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Old 03-22-2011, 05:57 PM
 
Location: Wasilla, Alaska
17,823 posts, read 23,455,656 times
Reputation: 6541

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert_J View Post
Article 1 section 8 of the Constitution gives the government power to construct roads.

Which airlines are they subsidizing?
Not exactly. Article I, Section 8, Clause 7 of the US Constitution gives Congress the power "to establish Post Offices and Post Roads." Post Roads are further defined as "a road over which mail is carried."

At Eishenhower's request, Congress grossly abused their power and funded the unconstitutional interstate road system, which we are still paying for today over 50 years later.

As far as the airlines are concerned, Congress has been subsidizing the entire airline industry since 09/11/2001.
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Old 03-22-2011, 06:39 PM
 
13,005 posts, read 18,911,642 times
Reputation: 9252
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oerdin View Post
If Europe, Japan, South Korea, Taiwan, Russia, China, and even Turkey can get HSR right why do people claim the US is so incapable it cannot?
Must be the oil lobby. You don't see Saudi Arabia building one. What's this?
Saudi awards ME's first high speed rail contract
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Old 03-22-2011, 08:13 PM
 
Location: Dallas
31,290 posts, read 20,744,889 times
Reputation: 9325
Quote:
Originally Posted by knowledgeiskey View Post
That's why we need HSR. Too bad the airline industry won't allow it to happen.



Survey says: 79% of travelers would pick high speed rail over air travel when possible | Gadling.com

If you told those 79% what it would cost they might change their minds.
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Old 03-23-2011, 10:01 AM
 
13,651 posts, read 20,780,689 times
Reputation: 7652
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadking2003 View Post
If you told those 79% what it would cost they might change their minds.
Quite true.

How this became an ideological issue is beyond me. Many of have been to Europe and loved the train systems. However, its not an analagous situation.

If various states see it in their interest, fine. If they are ready to assume huge costs and perpetual subsidies, fine. If, let's say, the people of the Lone Star State truly think a hsr link between Dallas and Houston is the way to go, go for it. Having lived in Dallas, I have a hard believing those car-happy people are going to disdain their auto for the occassionl trip from Dallas to Houston.

But if they want to spend Texas Money on it, fine. Dallas actually has an excellent bus system and a decent if embryonic light rail. You can always get a seat cuz there ain't too many people on it. I am sure they will love a bullet train.
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Old 03-23-2011, 10:02 AM
 
Location: Dallas, TX
31,767 posts, read 28,822,592 times
Reputation: 12341
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadking2003 View Post
If you told those 79% what it would cost they might change their minds.
Yeah, oil is guaranteed to be cheap, and forever.
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Old 03-23-2011, 10:13 AM
 
45,230 posts, read 26,450,499 times
Reputation: 24988
Money and pipe dreams aren't forever, as America is now discovering.
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Old 03-23-2011, 10:27 AM
 
Location: Del Rio, TN
39,874 posts, read 26,514,597 times
Reputation: 25773
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nexis4Jersey View Post
The same could be said about Roads? Large Scale Projects should be funded by PPP's...
Roads already are. See fuel taxes. Licensce and registration fees. Toll roads. If fuel tax wasn't diverted to fund mass transit, perhaps some of these fees could be reduced. But then, mass transit users would have to pay there own way...can't have that happen now, can we?

To be honest, if residents of major urban areas want to fund dedicated passanger rail service between major cities, I'm not opposed to it. The users of those services should be the ones paying for them.
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Old 03-23-2011, 10:50 AM
 
Location: Youngstown, Oh.
5,510 posts, read 9,494,989 times
Reputation: 5622
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toyman at Jewel Lake View Post
Roads already are. See fuel taxes. Licensce and registration fees. Toll roads. If fuel tax wasn't diverted to fund mass transit, perhaps some of these fees could be reduced. But then, mass transit users would have to pay there own way...can't have that happen now, can we?

To be honest, if residents of major urban areas want to fund dedicated passanger rail service between major cities, I'm not opposed to it. The users of those services should be the ones paying for them.
I guess whether highways pay for themselves or not, depends on who you believe:
Subsidyscope.org — Transportation: Analysis Finds Shifting Trends in Highway Funding: User Fees Make Up Decreasing Share
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Old 03-23-2011, 12:06 PM
 
Location: Dallas
31,290 posts, read 20,744,889 times
Reputation: 9325
Quote:
Originally Posted by EinsteinsGhost View Post
Yeah, oil is guaranteed to be cheap, and forever.

No, it's not. But the funny thing about free markets is that they sort this out. At some point the price of oil will go up dramatically and the markets will respond with more investment in alternative solutions.

We don't need government intervention to accomplish this.

If gas goes to $12 per gallon over the next five years you will see a lot of changes happen as a result. If coal and natural gas go up two or three hundred percent, the market will demand alternatives. Maybe then solar and wind sources will be economically viable.
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Old 03-23-2011, 12:09 PM
 
Location: Fort Worth, Texas
3,390 posts, read 4,951,676 times
Reputation: 2049
I hear all of you good people complaining about the government funded part of HSR. I'm a fiscal conservative, but I really do think that HSR is an important part of the infrastructure in this country that deserves our tax dollars.

But as in my prior post, I don't believe this country can pull off such a feat without screwing it up royally.

But in my respect for HSR, we can just agree to disagree.
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