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This was previously addressed.
You could say that about any immoral and/or evil act: They have always existed and always will.
No civilized society has ever determined that it should not have laws, ordinances, and regulations, simply because there will be inevitable noncompliance.
Here, try this:
Substitute the word "rape" (or any immoral act) for the word "abortion" in your post.
Maybe then, you will realize what a bogus argument it is.
Not an argument, just the truth. Laws won’t stop abortion. They never have. Not everyone agrees with your views.
So......
**Killing babies: Acceptable & even protected as a "right".
**Punishing people for killing babies: Extremist & insane.
I often wonder where and how the moral fabric of the society devolved to such a degree that this type of heinous and degenerate mindset was able to take root?
Because peoples arguments on the other side are not what you are representing them. Why not be truthful here folks? Yes its not just this poster that does it. Heres the real positions overall:
1. Life begins at conception. Abortion is murder because the soul exists at that point. This is the vast minority of people. Even most of the religions put it at first breath. But ALSO? for these folks abortion is TRULY horrific.
2. Life begins at consciousness. This ones the murky one. And sort of the middle ground. We had a reasonable compromise until recently.
3. Life begins at first breath.
Modifiers to all of this? Theres how you value the mother (IE no abortion even though the child is brain dead is government torture folks), how you value the child even before you believe its a living being that deserves respect. etc etc. But really those 3 in the list cover the basics.
And none of these people are evil like everyone tries to portray, they just disagree about when life starts. I disagree with this poster a LOT on this. But guess what? I also respect their commitment to their belief. We BOTH think killing human beings is wrong. We just differ on when it starts. But I just want to push back with them on how they view those who disagree with them. We arent bad or evil. We just disagree about a definition about when life starts.
Been watching all these political commercials and it seems the democrats are using the over turn to attack the republicans. Christ, Demmings and Frankel are all using this as a crutch to try and entice women to not vote for DeSantis or Rubio. So I am wondering if this was an inside job between SCOTUS and the democrats? Who was the main judge who started the ball rolling?
Things must be slow in the alt-right echo chambers.
Because peoples arguments on the other side are not what you are representing them. Why not be truthful here folks? Yes its not just this poster that does it. Heres the real positions overall:
1. Life begins at conception. Abortion is murder because the soul exists at that point. This is the vast minority of people. Even most of the religions put it at first breath. But ALSO? for these folks abortion is TRULY horrific.
2. Life begins at consciousness. This ones the murky one. And sort of the middle ground. We had a reasonable compromise until recently.
3. Life begins at first breath.
Modifiers to all of this? Theres how you value the mother (IE no abortion even though the child is brain dead is government torture folks), how you value the child even before you believe its a living being that deserves respect. etc etc. But really those 3 in the list cover the basics.
And none of these people are evil like everyone tries to portray, they just disagree about when life starts. I disagree with this poster a LOT on this. But guess what? I also respect their commitment to their belief. We BOTH think killing human beings is wrong. We just differ on when it starts. But I just want to push back with them on how they view those who disagree with them. We arent bad or evil. We just disagree about a definition about when life starts.
Yes. These are common issues/points of contention.
On the other hand...it is understood that no matter the stage of development, everyone that has ever lived was necessarily in that same condition at any chosen point in their existence.
That human entity, at whatever developmental stage, is where it should be, and how it should be. Gestation is a categorical occurrence in the existence of everyone, as will be all the stages of life than can occur after that.
But...this is just the empirical observation and common sense of it.
We are fortunate enough to now live in a time where there has been great advances in the science of biology, embryology, and genetics. So...we now have that knowledge to work off of...and the scientific community is in near complete agreement & concensus.
This can help to inform and educate: https://acpeds.org/position-statemen...an-life-begins
Also...what happens when science & technology advances enough that we develop "artificial wombs" whereby we can remove the gestating and the appliance takes over from there...thus negating the "viability outside the Mother" issue?
I view it as necessary to have a definitive standard on the issue...otherwise, people can (and will) just establish their own subjective personal metrics and you can end up with innocent life being taken...on the basis of some arbitrary personal idea of "when life starts".
Was SCOTUS Reversing Roe VS Wade a DNC Chess Move?
Quote:
Originally Posted by GldnRule
So......
**Killing babies: Acceptable & even protected as a "right".
**Punishing people for killing babies: Extremist & insane.
I often wonder where and how the moral fabric of the society devolved to such a degree that this type of heinous and degenerate mindset was able to take root?
No one supports the killing of babies.
Criminalizing women's medical treatment is extremism.
A political party choosing to make women second class citizens is indeed insane, but more importantly it is cruel and a wholly draconian effort to deny women access to medical care and intrude on a woman's most intimate health-care decisions.
Reproductive rights are fundamental human rights, necessary for the dignity, equality, health, and well-being of women and their families. There is only one political party in this nation that desires to subjugate women by stripping their human rights, and it is the GOP.
The Republican Party owns Dobbs.
Among the most egregious aspects of the Dobbs decision was the GOP's failure to consider the real-life impact of overturning the protections of Roe and allowing states to recriminalize abortion. Women’s lives, health, dignity, financial future and responsibilities to existing children count for nothing in the Republican Universe.
Here in 2022, we have a Republican party which is co-mingled with the Evangelical and Catholic Church. The zealots of these religions are a huge percent of the GOP. There's no way they'll ever stop until they've succeeded in imposing a national abortion ban, most likely followed by all of the other religious beliefs they think the rest of us should be following.
As an American citizen, I resent being tyrannized by this minority and their extreme doctrines ---all of which they are free to have in the confines of their religion, but not in the governing of the United States of America. Look, these folks are telling us they can't handle gay or transgender people, cultural diversity or factual teaching of U.S. history, and any other civil rights progress that they deem offensive to their beliefs.
Given the opportunity, the Republican Party will hand this religious minority their goal of denying women reproductive autonomy. The entire forced birth movement has the effrontery to claim they have the right to make choices about birth control, pregnancy, and having children under a bogus pro-life banner.
One cannot repeat it enough. Reproductive rights are fundamental human rights necessary for the dignity, equality, life, health and well-being of women and their families. Demanding that all Americans follow the indoctrinated mindset of forced birth is wrong.
Decisions about whether to choose adoption, end a pregnancy, or continue a pregnancy should be made by a pregnant woman with the counsel of her family, her own faith, and her health care provider. Politicians should not be involved in a woman's personal reproductive health or pregnancy.
And contrary to this thread's preposterous premise, it is only Republican politicians and their flock who demand to practice obstetrics and gynecology and deny women personal agency, relegating them to second class citizenry.
Last edited by corpgypsy; 10-19-2022 at 05:05 AM..
Reason: grammar correction & rephrasing for clarity
Was SCOTUS Reversing Roe VS Wade a DNC Chess Move?
No one supports the killing of babies.
Criminalizing women's medical treatment is extremism.
A political party choosing to make women second class citizens is indeed insane, but more importantly it is cruel and a wholly draconian effort to deny women access to medical care and intrude on a woman's most intimate health-care decisions.
Reproductive rights are fundamental human rights, necessary for the dignity, equality, health, and well-being of women and their families. There is only one political party in this nation that desires to subjugate women by stripping their human rights, and it is the GOP.
The Republican Party owns Dobbs.
Among the most egregious aspects of the Dobbs decision was the GOP's failure to consider the real-life impact of overturning the protections of Roe and allowing states to recriminalize abortion. Women’s lives, health, dignity, financial future and responsibilities to existing children count for nothing in the Republican Universe.
Here in 2022, we have a Republican party which is co-mingled with the Evangelical and Catholic Church. The zealots of these religions are a huge percent of the GOP. There's no way they'll ever stop until they've succeeded in imposing a national abortion ban, most likely followed by all of the other religious beliefs they think the rest of us should be following.
As an American citizen, I resent being tyrannized by this minority and their extreme doctrines ---all of which they are free to have in the confines of their religion, but not in the governing of the United States of America. Look, these folks are telling us they can't handle gay or transgender people, cultural diversity or factual teaching of U.S. history, and any other civil rights progress that they deem offensive to their beliefs.
Given the opportunity, the Republican Party will hand this religious minority their goal of denying women reproductive autonomy. The entire forced birth movement has the effrontery to claim they have the right to make choices about birth control, pregnancy, and having children under a bogus pro-life banner.
One cannot repeat it enough. Reproductive rights are fundamental human rights necessary for the dignity, equality, life, health and well-being of women and their families. Demanding that all Americans follow the indoctrinated mindset of forced birth is wrong.
Decisions about whether to choose adoption, end a pregnancy, or continue a pregnancy should be made by a pregnant woman with the counsel of her family, her own faith, and her health care provider. Politicians should not be involved in a woman's personal reproductive health or pregnancy.
And contrary to this thread's preposterous premise, it is only Republican politicians and their flock who demand to practice obstetrics and gynecology and deny women personal agency, relegating them to second class citizenry.
I am affiliated with no Political Party.
In fact...I do not even believe in Political Parties. They cause nothing but division and gridlock, and add no benefit.
Each State should get two Senators and a Representative for each district...no designation beyond name & State.
And this issue should have nothing to do with Political Party Affiliation...or Religious Affiliation.
The issue is moral & legal.
Women have "reproductive rights"...but that should not extend to the killing of innocent others.
Everyone in the U.S. has all kinds of rights...but killing innocent others one merely prefers does not exist, should not be one of them.
Women and men have "personal agency"...but not such that they are allowed to neglect/harm/kill others.
Nothing is less dignified, denies equality to innocent others, takes & shows no regard for life, and is the antithesis of health & well-being than the wanton execution of gestating babies. And only the lowest, most evil, most depraved, and most dangerous sort would ever consider that acceptable.
To argue that any group of people should be able to neglect/harm/kill innocent others does not elevate from being "second-class citizens"...it makes them the lowest of the low people that exist in humankind.
Including Medical Professionals, that take a oath to "Do no harm". They need to follow that.
It is my hope & prediction that there will be a "Personhood Law" that extends to the gestating...giving them full rights and protections under The Constitution. With full legal penalties for violations.
Then there will be no question as to where killing gestating babies stands within the legal framework of the society.
That is why any society has laws, ordinances, and regulations...because, left to their own "choice", some people will be selfish & evil and will serve themselves at the expense of others.
We need laws, and penalties for violating those laws, to protect the innocent and keep societal order.
Was SCOTUS Reversing Roe VS Wade a DNC Chess Move?
Clearly, not. Even after the Dems blasting abortion at everyone, from the NY Times/Siena College poll:
Independent Women Voters:
September: +14 D
October: +18 R
Quote:
"Of particular note was a 32 point swing among independent women toward the GOP. In September’s iteration of the poll, Democrats boasted a 14 point lead among that demographic, but by October, Republicans held an 18 point advantage."
I am affiliated with no Political Party.
In fact...I do not even believe in Political Parties. They cause nothing but division and gridlock, and add no benefit.
Then you have been posting your intractable positions, religious beliefs and moral fanaticism in the wrong thread. As this one is titled "Was SCOTUS Reversing Roe VS Wade a DNC Chess Move?"
I rest my case.
Peace be with you.
Last edited by corpgypsy; 10-19-2022 at 06:26 AM..
This was previously addressed.
You could say that about any immoral and/or evil act: They have always existed and always will.
No civilized society has ever determined that it should not have laws, ordinances, and regulations, simply because there will be inevitable noncompliance.
Here, try this:
Substitute the word "rape" (or any immoral act) for the word "abortion" in your post.
Maybe then, you will realize what a bogus argument it is.
Everyone does not consider abortion, especially in the early weeks, to be immoral or evil. You are welcome to your opinion, but you need to accept that the whole world does not agree with you.
Yes. These are common issues/points of contention.
On the other hand...it is understood that no matter the stage of development, everyone that has ever lived was necessarily in that same condition at any chosen point in their existence.
That human entity, at whatever developmental stage, is where it should be, and how it should be. Gestation is a categorical occurrence in the existence of everyone, as will be all the stages of life than can occur after that.
But...this is just the empirical observation and common sense of it.
We are fortunate enough to now live in a time where there has been great advances in the science of biology, embryology, and genetics. So...we now have that knowledge to work off of...and the scientific community is in near complete agreement & concensus.
This can help to inform and educate: https://acpeds.org/position-statemen...an-life-begins
Also...what happens when science & technology advances enough that we develop "artificial wombs" whereby we can remove the gestating and the appliance takes over from there...thus negating the "viability outside the Mother" issue?
I view it as necessary to have a definitive standard on the issue...otherwise, people can (and will) just establish their own subjective personal metrics and you can end up with innocent life being taken...on the basis of some arbitrary personal idea of "when life starts".
Please stop presenting your OPINION as fact. Many (maybe most) people disagree with you.
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