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Why is your 8 year old out of control anyway if you have been parenting in a consistent manner. Do you think spanking them will work if ALL that did not? NO.........I have tried several methods and found what works for me and I do not have to resort to "wearing out hides" . My kids KNOW what I expect. I don't agree that there should be a BAN on spanking. I just think it is a hypocritical way to teach your children right from wrong.
Did I say my kid????? No I did not. I used an 8 year old who is unruly as an example. Pay Attention!
How many kids do you have? forget I asked, we dont need to go down that road. I personally know the difference between getting disciplined with a swat or spanking and getting the sh*t knocked out of you because your old man is an abusive drunk! Convusing one for the other is naive and ignorant!
You mustn't have read my earlier post. You assume people know the difference just as you claim you do. However, that is not the case. One man's discipline is another man's years of therapy. It is very easy to confuse the two when we don't bother to teach parenting to our own kids or make it mandatory in higher education. It is indeed highly naive to suggest that people know the difference between abuse and discipline. They don't. Most parents are hardly together themselves when they administer it.
By the way, how many times does a child get hit not because of their natural behavior, but because of the crap they've just been fed? How much garbage food do we subject our children to and then punish them for behaving badly, when the fault is the effect of all the behavior-modifying substances? It's just so easy to hit them, isn't it? All this bad behavior people see is NOT because of a lack of discipline. Many things are at stake when it comes to behavior. These must be addressed if we are proposing a viable method.
I really think those of you who are in favor of a law against spanking, serioulsy, have some deeply imbeded psycological problems, which you certainly cannot even begin to imagine the implimentation of the government, controlling something like a law against spanking? ...maybe you were spanked a lot or even beat? I dunno....but your idea of spanking and my idea of spanking are two different things and certainly not in reality, a world I live in....
I'm glad for who I am, and what I believe in, therefore, I'm very relieved for my parents and their rules and regulations...especially when I see today's kids.
I just came back from the dentist....there was a mother sitting there with her kids, who were maybe 12, 14, & 16? Just guessing...and boy oh boy were they loud....matter of fact, the girl sitting across from me, who is also in school, rolled her eyes at me a few times...and this is the case where ever I go...matter of fact, I was so tempted to ask the mother if she believed in spanking, just to run a little survey of my own...I'd bet she doesn't. As she was just as loud as the rest of them....by the way, the girl who rolled her eyes at me, well, her mother was there as well, correcting papers...she is a teacher.
I discussed the situation with her....and asked her what she thought....She said, those kids who are not spanked you can pick em out in a heartbeat...they have big mouths...they do not listen as well, they have problems understanding rules...they think anything goes....they are loud and do not possess respect for another person's space...so, there you go...out of a professional's mouth...
Her daughter told me, she was spanked very little, but she knew after the first or second time as a little girl, there would be a consequence for her actions...she said, my mom didn't spank very hard at all, it was done so few times that when it WAS done, it brused her ego, more then anything else...and she was glad, cuz, she said, there is no way, I'd want to be like those kids that just left....and by the way, she said, their mom seemed very immature and inexperienced....I said, Bravo...and looked at her mother and said, "You should be very proud, Good Jobber!"
I have seen mom's simply act mad, spin their toddlers around and actually tap them on their behinds...which of course, doesn't inflict an ounze of pain. And the only thing that is hurt is their pride.
And, there was only one time, when I know I spanked my son, and it stung his butt a little....
As far as the child being scared for life...doesn't happen....and as far as spanking not being a loving act...let me tell you...I knew a teacher who asked her entire class, "How many of you are spanked at home, and all the kids raised their hands except one". The teacher, who is a woman, said...doesn't you mom and dad spank you....the kid said, "no, they don't, and I don't think they love me or they would, and I've tried to be bad, so they would spank me, but they don't." So, there ya go....
Spanking is not inflicted with pain usually, it's the ultimate surprise which usually jolts kids...and frankly, I believe Bill Cosby said it all best, when he spoke of his dad....
"I bought you into this world, and I can take you out"...LOL
You guys who cannot spank, that is perfectly up to you....but I would love to see you entergize all that into trying to pass a law to get sex offenders off the streets for good...talk about protecting our children...now that would be constructive.
cremebrulee, I think it is again very naive to say that the kids in the waiting room would be 'fixed' by spanking them. Who said they needed fixing anyway? One can ignore the rude, you know. Were the kids having fun? Were other people left wounded and bleeding? Probably not. Do we need to hurt our kids to teach them that our society has stupid rules of behavior that rob us of our ability to play? However, in our society, what they were doing is 'unacceptable' and the failure lied with the parents, occurring LONG before that visit to the dentist. You are proposing an easy fix, one that only succeeds in creating people who are afraid. If behavior modification is best delivered through pain, we are indeed a sick society. There are other methods and the parents of those kids probably gave up. To them, it was easier to do nothing. Parenting is a difficult role, the most important one given to us. Our 9 to 5 jobs pale in comparison.
To say that the effect isn't long-lasting or dangerous is also naive. Everyone is different and physical pain affects everyone differently. While there might not be any irreparable damage, a spanking parent can easily turn into a betrayal in the eyes of the child. There are too many psychological issues at stake. Better alternatives are needed and worthy of exploration. Personal childhood and individual parenting experience is not enough to form a solid opinion. A consensus approach is essential in resolving this issue.
You mustn't have read my earlier post. You assume people know the difference just as you claim you do. However, that is not the case. One man's discipline is another man's years of therapy. It is very easy to confuse the two when we don't bother to teach parenting to our own kids or make it mandatory in higher education. It is indeed highly naive to suggest that people know the difference between abuse and discipline. They don't. Most parents are hardly together themselves when they administer it.
By the way, how many times does a child get hit not because of their natural behavior, but because of the crap they've just been fed? How much garbage food do we subject our children to and then punish them for behaving badly, when the fault is the effect of all the behavior-modifying substances? It's just so easy to hit them, isn't it? All this bad behavior people see is NOT because of a lack of discipline. Many things are at stake when it comes to behavior. These must be addressed if we are proposing a viable method.
I have no idea what in the hell you are talking about! They dont say Boys will be Boys for nothing, you cant blame it on the twinkies, my kids dont eat junk food but they still push you looking for the boundry, You are talking about hitting this thread is about spanking, if it were easy there would be a lot more well behaved kids out their. I have coached football for 6 years and I bet I could be about 98 % accurate on what boys got spanked & which ones didnt. the most well mannered polite and respectful kids had some of the strictest disciplinarian parents who are spankers!!!
I have no idea what in the hell you are talking about! They dont say Boys will be Boys for nothing, you cant blame it on the twinkies, my kids dont eat junk food but they still push you looking for the boundry, You are talking about hitting this thread is about spanking, if it were easy there would be a lot more well behaved kids out their. I have coached football for 6 years and I bet I could be about 98 % accurate on what boys got spanked & which ones didnt. the most well mannered polite and respectful kids had some of the strictest disciplinarian parents who are spankers!!!
So conformity makes for better people? See, the idea is still to control them.
Your view is way too simplistic to me. Humans are much more complex. My 4 year old nephew is the most complex person I know and it's a joy to be around him. He never needs to be spanked because his entire family has paid attention to him from day one. Sorry, we will never agree. I don't choose the easiest route just because everybody else does.
So conformity makes for better people? See, the idea is still to control them.
Your view is way too simplistic to me. Humans are much more complex. My 4 year old nephew is the most complex person I know and it's a joy to be around him. He never needs to be spanked because his entire family has paid attention to him from day one. Sorry, we will never agree. I don't choose the easiest route just because everybody else does.
Well thats good, I will say that until you have raised a few of your own for a few years its pretty easy to talk about how kids should or shouldnt be raised, Other parents can probably relate with me when I say that after my first son was born I ate alot of my own words and with each chid your high faluting idealism tends to take a back seat to reality!! I am happy for you & your complex nephew , I question the rational of, the key to good behavior is the requirment for attention 24/7, and figure when he is not getting that, and acts out, that society and law enforcement aren't going to buy the "he's complex" explaination!
Exactly. A wise person once told me that every family adores their own children and see them as special (and this is how it should be) however, the gift the parents can give to the child is so that others will find them this way also. A well-mannered child will have such an easier time in society. When a child goes out in public and acts out and everyone wishes the child would leave, well, I feel sorry for the child because their parents didn't do them any favors.
Giving a child attention 24/7 may be possible for the first few years but then they expect it and are in for a wake up call when they get to the real world.
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