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So you already know that the more science finds out the more complicated it seems to get? And you don't see that as a hint that maybe nature is smarter than we are?
I never said science knows nothing, so don't repeat that one again. I said it can't know everything. Complex natural systems are ultimately beyond human comprehension.
he will avoid approaching this line of logic because it renders his statement of belief as "debunked". it has happened to him before, rather easily I might add.
humans are a data construct in a much larger data construct. he can't face that down because it makes his sect of atheism really very tiny. so he runs away as fast as he can, well, after he tries mocking, minimizing, and dehumanizing, and changing facts that is. When that doesn't work, he runs away. like any literalist basing their lives on a statement of belief about god does. His is "anti-god".
although I am not sure I agree with you totally, I can't side with his sect of atheism that needs deceit to recruit members. It reminds of some theist groups.
No I see it as a hint that the universe is "not only stranger than we imagine, it is stranger than we can imagine."
My dear lady you are doing it again: "science doesn't know everything, so it really knows nothing".
If that is not the case and you accept that what it DOES know is pretty reliable, then what it doesn't know, whether complex or simple, is irrelevant. So don't repeat that one again, eh?
That makes no sense. Materialists claim to know the nature of life, and of matter. The fact that you don't know the nature of life and of matter IS relevant.
Physical human brains produce what we experience as our conscious awareness with which we express intelligence.
Physical brains receive information from the physical senses about our 3D environment, and they output muscle movement. Our interaction with the 3D world (4D including time) depends on a physical brain, and body.
We have no reason to think conscious awareness is produced by the brain. And there is evidence against that idea. No evidence for it.
Physical brains receive information from the physical senses about our 3D environment, and they output muscle movement. Our interaction with the 3D world (4D including time) depends on a physical brain, and body.
We have no reason to think conscious awareness is produced by the brain. And there is evidence against that idea. No evidence for it.
What are you talking about???? Everything we use to perceive the existence of consciousness involves products of the brain. Explain this absurd claim of yours.
What are you talking about???? Everything we use to perceive the existence of consciousness involves products of the brain. Explain this absurd claim of yours.
We know a person is conscious because they communicate. The physical brain is required for communicating.
If a person were conscious but could not communicate you would think they were not conscious. If a person's brain was not working, you would think they were not conscious. But you would not know if they were conscious or not.
All signs of consciousness depend on a functioning brain.
Many kinds of evidence show consciousness that does not depend on a functioning brain. Materialists find ways to deny all this evidence. They deny any kind of evidence they don't like.
If the universe is conscious, that means consciousness is not created by brains. If you don't believe the universe is conscious, if you are a materialist, then you won't consider the evidence that opposes materialism. You will mindlessly follow Skeptic's Dictionary and other materialist resources.
Many kinds of evidence show consciousness that does not depend on a functioning brain. Materialists find ways to deny all this evidence. They deny any kind of evidence they don't like.
What evidence????
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If the universe is conscious, that means consciousness is not created by brains. If you don't believe the universe is conscious, if you are a materialist, then you won't consider the evidence that opposes materialism. You will mindlessly follow Skeptic's Dictionary and other materialist resources.
I know the universe is conscious from personal experience, but I await your evidence above.
Physical brains receive information from the physical senses about our 3D environment, and they output muscle movement. Our interaction with the 3D world (4D including time) depends on a physical brain, and body.
We have no reason to think conscious awareness is produced by the brain. And there is evidence against that idea. No evidence for it.
Except that we have never seen, experienced or interacted with consciousness without a brain being the seat of that consciousness. We know that if we do things to a brain, like electroshock therapy or a lobotomy, we can alter that consciousness. Using various medical devices and techniques we can track brain activity, and see how it is related to thoughts and emotions.
Every piece of evidence we have indicates that brains and consciousness are irrevocably linked. On the other hand, we have no evidence that consciousness exists independent of a brain. If you know of any evidence to the contrary, I invite you to present it.
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Originally Posted by Good4Nothin
We know a person is conscious because they communicate. The physical brain is required for communicating.
If a person were conscious but could not communicate you would think they were not conscious. If a person's brain was not working, you would think they were not conscious. But you would not know if they were conscious or not.
Sure, if you decline to use medical advances like electroencephalograms. Admittedly we do not have a fine and precise understanding as to exactly when consciousness fades from a brain, but a large part of this is because consciousness is a continuum, where on can have diminished capacity through trauma, without losing all consciousness and self-awareness.
However, nothing in that supports your thoughts. Nothing at all.
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All signs of consciousness depend on a functioning brain.
How can you say this, and contradict yourself with the rest of your statements. This is a superb case of cognitive dissonance.
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Many kinds of evidence show consciousness that does not depend on a functioning brain. Materialists find ways to deny all this evidence. They deny any kind of evidence they don't like.
Please bring some of this evidence to the discussion.
Quote:
If the universe is conscious, that means consciousness is not created by brains. If you don't believe the universe is conscious, if you are a materialist, then you won't consider the evidence that opposes materialism. You will mindlessly follow Skeptic's Dictionary and other materialist resources.
Can you show that the universe is conscious? Even mystic admits that he cannot, and assumes that based upon personal experience and faith that he cannot demonstrate.
Many kinds of evidence show consciousness that does not depend on a functioning brain. Materialists find ways to deny all this evidence. They deny any kind of evidence they don't like.
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Originally Posted by MysticPhD
What evidence????
Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin
If you already know the universe is conscious, then why are you waiting for evidence from me?
I asked for evidence specific to your claim that our consciousness does not depend on our functioning brain.
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I see it as a hint that the universe is "not only stranger than we imagine, it is stranger than we can imagine."
My dear lady you are doing it again: "science doesn't know everything, so it really knows nothing".
Everything we use to perceive the existence of consciousness involves products of the brain. Explain this absurd claim of yours.