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it's already killed 6% of those who tested positive. that's nowhere near "zero risk". I do so wish that folks on "my side" wouldn't type stuff like that.
But many who are positive were never tested. Figure that in and the death rate is in the tenths of one percent so saying that it is “virtually close to zero” is not that far off.
it's already killed 6% of those who tested positive. that's nowhere near "zero risk". I do so wish that folks on "my side" wouldn't type stuff like that.
Take out people with a serious underlying disease and those over 80, and the fatality rate drops to a fraction of 1%. That might have been the “near zero” the poster meant.
Thus, older people and those with serious conditions should continue to isolate until an effective treatment is found. Everyone else, back to work.
Take out people with a serious underlying disease and those over 80, and the fatality rate drops to a fraction of 1%. That might have been the “near zero” the poster meant.
Thus, older people and those with serious conditions should continue to isolate until an effective treatment is found. Everyone else, back to work.
We'll keep that in mind when you develop a health issue or turn 80. No more care, your life doesn't matter!
Two of my coworkers are dead. Both were in their late 50s/early 60s and didn't have a serious underlying disease. They had issues that more than half of Americans deal with: overweight, one (to my knowledge) had high blood pressure, the other was a type I diabetic.
I'm 32 years old and while I'm healthy, I have several issues that could kill me if I was infected. Luckily, I can work from home, but I guess other people in the same boat just don't matter, eh?
Here's the thing - I don't disagree that we need to open up, but Americans are far too selfish and self-centered to do so and that's just holding our opening back. How many Americans refuse to wear masks despite all evidence pointing to cloth masks reducing the spread? How many refuse to stand back from employees at stores who are exposed to tons of germs all day in order to make sure that you are fed and get your meds? We haven't proven as a society that we take this seriously enough to safely open up. Every time I see someone without a mask, all I can think is there's someone who is excited about homeschooling their kid in the fall because teachers are going to refuse to go into classrooms full of kids whose parents can't even show basic respect for others.
Take out people with a serious underlying disease and those over 80, and the fatality rate drops to a fraction of 1%. That might have been the “near zero” the poster meant.
Thus, older people and those with serious conditions should continue to isolate until an effective treatment is found. Everyone else, back to work.
I can make any statistic sound how I want if I just start committing factors.
"Hey, war is safe, hardly kills anyone if you take out deaths from bullets and bombs, oh yea, take out deaths from those who were in a military uniform, and deaths from those that occurred in a combat zone".
We'll keep that in mind when you develop a health issue or turn 80. No more care, your life doesn't matter!
Two of my coworkers are dead. Both were in their late 50s/early 60s and didn't have a serious underlying disease. They had issues that more than half of Americans deal with: overweight, one (to my knowledge) had high blood pressure, the other was a type I diabetic.
I'm 32 years old and while I'm healthy, I have several issues that could kill me if I was infected. Luckily, I can work from home, but I guess other people in the same boat just don't matter, eh?
Here's the thing - I don't disagree that we need to open up, but Americans are far too selfish and self-centered to do so and that's just holding our opening back. How many Americans refuse to wear masks despite all evidence pointing to cloth masks reducing the spread? How many refuse to stand back from employees at stores who are exposed to tons of germs all day in order to make sure that you are fed and get your meds? We haven't proven as a society that we take this seriously enough to safely open up. Every time I see someone without a mask, all I can think is there's someone who is excited about homeschooling their kid in the fall because teachers are going to refuse to go into classrooms full of kids whose parents can't even show basic respect for others.
The only ones that are "selfish and self-centered" are those that insist that all others cater to their desires and phobias. Here's a little clue for you. If you have underlying medical conditions that can kill you-stay locked up in your home. Take care of yourself. NO ONE IS GOING TO KICK YOUR DOOR IN AND DRAG YOU INTO THE SCARY OUTSIDE! It ain't that hard. You can do so and protect yourself, as can others that are especially at risk. We can secure nursing homes, test everyone that works there AND STOP FORCING THEM TO TAKE COVID POSITIVE PATIENTS!
We can do so while basically healthy people get on with life, keep their businesses alive, earn a living and put food on the table and a roof over their heads. You apparently don't have a need to work and provide for yourself and your family-others are not so fortunate.
The only ones that are "selfish and self-centered" are those that insist that all others cater to their desires and phobias. Here's a little clue for you. If you have underlying medical conditions that can kill you-stay locked up in your home. Take care of yourself. NO ONE IS GOING TO KICK YOUR DOOR IN AND DRAG YOU INTO THE SCARY OUTSIDE! It ain't that hard. You can do so and protect yourself, as can others that are especially at risk. We can secure nursing homes, test everyone that works there AND STOP FORCING THEM TO TAKE COVID POSITIVE PATIENTS!
We can do so while basically healthy people get on with life, keep their businesses alive, earn a living and put food on the table and a roof over their heads. You apparently don't have a need to work and provide for yourself and your family-others are not so fortunate.
So half of Americans stay indoors until there's a vaccine. Will you be delivering food?
Or should we open up slowly and all take reasonable precautions to keep most Americans safe while we open back up the service economy?
I mean, I get that's a really difficult decision - wear a mask in public or have half of Americans (and their households) isolated. Really hard.
Massachusetts didn't allow nursing homes to take covid patients, and they were still decimated despite being locked down. Try another line, yours isn't working.
We'll keep that in mind when you develop a health issue or turn 80. No more care, your life doesn't matter!
Two of my coworkers are dead. Both were in their late 50s/early 60s and didn't have a serious underlying disease. They had issues that more than half of Americans deal with: overweight, one (to my knowledge) had high blood pressure, the other was a type I diabetic.
I'm 32 years old and while I'm healthy, I have several issues that could kill me if I was infected. Luckily, I can work from home, but I guess other people in the same boat just don't matter, eh?
Here's the thing - I don't disagree that we need to open up, but Americans are far too selfish and self-centered to do so and that's just holding our opening back. How many Americans refuse to wear masks despite all evidence pointing to cloth masks reducing the spread? How many refuse to stand back from employees at stores who are exposed to tons of germs all day in order to make sure that you are fed and get your meds? We haven't proven as a society that we take this seriously enough to safely open up. Every time I see someone without a mask, all I can think is there's someone who is excited about homeschooling their kid in the fall because teachers are going to refuse to go into classrooms full of kids whose parents can't even show basic respect for others.
Did I just not say that those older people and those with serious conditions should continue to isolate?! So why attack me on that? How I think other people don’t matter, blah-blah-blah. Why do liberals have to be so hateful all the time?
And I’m sorry about your coworkers, but you admit they had other serious conditions. Thus people like that should also continue to isolate.
You’re only focusing on the risks associated with opening, and ignoring the risks of not opening - like a totally collapsed country and the death and despair that arise from THAT. Great that YOU are able to work from home, but others can’t and are watching their careers and life’s work disappear. I could turn it around and ask why YOU don’t care about people who will feel so destroyed that they will end up suiciding, or O.D.ing, or abusing a defenseless child.
We need to open up, as even you agree. But with severe penalties for not wearing a mask. I ALWAYS wear a mask in public, and why? Because I don’t want to get someone sick (assuming I had the virus and didn’t know it.) So enough about how I don’t care about people just because I don’t agree with you.
At the start of all this we converted several wings into negative pressure isolation rooms. We also converted two wings to be completely negative pressure and staff would have to be fully dressed out while working on the wing. All the negative air machines on two wings have been removed. One of the two isolation wings has had their temporary walls taken down as the wing was never used for COVID patients. One wing is still completely isolated. Those above us are considering removing more of the negative air machines or at least turning them off until needed.
What an average layperson like you needs to understand is that scienrific understanding of something new is not in a static state of perfection at the start. It starts with hypotheses; then as data is collected, hypotheses are proven or disproven. New treatments and new hypotheses take place. This is how the scientific method evolves toward better knowledge and better results. We should all try to be more like this on our own evaluations of the world.
DingDingDing, we have a winner. We do have a scientific method, and a critical part of it is trying advance science is to promote and test a variety of different hypotheses. Yet we don't do that-the only ideas we consider are the ones promoted by government bureaucrats, sometimes posing as scientists. We accepted their word that there was no human-to-human transmission. We listened as those experts (CDC) said we don't need internationally available test kits, nor from American companies or universities-the CDC had it covered, and in fact banned (via the FDA) other tests. And then they screwed the pooch hard, made a test that failed, and cost us weeks before we could start testing. Real science would have multiple sources of kits, and test all of them for their efficacy.
We spend billions funding the CDC-they should be providing guidance and leadership to medical professionals "in the trenches". Instead, it is the troops on the front lines that have to run their own studies, develop their own treatments and do their own science. I watched the video DRob presented in post 7 when it came out (I think the same doctor did others). His statements as to how the virus "functioned" made sense, as did his treatment advice (now largely accepted)...but he was virtually shut down because he wasn't parroting the opinion of government "experts". And if my memory is correct, he was making those calls at the time the DPA was being discussed to force the production of vents.
We don't listen to actual scientists and medical professionals so much as we do politicians and media talking heads in this country. We suppress actual science and medical professionals if they don't go along with the status quo. (and in fact delete their videos from Youtube and Facebook). People listen to talking heads like "Dr." Gupta on CNN, rather than doctors currently practicing in the field or laboratory. We ignore the scientific method and attack those that question the socially acceptable hypothesis.
When people use science and data to point out that the "lockdown" has failed, they are shouted down and denounced. It a "lockdown" has been effective-why have 25% of New York City residents been infected in just a few weeks? And that 25% infection rate was nearly a month ago; it's undoubtedly higher now.
Scientists and medical professionals that promote the concept of herd immunity are attacked and denounced and the entire concept is mocked. Never mind that it is what has protected humanity for millenia. There is no testing or evaluation of the hypothesis, just mocking. In spite of the fact that cases and deaths are falling in NYC-as they approach an infection rate where HI has an impact.
Hydroxychloroquine has been has been promoted and used by many doctors with at least some degree of success around the world. Multiple studies outside of this country have indicated at least a degree of success. Yet because Trump dared mention it, the "experts" in this country have denounced it prior to even evaluating it. Even now, after months, studies in this county are very limited. (I'm not saying that it's effective, only that no science was involved in condemning it).
Many people believe ventilators are actually killing these patients. While some may believe that's some kind of conspiracy theory, there is no denying that many of the so called "conspiracy theories" have been turning out to be true lately.
Quote:
Originally Posted by charolastra00
Massachusetts didn't allow nursing homes to take covid patients, and they were still decimated despite being locked down. Try another line, yours isn't working.
You really believe this is evidence that putting COVID-19 patients in nursing homes is somehow a good idea?
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