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You have gaged my opinion of Mormonism almost correctly, although I think "extremely" is a bit hyperbolic. My goal is to shoe them there ae contradictions between the Bible and eh BOM.
Good luck with that. The "contradictions" are all in your point of view.
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While I am antagonist about their religion, that does not make me antagonist toward them If I was, they probably would not come back.
Well, you must be an awfully good cook. That's all I can say.
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I tell them right up front, I think the BOM is adding to Scripture, something the Bible tells us not to do, and that makes in not being from God.
No, the Bible does not tell us that. That's just your messed up interpretation of Revelation.
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One can be opposed to something and still be civil.
I've seen it happen, although so far, not with you.
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Since you have no evidence I am leading them on, you remark is out of line.
If they think you are even remotely open-minded to their beliefs, you are leading them on. If they know exactly how you feel, and that you only want to show them "the error of their ways," then that's their problem. As I said before, they must be awfully hard up for a decent meal if they're willing to meet with you weekly and listen to you tell them that they're "not saved" or that they "believe in the wrong Jesus" or whatever else you feel like throwing at them. I just wish I could talk to them and suggest that they not waste their valuable time on someone who is completely closed-minded about their religion. As a matter of fact, tell them that someone you know online has offered to send them a check to dine out on the night you generally feed them. Then they can spend their time talking to someone who is willing to consider the possibility that they might have something worthwhile to share with them.
As a matter of fact, tell them that someone you know online has offered to send them a check to dine out on the night you generally feed them. Then they can spend their time talking to someone who is willing to consider the possibility that they might have something worthwhile to share with them.
Your link doesn't work. Even though you posted it 3 or 4 times, it still doesn't work.
Vizio's post had to do with Christians having their rights taken away from them. I asked which rights were taken away for being Christian, not whether some Christians had done something that got the attention of the authorities. Now what function of the exercise of your religion has been taken away? Are you forbidden from attending services? Are you forbidden from wearing appropriate religious garments at appropriate times? Has your holy book been banned? Is somebody trying to prevent you from believing whatever you want to believe? Have you been prevented from praying in any way that is defining of your religion?
And I'm sorry that I don't have any specific ones ready at hand. We all know that there have been Christians bullied by those wishing to take away their rights. To suggest otherwise is dishonest. In any event, I don't much expect you to agree with me.
And I'm sorry that I don't have any specific ones ready at hand. We all know that there have been Christians bullied by those wishing to take away their rights. To suggest otherwise is dishonest. In any event, I don't much expect you to agree with me.
If I knew that, I would have posted some examples and agreed wholeheartedly with you. I'm not being dishonest. If you want my opinion, I think it seems at least somewhat dishonest to make a claim with no foundation whatsoever. So, I'll just ask again, "What Constitutional rights have been denied anybody in the US in our lifetimes because they are Christians?"
Some Constitutional rights:
Freedom of religion
Freedom of speech
Freedom of Assembly
Right to petition the government
Freedom of the press
Right to bear arms
Freedom from quartering soldiers
Protection against unreasonable search & seizure
Freedom from self-incrimination
Right to a speedy trial
Right to a trial by jury of ones peers
Freedom from unusual punishment
Right to due process under law
Right of citizens to vote
Anybody know of any of these that have been denied to anybody because they happen to be Christians?
If I knew that, I would have posted some examples and agreed wholeheartedly with you. I'm not being dishonest. If you want my opinion, I think it seems at least somewhat dishonest to make a claim with no foundation whatsoever. So, I'll just ask again, "What Constitutional rights have been denied anybody in the US in our lifetimes because they are Christians?"
Some Constitutional rights:
Freedom of religion
Freedom of speech
Freedom of Assembly
Right to petition the government
Freedom of the press
Right to bear arms
Freedom from quartering soldiers
Protection against unreasonable search & seizure
Freedom from self-incrimination
Right to a speedy trial
Right to a trial by jury of ones peers
Freedom from unusual punishment
Right to due process under law
Right of citizens to vote
Anybody know of any of these that have been denied to anybody because they happen to be Christians?
You want an example? How about using taxpayer money to fund Planned Parenthood? How about forcing the religious to offer birth control -- that which they are morally opposed to? http://www.nytimes.com/2016/03/19/op...ghts.html?_r=0
Are you going to be that dishonest that you seriously make the statement that no Christian has had their 1st Amendment rights taken away?
Heck, the entire Kim Davis fiasco is another great example. There are politicians at every level of US government that refuse to enforce laws, but you won't take them to task...but Ms. Davis decides to refrain from this law and you freak out.
You want an example? How about using taxpayer money to fund Planned Parenthood? How about forcing the religious to offer birth control -- that which they are morally opposed to? http://www.nytimes.com/2016/03/19/op...ghts.html?_r=0
Are you going to be that dishonest that you seriously make the statement that no Christian has had their 1st Amendment rights taken away?
Heck, the entire Kim Davis fiasco is another great example. There are politicians at every level of US government that refuse to enforce laws, but you won't take them to task...but Ms. Davis decides to refrain from this law and you freak out.
No, neither of those things have anything at all to do with a person's Constitutionally guaranteed rights. Planned Parenthood does not take anybody's rights away. Neither does the ACA. Your opinions about birth control have nothing to do with your ability to practice your religion as you see fit. Kim Davis was jailed for contempt of court.
You can't claim anything you don't like to government doing is an infringement of your right to practice your religion.
No, neither of those things have anything at all to do with a person's Constitutionally guaranteed rights. Planned Parenthood does not take anybody's rights away. Neither does the ACA. Your opinions about birth control have nothing to do with your ability to practice your religion as you see fit. Kim Davis was jailed for contempt of court.
You can't claim anything you don't like to government doing is an infringement of your right to practice your religion.
Except force us to violate our religion by going along with society on many moral issues, and even forcing us to pay for and provide things for others that we find morally wrong. But I did not expect you to agree with me. You rarely do.
Tell ya what....next time I see a major case of it I'll post it, as long as you don't get upset at the thought of me starting a thread.
Except force us to violate our religion by going along with society on many moral issues, and even forcing us to pay for and provide things we find morally wrong for others. But I did not expect you to agree with me. You rarely do.
Tell ya what....next time I see a major case of it I'll post it, as long as you don't get upset at the thought of me starting a thread.
Something you (or even a group of you) find morally wrong does not equal a violation of your Constitutional rights. Let me be clear. That doesn't make any particular thing right or wrong. It's simply that your own sense of morality does not equate into a Constitutional right. You are perfectly free to practice your religion as you see fit. So is everybody else. So far, I haven't seen a single case of the government forcing private individuals to do anything that violates a standard provision of a recognized religion. (I suppose somebody can make something up, but I'm talking about mainstream organized religions.)
Individuals in the US do not get to pick and choose which government programs their taxes support. Taxes collected from pacifists may be used to pay for military programs. If you think the moon landing was faked, you cannot forbid the government from using your tax money to fund NASA. That's just the way it is.
We always welcome new threads that are relevant to Religion & Spirituality.
Except force us to violate our religion by going along with society on many moral issues, and even forcing us to pay for and provide things we find morally wrong for others. But I did not expect you to agree with me. You rarely do.
Tell ya what....next time I see a major case of it I'll post it, as long as you don't get upset at the thought of me starting a thread.
As long as we're allowed to post counter-arguments, and you agree that we're allowed to be critical of the source. We're not going to capitulate and just accept that you're right 'because you say so'.
Speaking of which, I'll set out some criteria for both sides of the discussion to consider:
1) Being expected to obey employment laws and/or the requirements or oaths relating to any form of employment is not considered 'forcing' someone to violate their religion.
2) Being held to the same legal standard as the rest of society (with regard to the equality of all citizens under US/Canadian law) is not 'discrimination' or 'persecution'.
3) Religious institutions, or government employees, do not get a 'free pass' to break or disobey any law just because their religion disagrees with it (I'm looking at you, Kim Davis and Roy Moore).
If you can agree to those terms, post away and we'll consider whatever you choose to provide. We won't guarantee that we'll accept it at face value, but we'll give it a critical once-over and point out what we consider to be inconsistencies or logical flaws.
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