Example of lunacy that shows that "god" isn't real (preaching, creationism)
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The problem is that the last time I checked, in 4 of the top 7 threads it was the theists who attacked first. In 2 of the threads everyone contributed. Only in 1 thread did an atheist attack first, the same atheist who is treated as an ally by the person who complains about atheists using puerile & vulgar terms by using puerile & vulgar terms himself.
Also, we progress by correcting false beliefs, and if the religious want to have false and irrational beliefs, that is for me in order. But when they post them for others to read, why should we not correct them?
Take a close look at you wording. You believe they are incorrect, so you decide to correct them. Keep this in mind. The topic can fall into, well, I forgot which one it is, sorry, either inductive or deductive reasoning.
When you say correct someone, from the get go, you are tend to close the opposing view individual into a defensive, and in some case, confrontational. In other words, a true open mind is not arguing from the stand point of correcting. He or she is arguing from the standpoint of comparing views, analyze them, and present counterpoints. At least that is how I approach arguments. In the management and HR classes that I teach, I have the students write research papers that give BOTH, their support for their thesis AND the opposing view support data also. That is how I handle group discussion in the classes. Many of my students see my approach as learning experience when they told to research on the views contrary to their own. It is not that easy to truly be open minded as we claim to be.
You have a great day.
elamigo
There is one but it doesn't stop Mr Phd from going there to push his god beliefs.
( even though proselytizing there is supposedly against the TOS)
In my view, so some proselytize. I do not care. I look at it from the standpoint of see how people explain their beliefs. In some cases, I may not agree with the theological view, BUT the point may have validity from the standpoint of philosophy. Even dung has use, to fertilize. The same way I see different points of views and opinions. In some cases, I have seen that idiotic ideas have something of values that I can use.
You have a great day.
elamigo
Take a close look at you wording. You believe they are incorrect, so you decide to correct them. Keep this in mind. The topic can fall into, well, I forgot which one it is, sorry, either inductive or deductive reasoning.
When someone argues a circle has four corners, I know I am correct. This is the same for some of the theists arguments, such as making arguments for a god that logically means that god can not exist.
Quote:
Originally Posted by elamigo
When you say correct someone, from the get go, you are tend to close the opposing view individual into a defensive, and in some case, confrontational. In other words, a true open mind is not arguing from the stand point of correcting.
If someone does not like facts, that is their problem, not mine. If a Christian wants to argue their god can not exist, that is not my problem. If a Christian wants to tell the Greeks they do not know the Greek language, that is not my problem.
Quote:
Originally Posted by elamigo
He or she is arguing from the standpoint of comparing views, analyze them, and present counterpoints. At least that is how I approach arguments. In the management and HR classes that I teach, I have the students write research papers that give BOTH, their support for their thesis AND the opposing view support data also. That is how I handle group discussion in the classes. Many of my students see my approach as learning experience when they told to research on the views contrary to their own. It is not that easy to truly be open minded as we claim to be.
You have a great day.
elamigo
I just deleted eighteen posts that were mostly off topic, personal bickering and name calling.
Let's get a few things straight. We discuss Religion and Spirituality in this forum. We don't discuss science or engineering, so there is rarely any reason to mention those things. Unless I missed something, nobody in this thread is trying to "eliminate religion" or is "fighting religion," so accusations of that are simply asking for an argument. Stop doing that. How many posts a person has made is rarely of any relevance to a discussion
If this bickering continues, infractions are likely. Some of you should make use of the "Ignore" function. Please do so.
When someone argues a circle has four corners, I know I am correct. This is the same for some of the theists arguments, such as making arguments for a god that logically means that god can not exist.
If someone does not like facts, that is their problem, not mine. If a Christian wants to argue their god can not exist, that is not my problem. If a Christian wants to tell the Greeks they do not know the Greek language, that is not my problem.
Then maybe the theists should find better data.
Good points, thanks.
I have a question. Why is your true and honest intent of interacting with this group? You already know they are trying to argue that a "circle has four corners."
As I have stated in other messages, why do atheists join the conversation of theist as they discuss their theological topics?
I admit I wonder what is the true intent of arguing with people you consider, I do not know, ignorant, naive, stupid, close minded, and on and on, take your pick.
In some ways you and other atheist are just like them. They are accused of proselytizing. Yet, It seem that atheist are doing the very same thing when they talk to them to show them the "truth" (convert them?).
Each side think they have the answer, and keep trying to show the other how wrong they are. That is what I see.
That remind me of a title of a book I saw somewhere "Why Argue with Idiots." Why do you want to argue with them when you believe you got the right answer, and YOU KNOW you are not going to convince them. Again, what is your true and honest intent to come to their forum to discuss?
The moderator has noticed what I am noticing, bickering. That is my whole point also. I agree with his assessment of the environment.
You have a great day.
elamigo
Last edited by elamigo; 06-21-2021 at 03:12 PM..
Reason: Forgot to include another point.
That remind me of a title of a book I saw somewhere "Why Argue with Idiots." Why do you want to argue with them when you believe you got the right answer, and YOU KNOW you are not going to convince them. Again, what is your true and honest intent to come to their forum to discuss?
The moderator has noticed what I am noticing, bickering. That is my whole point also. I agree with his assessment of the environment.
You have a great day.
elamigo
I occasionally argue with idiots because they pose a danger by voting and breeding. I may not change them but I get enough reps from lurkers who appreciate my efforts. That keeps me going.
Good points, thanks.
I have a question. Why is your true and honest intent of interacting with this group? You already know they are trying to argue that a "circle has four corners."
As I have stated in other messages, why do atheists join the conversation of theist as they discuss their theological topics?
I admit I wonder what is the true intent of arguing with people you consider, I do not know, ignorant, naive, stupid, close minded, and on and on, take your pick.
In some ways you and other atheist are just like them. They are accused of proselytizing. Yet, It seem that atheist are doing the very same thing when they talk to them to show them the "truth" (convert them?).
Each side think they have the answer, and keep trying to show the other how wrong they are. That is what I see.
That remind me of a title of a book I saw somewhere "Why Argue with Idiots." Why do you want to argue with them when you believe you got the right answer, and YOU KNOW you are not going to convince them. Again, what is your true and honest intent to come to their forum to discuss?
The moderator has noticed what I am noticing, bickering. That is my whole point also. I agree with his assessment of the environment.
You have a great day.
elamigo
1) I do not want to convert the idiots, I want to explain why they are wrong so that others can see why they are wrong. I want people to make a choice based on valid points, not bad data. Take creationism for an example. It is being sold as backed by science, but when you look at the data, this is not true. Or the idea that atheists are evil. Or in my country in the 1930's, that Jews were bad people.
2) It is a good way for me to practice my English.
In some ways you and other atheist are just like them. They are accused of proselytizing. Yet, It seem that atheist are doing the very same thing when they talk to them to show them the "truth" (convert them?).
Each side think they have the answer, and keep trying to show the other how wrong they are. That is what I see.
elamigo
My point is that there are two forums that the TOS is clear about.
In the Christianity forum, it is not allowed to question the existence of Jesus/God.
Likewise, it is against forum rules to proselytize in the Atheist forum.
It seems to be well adhered to in the Christianity forum.
This one is a free for all.
1) I do not want to convert the idiots, I want to explain why they are wrong so that others can see why they are wrong. I want people to make a choice based on valid points, not bad data. Take creationism for an example. It is being sold as backed by science, but when you look at the data, this is not true. Or the idea that atheists are evil. Or in my country in the 1930's, that Jews were bad people.
2) It is a good way for me to practice my English.
Practice is good but so is learning. What you don't agree with about the scientific claims in the R&S forum should also be a stimulus for YOU to learn more of the science you claim to know rather than expecting to have it spoonfed to you by others in the science forum.
My point is that there are two forums that the TOS is clear about.
In the Christianity forum, it is not allowed to question the existence of Jesus/God.
Likewise, it is against forum rules to proselytize in the Atheist forum.
It seems to be well adhered to in the Christianity forum.
This one is a free for all.
I'm not so sure I quite agree. At least not for me.
I think there's a distinct (well, maybe sometimes not too distinct) difference between stating a position/belief versus trying to persuade others to adopt that belief.
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