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And I'll be damned if I know what it was to this day.
I think you should ask her. That may give you some "closure" on this case.
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Not sexual impropriety, if that's what you're dancing around - I don't roll that way.
You may not, but maybe the girl did. Maybe your wife sensed it and that's the reason she didn't want her in your house.
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THAT was the operative element - I WAS able to care for her, until others could.
There are thousands of homeless people, Phil. I'm sure you're not interested in or capable of caring for all of them. There's something that touched you about this particular girl. Seriously, I highly doubt you would’ve wanted to do the same for a 60-year-old male student of yours. Which brings me to a question actually. How would YOU react if your wife had decided to bring a young attractive homeless man in your house?
The difference between Phil's situation and the OP's friend is that Phil's student was a homeless 16-year-old girl with mental problems, no money, and no family support; while the OP's friend is a grown a** woman who has held a job for five years and earned professional certifications, proving she is capable of taking care of herself if she would just get her s*** together.
Phil's story was hard to read, but he should take solace in the fact that he seemed to have done much, much more for that girl in her final two years than anyone else in her life.
You have to think of your marriage and life first IMO
Reading through all of the thread--it is clear that you are a kind, compassionate person, and caring friend.
Your friend has been through life events, as the result of her bad choices or not, none of which were your fault, or in your control. You know that she is a capable person, because of her certifications and former jobs You can try to help her, but she is a mother, who has given up her children to live with Ex-in-laws. Being able to keep her children has not motivated her enough to get help with her depression/weight. Knowing that, I do not believe (just my opinion), that you will be able to fix/motivate her to change. I do believe from close observation that the depression and weight are linked, so first of all your suggestion of a physical, is a wise one. I would also suggest, as others have a mental health consult.
Welfare recipients, in our state, in most cases, are counseled and a plan is made to help them get back on their feet, they must actively look for employment. Of course with the present economy it is sometimes fruitless.
I have seen many obese nurses and techs in hospitals, so I wonder if it is just her weight keeping her from finding a job--I don't really know what that amount of bmi means. If she has been blacklisted, as you have mentioned, it might be smart to find out, and find out why. If she has a drug/alcohol problem, even if she gets help it can be a long revolving door of problems.
All of the things suggested for the email/contract? are good ideas. If you do decide to have her stay, I would suggest you fix the apartment first yourself, install a shower, and close off, even if just in a temporary way, any entrance into your living area. You and your husband need your privacy, and you really need to stay as stress free as possible while you are trying to conceive.
In the end it is your choice and that of your husband--
The difference between Phil's situation and the OP's friend is that Phil's student was a homeless 16-year-old girl with mental problems, no money, and no family support; while the OP's friend is a grown a** woman who has held a job for five years and earned professional certifications, proving she is capable of taking care of herself if she would just get her s*** together.
That's true, but the impact on the marriage is very relevant.
I will reconsider the rent option after your comments. I'll throw it out there that I've taken in people in the past and I have been screwed by it. I used to call it "taking in strays". Although, back then, I didn't have a husband to consider or my current responsibilities. I'm just walking off a financial tight rope since my dh has been in school F/T for the past years. It's a delicate situation on that end.
I think some self inquiry might be in order. You'll need to ask yourself what you get out of taking in strays. There is always an emotional payoff to this, although it usually will leave you financially depleted. It sounds like you have some codependency issues yourself.
This is true. As I mentioned earlier, it wasn't too different when we were kids. She had a hard time holding down a job. We did not hold the same work ethic and I'm not sure why. It's not like she comes from money or an easy life. She's had it rough.
I think back almost 20yrs ago and wish for different decisions, even then. What if I dragged her on tour with me? (hard work). What if I didn't leave her in Key West where she got into trouble (turned born again Christian, married one who was crazy, that led her life to where it is now). But, people are who they are.
She has emotional problems related to growing up in a screwed up family. There's really not much you can do to fix that. She has to do that herself by going to therapy, 12 step programs, church (a reasonable church, not a whacko one), etc.
I've spent too much time, life, and money over the years doing this. It's stressful and you will probably end up with the short end of the stick. I can promise you it won't be good for your marriage too.
I took care of my parents....They died and the bulk of the estate went to my sister who 'needs the help'. A college friend stayed with us for 3 years and did finally get back on her feet but I supported her for all that time and she never paid me back a cent. But at least she is grateful. Last and worst, I took in an ex-friend for a year plus. Her big thank you was to shaft me out of 7K she owed me by filing Ch 7. Her bankruptcy was fraudulent and she bought a brand new car the week it was final. And she trashed me all over cyberspace to anyone who would listen.
The parent thing, no regrets. I did the right thing. But the rest of it....I should have been much smarter. Depressed means mentally ill and I shouldn't take on responsibility for people with problems I can't fix. It's hard to say no. But it's in your best interest to say no.
Last and worst, I took in an ex-friend for a year plus. Her big thank you was to shaft me out of 7K she owed me by filing Ch 7. Her bankruptcy was fraudulent and she bought a brand new car the week it was final. And she trashed me all over cyberspace to anyone who would listen.
I find it interesting that so many stories of kindness end up with the other person screwing over their "friend."
I had a friend in college who let one of our friends stay with her for about two months. The guest took complete advantage of her host. And when the host had enough of her sleeping all day, eating all the food, bringing guys home, etc., she was asked to leave by the weekend.
The guest left alright, and she took a bunch of her host's electronics with her!
I find it interesting that so many stories of kindness end up with the other person screwing over their "friend."
I had a friend in college who let one of our friends stay with her for about two months. The guest took complete advantage of her host. And when the host had enough of her sleeping all day, eating all the food, bringing guys home, etc., she was asked to leave by the weekend.
The guest left alright, and she took a bunch of her host's electronics with her!
Hence sayings like, "No good deed goes unpunished."
I have a close friend. We've known each other for two decades. She's never had her shyte completely together, but she did have a career of sorts pre-recession. Her job was one of things keeping her together. She did five years at that place, which was so good for her. She has two kids, who she loves, but they live with her ex's parents. I don't think her ex has had a steady job at any point. Either way, she lost her job, car, apartment, everything. She has made a series of mistakes, coupled with the recession, that have left her without a pot to **** in or a window to throw it out of.
She's depressed, extremely obese, which is just getting worse by the day, and is now couching it. She doesn't want to leave the state (Michigan), but it's really tough out there. She needs to work. She needs food, money, etc. She actually got a job a couple of months ago, but failed the physical due to high blood pressure. I have no doubt this is obviously due to the obesity, but she argues it. She's at the point where she has nowhere to go. She has indicated that she would be receptive to coming out here (MA). At this point, once her welcome is worn on that couch, I don't know where she can go. I'm the only main stay in her life.
My husband is not excited about the prospect (he's pissed). Neither am I to be honest. She's a long time friend. I love her. But, as you all know living with someone and being just friends with someone are entirely two different things. When we were kids (late teens/early 20s) I had her live with me. Then she'd go out on her own. Then she'd come back; wash/repeat. She's my girl, but our worldviews usually don't jive. I don't like the way she handles her business, never have, but I typically don't voice a lot of objections because I'm not her mamma and it strains our relationship. She's often not receptive to it any way. My husband says that if she were to come then it would have to be under serious stipulations. I get that and agree with him. I want to help my friend. I'm just at a loss in how to approach this situation.
The first and most important thing is that she needs to lose weight. It's affecting her ability to get a job (BMI>43). It's affecting her self worth. I can feed her and cook healthy vegetarian food for her. I can buy her a gym membership. I can have her stay with me and fix up our crappy in-law apartment (needs a lot of work). I have a long list in my head of what she should do. What she will do is another story. The way I see it- if my husband is going to give up his privacy, which is a huge deal for him (me too), then it should only happen if it's going to result her bettering her life. But! I don't have a magic wand. I'm not a therapist, life coach, etc.
I can't have a person loafing in my house either. I'm so torn.
It is admirable that you care so much for a friend that you're willing to risk the peace and quiet of your home to help her (we need compassion to see us through nowadays.)
I really don't have to anything to add to the wise counsels you have received so far...except this:
~Be wise while being gentle as the dove....
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Originally Posted by SifuPhil
The eternal struggle between the rational mind and the emotional heart.
I think in the end the instinct of self-preservation takes over. It almost seems like you're trying to do an intervention here, and that's scary ground - you can lose a lot of yourself when you attempt to rescue others from themselves. It's like rescuing a drowning person - unless you're trained and experienced in the techniques, you can end up at the bottom of the ocean too.
But obviously the friendship is strong, and in a perverse way that complicates matters. If you didn't care so much you could just say "go to hell" and be done with it. By caring, you're dropping your defenses and opening yourself up to emotional injury. Unless you know how to psychically protect yourself in a situation like that, to dissociate yourself from the situation, there will be THREE of you going down instead of just one.
"The needs of the many ... "
Just a small hint that might prove useful if you decide to go ahead and accept her into your home - charge rent. It doesn't have to be fair-market value, but it needs to be enough that she'll be shamed into finding a way to pay it. Her downward slide might even be reversed by such a tactic, and you might want to consider including it in your emailed conditions to her.
I wish you luck - I've been in similar situations with both successful and disastrous results.
You do have a well-balanced mind, my assessment was accurate after all!
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You have to think of your marriage and life first IMO
