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Without a mover, that’s just a cosmic accident. Not logical.
Irrational assertion.
If something exists (with or without a god), it must behave somehow and have properties. So even a cosmic accident is far far far more probable than an ultimate intelligence just existing.
Rationally speaking.
It can make an informed guess, and provide a plausible mechanism. While all that Creator-faith can do is point to an old book that is demonstrably wrong.
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Why you think a creator is “magic”, I do not understand.
I don't think a creator (natural) is magic at all, but natural. I don't think a creator (intelligent) is magic. I think it is imaginary.
What is magic is your claim of how life started. God did some magic. No explanation. No process. **Poof** and it was there. Magic.
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But, at this point, the only logical conclusion is a creator, of some sort. I don’t need faith to understand that.
There is nothing 'Logical', let alone evidence -based, about Creatorfaith. It is at best an intuitive conclusion of what god -apologists call 'imperfect human faculties'. It is, at worst, the result of religious indoctrination.
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Originally Posted by jimmiej
A creator/mover is the only logical conclusion, at this point. Science cannot tell us how life began.
And we get the broken record, again. Fingers in the ears, eyes squeezed shut, mouth open, chanting the same mantra. With of course the headslap 'Why can't they See what's so obvious to Me?" (Oh gosh, he's exasperated, he is so convinced that he is right, we must just suppose that we are merely obtuse and meekly accept what he says). There's a Book about you people, and we have read it.
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Originally Posted by jimmiej
I get that, but science can’t explain the origin of life.
More 'broken record. More fingers in ears, more eyes screwed shut. Yes it can. Plausibly and hypothetically. Godfaith can't. It just says 'magic'.
Last edited by TRANSPONDER; 11-16-2018 at 10:25 AM..
Not faith as traditionally defined by the religious, anyway. I have faith that the sun will set at 4:51 PM today here in Buffalo, 'cause Google just told me it would. Religious faith, of which irrationality is an essential component, is of a different nature than 'justifiable faith in reasonably predicted outcomes' and could of course be discarded if 'religion made sense'
The only people who use the term 'impossible' are Goddunnit -creationists in denial about a "possible" natural (without intelligent creation) origin of Life, the Universe and Everything.
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Originally Posted by jimmiej
Something frm nothing? Only a higher being could do that.
Infinite causation?
An unmovable mover?
And the Higher being came from where? Infinite causation (or infinite regression) seems absurd; Counter intuitive. Goddunnit ignores the question by saying a 'Greater' thing than the universe had no origin. It's even worse than having no explanation (even hypothetical) for the origins of life but a *poof* of magic.
Even if we both settled for "Don't Know" and a possible goddunnit like a possible somethingelsedunnit, that would still leave you with a fallacious God - claim based on nothing but Faith.
Which you don't claim as a "Possibility" but a life -changing Fact. Don't you see how your goddunnit - claim is based on non -evidence, non - logic and nonsense?
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Originally Posted by jimmiej
Without a mover, that’s just a cosmic accident. Not logical.
This is no more than saying that lightning is a weapon of vengeance, thrown by a god. You are like someone in denial about the natural 'electricity' explanation because 'who generated the electricity, anyway?'. It is parochial human thinking ..in fact worse, it is rejecting a better explanation because you don't want there to be any alternative to goddunnit.
There is at least a half - explanation for natural origins, but you keep repeating you bronze -age myth of a origin -less god sitting down and making it all out of Nothing.
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Originally Posted by jimmiej
Aren’t we humans a “complex intelligence”?
Yes. But only the religious claim that we popped out of nowhere by an act of magic. Others say, "I 'spect we growed".
Last edited by TRANSPONDER; 11-16-2018 at 10:41 AM..
Reason: usual corrections.
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A creator/mover is the only logical conclusion, at this point. Science cannot tell us how life began.
