Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Do Caterpillar or John Deere look incapable of paying 250M? Is 250M really a reasonable estimate of their tax hit? Consider the source. For 100 years we have sat and watched the Caterpillars and John Deere's get richer and richer and richer. Now the whole shebang is tanking and the 99% can only argue with each other while the 1% look on in bemused silence. Thirteen pages of the right not listening to the left. I won't say or vice versa because, in truth, there are no lessons coming from the right that will help. They are what got us here! You cannot have a healthy economy if only 1% have more wealth than the rest 99%. Conservatives believe this is right and proper and desperately want back at the controls to continue the bloodletting. Me, I'm working on my exit strategy. You can bet the 1% have theirs. I predict the right will get this country back and they will fly it right into the ground because they now have Obama to blame when it crashes. Black skin will become a serious liability when a broken America is trying to piece itself back together. Socialism? You wouldn't know Socialism if it peed down your leg. More's the pity. This Capitalism you love so much is going to do a lot worse than make a pee stain on your polyester trousers.
H
I can't believe it but you found a way to play the race card on John Deere and Cat. (both can be owned by anyone and have large multi-racial workforces) Again I say that while they (Cat and JD) say it will hurt them it will hurt us all when they roll those cost down to the consumer........
So, they're complaining about being required to pay taxes on subsidies they already receive to support their retirees and you feel sorry for them?
So you think those SOCIALIST! subsidies should remain but be tax-free?
You do realize that the government provided that incentive because it costs the government less when the corporations partially subsidize the retirees' insurance.
When the corporations shift the retirees into Medicare, the government will foot the whole bill. This will cost the government MUCH more than the tax free subsidies to the corporations did.
This nasty ass-kick to the taxpayers in the HCR bill was explained over 2 months ago, here: "As more employers drop drug coverage, Congress won't be dispensing as many subsidies with the one hand that it can tax with the other, so revenue will fall. The retirees who lose private benefits will simply move onto Medicare, so public drug spending will also rise. The American Benefits Council, which represents the largest employers, estimates the tax will be a net loser for the government if just one out of four retirees is crowded out of private coverage." How Obamacare Will Cost Many Seniors Their Private Drug Insurance - WSJ.com
If the companies lose the credit they can just tell the retirees to move to medicare for their prescription drugs. Then the taxpayer will absorb the cost.
Or the companies can absorb the cost and pass it on to the consumer.
Since we are both the consumer and the taxpayer..we will have to cover this no matter which way they go.
If the companies lose the credit they can just tell the retirees to move to medicare for their prescription drugs. Then the taxpayer will absorb the cost.
Or the companies can absorb the cost and pass it on to the consumer.
Since we are both the consumer and the taxpayer..we will have to cover this no matter which way they go.
Especially true considering that many of their customers involve various governmental departments, thereby taxpayers will pay for it regardless..
A root canal by an average U.S. dentist is ~$1500 complete w/crown. That's about an hours work for the root canal and another hour later to fit the crown. The same root canal in Singapore is $100. Actually better. Doctors in Singapore are very, very well trained and highly competitive. American doctors are collectively the worst in the world but the most highly paid in the world. Obama's plans do not, cannot, address this but, addressing it must be done in order for there to be any semblance of reform in the health care industry.
H
?????
That is odd. The US medical training system has been ranked the best in the world. I guess morons have a different rating system.
So tell me, why do the ultra rich travel to the Mayo Clinic for thier treatment? Why do well to do Canadians come to America for orthopedic, cardiac, and transplant procedures?
I do case reviews for Medicare and the largest private insurer in the country. Most of the cases I do involve foriegn medical grads. Your insane "accusation" is completely baseless.
When did you become the czar who regulates how much money someone makes? Did you account number of hours worked, years of education, and the fact that most in the healthcare field were in the top 5% of their respective classes?
Fortunately, at least for now, socialists such as yourself do not dictate how much one's labor is worth and what they should do in life. It is odd that all the nazis have come out of the woodwork since Obama was elected. Authoritarian views and restriction of personal liberties are now in vogue.
Do Caterpillar or John Deere look incapable of paying 250M? Is 250M really a reasonable estimate of their tax hit? Consider the source. For 100 years we have sat and watched the Caterpillars and John Deere's get richer and richer and richer. Now the whole shebang is tanking and the 99% can only argue with each other while the 1% look on in bemused silence. Thirteen pages of the right not listening to the left. I won't say or vice versa because, in truth, there are no lessons coming from the right that will help. They are what got us here! You cannot have a healthy economy if only 1% have more wealth than the rest 99%. Conservatives believe this is right and proper and desperately want back at the controls to continue the bloodletting. Me, I'm working on my exit strategy. You can bet the 1% have theirs. I predict the right will get this country back and they will fly it right into the ground because they now have Obama to blame when it crashes. Black skin will become a serious liability when a broken America is trying to piece itself back together. Socialism? You wouldn't know Socialism if it peed down your leg. More's the pity. This Capitalism you love so much is going to do a lot worse than make a pee stain on your polyester trousers.
H
The operative phrase here is
" For 100 years we have sat and watched the Caterpillars and John Deere's get richer and richer and richer."
So you sat on your ass during that time period, while these two companies developed the best manufacturing companies in thier area, providing the world with the tools to build and feed themselves. All the while, you sat on your ass. Now, from your new authoritarian elite perspective, having contributed NOTHING to mankind, you feel the right to help tear down these institutions and punish them for providing jobs directly and indirectly to millions. What a pompous ass. Trying to cover Obama's incompetence with cries of "racism" has worn a little thin for everyone. It is not "racist" to point out and question insane detructive socialistic policies- it is good sense. Liberals lack that characteristic, so I would not expect you to understand.
Even though you are a liberal, you must eat food and need an income to survive. If we help to eliminate a few of the remaining large equipment manufacturers in the US, where do you suppose all those employees will work? For you? The libs have gone entirely crazy and do not understand that the nation needs private industry to employ the population and give them the opportunity to prosper. Without the hard work and tenacity of these companies (NOT THE GOVERNMENT) there would be no heavy equipment manufacturers in the US. The house that your lazy ass is sitting in was built by machines made by CAT, and the food you eat today is courtesy of John Deere. Send them a thank you note for helping to provide for your misereable liberal existence, rather than attempt to destroy them via marxist policy.
Handicapping these manufacturers with increased expenses is exactly why plants are moved overseas. Only an idiot would want that- however it is understandable that a liberal would want these things. As noted, the total cost of these programs is $650 per enrolle, while enrolling the same people in the medicare drug program is $1200. Industry and the feds benefit, and these large corporations continue to provide benefits for thier employees. This appears to be what YOU want-
1. Eliminate the medicare prescription corporate benefit
2. Eliminate the ablity of these companies to be able to provide for thier retirees, forcing them to cancel these plans and dumping these patients fully into medicare, lowering benefits for these people and increasing federal expenses
3. reduce the ability of these corporations to compete with foriegn compaines, forcing them to relocate manufacturing to nations other than the US.
4. Force layoffs at these companies and impair thier ability to add new jobs, thus adding to unemployment.
One can usually figure out what a liberal wants. Just consider the point of view that is most practical and makes the most common sense- then do the exact opposite.
I understand the liberals hate business and are anti-capitalist.
But you all work don't you ? Some of you probably work for big corporations even.
What is your answer to eliminating capitalism ? If you are out to destroy company profits then you are out to destroy capitalism you know.
State run industries ?
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
subsidies should remain but be tax-free? 
