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JeffBase, god - not all knowing. Just making a note so I know which of the many arguments do not apply to you.
Or God is all knowing, but in a construct that is beyond human capacity of understanding. Tell me, can you comprehend a being that always was/is? No, the human mind needs a beginning and ending.
Last edited by jeffbase40; 04-04-2019 at 01:11 PM..
Do you honestly see how wrong it is to falsely accuse someone of supporting slavery? I never did any such thing. Telll me, if you are only give a choice between two evils, does that mean you support or defend the evil choice if you pick the lesser of two evils?
Tell me, do you think this verse is approving slavery?
" Slaves, in reverent fear of God submit yourselves to your masters, not only to those who are good and considerate, but also to those who are harsh." - 1 Peter 2:18-25
I see it as only instruction on how to act in your current situation. That is not defending or supporting. It is no different than a high school teacher being firmly against war yet telling her students that they need to do their duty and register for selective service.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Last Amalekite 1Sam15
Tell me jeffbase, does this verse approve or condemns slaveory?
Ephesians 6:5 New International Version (NIV)
5 Slaves, obey your earthly masters with respect and fear, and with sincerity of heart, just as you would obey Christ.
You’re a real piece of work jeffbase
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
Merely a seeker of the truth. I'll never get it from atheists who cant see beyond their biased shields.
I’m merely seeking the truth also jeffbase. Can you please answer the question?
Does Ephesians 6:5 approv or condemn slavory?
Ephesians 6:5 New International Version (NIV)
5 Slaves, obey your earthly masters with respect and fear, and with sincerity of heart, just as you would obey Christ.
God also created free will. Sure He could command us to only do good things to each other. And then atheists would be belly aching how they are just slaves without true freedom.
Our faith isn't going to crumble because of a few verses that were applicable only to an ancient people.
All you are doing is demonstrating limited human rational. Black and white. If God is all powerful then He can do ANYTHING. But God doesn't operate that way. He isn't going to do anything that is contrary against His will. He isn't going to do anything that is sinful. He isn't going to violate free will. That doesn't make Him weak. That makes Him reliable and never changing. If there isn't a solution that doesn't violate free will then there isn't. I'm sorry if you are incapable of understanding that. The problem with your position is that you must ignore the NT scriptures that are anti-slavery, support your position on limited knowledge of the facts and even go against the logic of why God would approve of slavery. If God is evil why does He do loving things to man? Why did He take a part of Himself and endure hours of extreme physical torture just to save our sorry behinds? That is highly uncharacteristic of a God who does not love all of mankind.
Was that a counter argument?
I don't have to make excuses. I know God is real and loving. An immoral God would not have given us many gifts like the ability to share laughter. Again, man created slavery. Why is it God's responsibility to clean up our messes? If He outlaws one thing then you would complain about the next. Then it will be why doesn't God force everyone to drive the speed limit? Then you will complain about the lack of free will.
Permitting is not approving. I made a completely valid point. God permitted divorced. He hated it. Slavery is not the will of God and everyone will be equal in the next life as it should be.
You are making excuses for slavery in the Bible. God could of condemned it, he could have banned it and he could have set regulations prohibiting bother the beating and the raping of slaves. In your Bible he does none of that so either he didn't care or he wasn't able to do any of that. Your God had no problem condemning how osexual acts according to you, or eating a bacon and cheese sandwich, working on the Sabbath. Didn't he outlaw those as well as worshipping other Gods? Didn't his followers still have free will and still were told not to eat pork or shellfish or commit adultery. Do you think owning a slaw is less immoral than owning another person.
My counter argument was when you brought up your economic crisis of 2008 it was because man weakened the regulations on banking. Proper regulations minimize or prevent harms done by others. That is why banking and pollution are regulated and why rape and murder are illegal. Man's morality comes from man. If it came from God then eating a shrimp would be illegal and owning another person simply having g some minor regulstions.
Your claims that we will be all equal in the next life or that he made us having the ability to smiles are your unfounded assertions. I personally take the position that there is good and bad in each of us and that we as a group must have rules to ensure the best for us as a society. I support speed limits and banning slavery, rape and murder. I think people are less religious as they discover that it is society norms , customs reenforced by rules and regulatiins, not believing and accepting each word in a book written in another time and place that gives us our free and safe society. We are the ones responsible for both the good and bad and the ones that have taken responsibility for it.
I don't expect a God to do everything for me. What I would expect of him that if he set absolute moral standards that they would be moral. Slavery and the manner of how women are treated in that book are not to me, and most people of today moral. Making claims that I would expect a God to have everyone keep the speed limit is silly at best. I don't expect the law and the police to force everyone to maintain the speed limit nor do I do it all the time. I speed when road conditions are perfect and traffic is light and if caught I pay the price like I did in 1968 and 1972 when I got speeding tickets. I don't expect everyone to be perfect but I would expect God's rules, commandments and regulations to be so. That they are not and folks like you do all kinds of mental gymnastics to make him seem perfect. You don't even have to break God's rules to be a person doing bad things and that is why I believe that if there is a God he is not the God of those holy books.
The more we see how in perfect the Bible is, the less religious people will be. The more we see how imperfect the churches and the church leaders are the less we will be religious. They may still believe in a God but believe far less in your book as a perfect book of a God.
Do you honestly see how wrong it is to falsely accuse someone of supporting slavery? I never did any such thing. Telll me, if you are only give a choice between two evils, does that mean you support or defend the evil choice if you pick the lesser of two evils?
Tell me, do you think this verse is approving slavery?
" Slaves, in reverent fear of God submit yourselves to your masters, not only to those who are good and considerate, but also to those who are harsh." - 1 Peter 2:18-25
I see it as only instruction on how to act in your current situation. That is not defending or supporting. It is no different than a high school teacher being firmly against war yet telling her students that they need to do their duty and register for selective service.
Or that teacher being a war hawk. Your example fails because it is totally your interpretation that God was against slavery though that verse doesn't make that claim. It is you wanting your God to be as moral as yourself about slavery.
Or God is all knowing, but in a construct that is beyond human capacity of understanding. Tell me, can you comprehend a being that always was? No, the human mind needs a beginning and ending.
No, I can't comprehend it. Can you offer any evidence that such a being exists?
Do you honestly see how wrong it is to falsely accuse someone of supporting slavery? I never did any such thing. Telll me, if you are only give a choice between two evils, does that mean you support or defend the evil choice if you pick the lesser of two evils?
Tell me, do you think this verse is approving slavery?
" Slaves, in reverent fear of God submit yourselves to your masters, not only to those who are good and considerate, but also to those who are harsh." - 1 Peter 2:18-25
I see it as only instruction on how to act in your current situation. That is not defending or supporting. It is no different than a high school teacher being firmly against war yet telling her students that they need to do their duty and register for selective service.
I'm not falsely accusing you; I quoted you.
Yes, that verse is approving slavery. Slaves are being instructed to submit to their masters no matter how they are treated. Where are the masters being instructed to stop owning slaves?
Or God is all knowing, but in a construct that is beyond human capacity of understanding. Tell me, can you comprehend a being that always was? No, the human mind needs a beginning and ending.
Speaking for myself only, I have no problem with believing there is no 'beginning' or 'end' other than the possible beginning and end of this particular planet.
But even the way you asked that question makes me wonder if you question the 'always was' of your god without 'beginning and end'?
You saying , as a human being, you can't even comprehend your god not having a begining or an end?
Getting kinda confusing here
I’m merely seeking the truth also jeffbase. Can you please answer the question?
Does Ephesians 6:5 approv or condemn slavory?
Ephesians 6:5 New International Version (NIV)
5 Slaves, obey your earthly masters with respect and fear, and with sincerity of heart, just as you would obey Christ.
You are only here to mock Christians. I know your game.
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