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Old 07-09-2013, 12:47 PM
 
Location: Ohio
13,933 posts, read 12,903,846 times
Reputation: 7399

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Quote:
Originally Posted by NoJiveMan View Post
The "scumbags" aren't the ones being killed, that's the problem.
They should go to some type of school to help them improve their aim and handling of firearms, so they don't shoot innocent people.

So then it sounds like gangs and gang violence are the real problem, right? Why don't people focus their efforts on curbing gang violence in cities rather than passing restriction on inanimate objects?
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Old 07-09-2013, 12:57 PM
 
Location: The Brat Stop
8,347 posts, read 7,246,149 times
Reputation: 2279
Quote:
Originally Posted by WhipperSnapper 88 View Post
So then it sounds like gangs and gang violence are the real problem, right? Why don't people focus their efforts on curbing gang violence in cities rather than passing restriction on inanimate objects?
The answer is "how". Short of following alleged gang members to their apartments, using unauthorized surveillance techniques, and busting down doors, apprehending suspects, confiscation of firearms, etc., without violating constitutional rights. How?

I don't have the answer. I'm not sure anyone does, but I'm open to suggestions. People, who have witnessed these crimes have a code of silence, it's called fear.
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Old 07-09-2013, 01:24 PM
 
6,084 posts, read 6,048,996 times
Reputation: 1916
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoJiveMan View Post
The answer is "how". Short of following alleged gang members to their apartments, using unauthorized surveillance techniques, and busting down doors, apprehending suspects, confiscation of firearms, etc., without violating constitutional rights. How?
A lot of places seem to have opted for gentrification.
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Old 07-09-2013, 01:37 PM
 
78,448 posts, read 60,652,129 times
Reputation: 49752
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoJiveMan View Post
The answer is "how". Short of following alleged gang members to their apartments, using unauthorized surveillance techniques, and busting down doors, apprehending suspects, confiscation of firearms, etc., without violating constitutional rights. How?

I don't have the answer. I'm not sure anyone does, but I'm open to suggestions. People, who have witnessed these crimes have a code of silence, it's called fear.
Diversion programs and legal aggressive prosecution of the drug lords has worked. You have to get the kids off the streets and involved in other things and those that try to recruit and prey on them get sent to jail.

It takes a lot of effort and it's not cheap though....blaming guns is free and politically expedient.
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Old 07-09-2013, 01:40 PM
 
Location: USA
13,255 posts, read 12,135,112 times
Reputation: 4228
If you end the Drug War you cut the gangs biggest source of revenue. Nobody's gonna "just hang out" if there's no money to be made.


The problem with that though is your unemployment problem in those communities greatly increase and you could have some issues as communities transition.


But you gotta do something.




I'm not for restricting anybody's Constitutional Rights.
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Old 07-09-2013, 01:44 PM
 
78,448 posts, read 60,652,129 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gtownoe View Post
If you end the Drug War you cut the gangs biggest source of revenue. Nobody's gonna "just hang out" if there's no money to be made.


The problem with that though is your unemployment problem in those communities greatly increase and you could have some issues as communities transition.


But you gotta do something.




I'm not for restricting anybody's Constitutional Rights.
I'm ok with legalizing weed, but some of the other stuff.......not so much.

You hit the nail on the head though. Without employment and other options they will merely transition to another illegal source of income once drugs become legal.

Work and opportunity will kill gangs and crime faster than anything else.
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Old 07-09-2013, 01:50 PM
 
Location: USA
13,255 posts, read 12,135,112 times
Reputation: 4228
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
I'm ok with legalizing weed, but some of the other stuff.......not so much.

You hit the nail on the head though. Without employment and other options they will merely transition to another illegal source of income once drugs become legal.

Work and opportunity will kill gangs and crime faster than anything else.
Agreed.


I won't share my business idea for those communities but if I ever get the investment capital I'll jump. My plan would keep the money in the community, rather then flowing solely back to the investors.



While there are a ton of issues in those communities, there's also a ton of opportunity. And despite what people believe, there's some great people in those communities. I got my start on the Southside, The 90's through the Wild Hundreds. Brand new to the city and the people were still some of the best people I've met.

People often don't think about the law abiding citizens in those communities because of the high crime rates. But there are still people they're trying to make an honest living.




We have a huge issue of certain areas of our major cities being overpriced. Why not take advantage of the low prices and really work to improve those communities. I know a ton of Millinials who could really use lower home prices. It's already happened in some neighborhoods, we just need to keep up the effort.
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Old 07-09-2013, 01:58 PM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
12,287 posts, read 9,829,035 times
Reputation: 6509
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoJiveMan View Post
The answer is "how". Short of following alleged gang members to their apartments, using unauthorized surveillance techniques, and busting down doors, apprehending suspects, confiscation of firearms, etc., without violating constitutional rights. How?

I don't have the answer. I'm not sure anyone does, but I'm open to suggestions. People, who have witnessed these crimes have a code of silence, it's called fear.
I love how you say things can't be done to stop gang violence because it is illegal/unconstitutional but then want to violate the same bill of rights in the form of further gun control and it is OK.
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Old 07-09-2013, 02:13 PM
 
Location: Round Rock, Texas
12,950 posts, read 13,355,000 times
Reputation: 14010
Quote:
Originally Posted by shooting4life View Post
I love how you say things can't be done to stop gang violence because it is illegal/unconstitutional but then want to violate the same bill of rights in the form of further gun control and it is OK.
Good post.

My natural, legal, & Constitutional rights to defend myself & family have nothing to do with criminals who are generally coddled or ignored by the legal system in large urban areas.
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Old 07-09-2013, 02:29 PM
 
20,728 posts, read 19,377,191 times
Reputation: 8293
Quote:
Originally Posted by freightshaker View Post
I agree that we should go ahead and legalize drug use, but that won't get rid of the gangs... They will just change their attention to other things.. Gangs are older than the drug culture we currently have in the US... They have been around a lot longer..
Do you have an economic response as in what will be their income stream worth fighting over?
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