but that's probably what everyone thinks of themselves lol). That doesn't bother me, I work hard but also live pretty well. Now, if I was a person making 35K with student loan/credit card debt I'd probably GTFO lol. I lived on about that for awhile when I first got here and still, to this day, am fairly sure I have some mild form of PTSD from it. It was rough but I had to keep going as I knew I'd have to as NYC is the capital of my industry and where my professional future was/is at. All depends why you're here and what your game plan is. It is a really difficult place to stay if you can't find a way to break that 50K threshold. I think that is why so many people leave. You can only endure that kind of hardship for so long before it eats away at you.
not even talkin bout soho
i live in nj and decent apts in decent areas here with parking, laundry in unit are $1800+
its all bout wat ur willing to sacrifice i suppose
By average I mean everyone except rich. I might be missing someth, but unless one makes 120k+ a yr, which is actually middle class here, even in the outer boroughs and suburbs, what's the point of living here? Most people don't make that much so why are they still here? Quality of life is an arguable concept, but standard of living is not, and it is quite low around here. I can understand if you prefer NYC to other cities because of unique things it offers, BUT when you don't have much money, you can't use those amenities anyway so what's the point? I don't really understand all the people who are not stuck here due to families or what not choosing to live in such subpar living conditions. Is it because they haven't traveled around this country to see how much easier life can be or scared to leave or what? This includes NYC suburbs too, which don't really offer a way out cuz they are also overpriced and overcrowded. Bad quality of housing and small amount of new housing makes it even worse.
Maybe they CHOOSE to stay because they WANT to. Why do you live where you live? Why does anyone live in Arizona, Florida, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Utah.......pick a city, state or zip code usually because they want to.
Maybe they CHOOSE to stay because they WANT to. Why do you live where you live? Why does anyone live in Arizona, Florida, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Utah.......pick a city, state or zip code usually because they want to.
You can cost index any of these places and they usually come out ahead of NYC.
I get the OPs post, and these posts come up all the time and "new yorkers" defend the city tooth and nail.
Bottom line remains, there's a difficult time being middle class in a city that has a gigantic income disparity, and holds a special place for investors and the rich and famous.
I live in Northern NJ and plan to move to Seattle, which is a good example of a major city that is reasonably priced, with good salaries and a decent amount of things to do
It's alright.
I still like NY City better though and would still rather live there.
What city in this nation has a flourishing middle class that has a top notch QOL? Anywhere you go you can find a good portion of the population living in subpar QOL conditions. Some cities might just hide them better than others but during an era that lacks opportunities, pretty sure that social issues exist.
What city in this nation has a flourishing middle class that has a top notch QOL? Anywhere you go you can find a good portion of the population living in subpar QOL conditions. Some cities might just hide them better than others but during an era that lacks opportunities, pretty sure that social issues exist.
The biggest that come to mind are Atlanta, Dallas, and Orlando.
There are hoods in all three but those are chronically poor people who aren't working.
Middle class salaries can buy or rent homes in all those places which you'd have to be a Millionaire in NYC to afford.
After those three cities- I'd still say places like San Jose, Philadelphia, Phoenix and Chicago can be expensive places to live, but working a middle class job like retail manager, classroom teacher, or deputy city treasurer you can rent a good apartment in a decent part of town (downtown district or otherwise)- albeit not have a lot of money for some of the more expensive entertainment venues in such places.
NYC's middle class is duct taped together by ridiculous social programs.
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