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I struggle with the fact that neither of my children will tell me the reason they have cut off relationship with me. My imagination can be quite active at times and I always come up with "it is my fault", what did I do wrong, what didn't I say that I should have said. Etc.
When I look back and think about when they were small and growing up, I do remember trying to encourage them about their lives, told them they were smart, they can do anything, etc. But of course there were times of discipline, too, that may have been stronger than it needed to be. If their father disciplined them, I always thought it was overkill and did interfere.
My children are not "kids"----- son is 53, daughter 55.
I'd like to forgive myself for something, but I don't know what that something is.
Curmudgeon 1)....I am angered and upset only when I think about certain things. Most of the time I am comfortable and content, although I am prone to boredom, but that's another thread (something to do with lower numbers of dopamine receptors). And I probably am more cynical than bitter, but also another thread.
I go back and forth about this in my head, 2) but maybe you can add your thoughts? I have not given up on a relationship with my daughter or even my sister, for that matter. 3) There are many scenarios in which I do not think it is appropriate to 'take sides'. Yours sounds like one of them.
However, to purposefully renew a relationship after several years simply because you want to and feel that no one should have any say in who you have relationships with? That does not seem reasonable to me. If someone had hurt my daughter deeply, and this actually did happen (it was my mother), then there would be no question in my mind about how to proceed. I don't expect everyone to do everything the way I would do it, but this seems quite self serving to me.
4) Adult children do not do everything right and I don't believe that the parent must always make the effort and sacrifice. Either I am a person of value or I am not. My daughter has never questioned whether I value her, she takes it for granted. She is not a child, but a fully grown 31 year old woman. And, as such, our relationship must move forward as two adult women who love, accept, respect, and need one another.
When my children were children I knew that it was pretty much a one way relationship. All give with very little take. But that changed the day they each reached adulthood.
1) Precisely why I only think about the past turmoil when I think relating it to someone having similar issues can benefit from some of my remarks which I hope prove helpful.
2) I'm not sure what, if anything, I can add. It's always so personal and individual and we all cope with it differently and even when there are similarities in the issues, they play out differently in every case. My coping was to never give up hope but at the same time I stropped having expectations because if you have no expectations you can never be disappointed. I also tried to be the bigger person so I could forever and always look back and honestly say, "No regrets!" as related to my behavior.
3) I agree on both counts.
4) Again I agree and it should be a two-way street. Sometimes you just have to, in your own mind, permit their behaviors and mistakes and hope they learn from them and eventually reach out to you to reestablish a mutually loving and giving relationship with you. I might suggest that you take your sister, her aunt, out of the equation. By keeping her in it you're giving her power over your emotions and your relationship with your daughter. I don't think you mean to do that. I always try to distance myself from toxic people even if they're related.
I hope somewhere in all this there's something that will help.
We are all individuals, interpret things in our own ways, handle or not handle painful situations.
As I mentioned before, my ex-husband sexually abused our daughter. He did it when I was hospitalized with a nervous breakdown. That was when she was approximately 11 years old. She waited till she was 20+ to tell me (at the time I was divorcing her father). I would have divorced him so much sooner if I had known this. But that is a lost opportunity.
Not long after the divorce, she decided to favor her father over me, cutting me out of her life completely. That was a real stunner for me. Why would she do that? I had tried to help her (yes, definitely too late), but made an effort, took her to counseling, etc. Even a GYN to help her with a problem she was having). He came out of the exam room very angry and said to me "don't you EVER bring your daughter here again." I don't know if anyone here can understand how that all just about killed me. What the heck???? That doctor did not tell me what happened, so I guessed. She was very promiscuous (no surprise) and ended up so diseased she needed surgery a few times and was not able to have children later (for which she blamed everyone).
So my message here is this: Your child can do some pretty horrendous things to herself, to you, to others. You can be very hurt, betrayed, confused, maybe even hateful toward that child.
But I found if I remained miserable because of things she did but blamed so many others, I probably would have at some point in my life killed myself. The hurt, disbelief, betrayal...... so so hurtful.
But we have a choice! And I'm glad I made it for my life. I had to let go. Her problems didn't have to be my problems. Only if I wanted them to be mine, I could be the martyr. I realized there was a life for me to live without her in it. It's hard in the beginning, but if I did it, I believe most people can do it, too. It's called survival.
My daughter is 20 years younger than me. Our problem has been ongoing for a very long time. A while ago she contacted me because she said she wanted to make things "right" with me. I cautiously agreed to a meet up. On our 2nd meet, she told me how a former boyfriend gave her a permanent STD.
At my stage in life, I don't want to hear about it.
Wow...as a childhood sexual abuse survivor myself, that's outrageous. And you don't know why she's not in your life?
This is where my dander stands straight up. I can feel the strong emotion you evoke when I read your words and I wonder about it. I have examined it adnauseam. I do see your point although it is not the same as a person's parent .... at all. AND just because she is related does not mean she has to be in anyone's life. You don't pick your family.
My daughter never even liked my sister, she admitted this to me several years ago before things went south between my sister and me. Every time I think of my daughter sitting amicably somewhere and chatting with my sister it evokes a very strong negative emotion in me.
What do I do with that emotion? Hide it? Pretend it's not there? Repress it? I can't look at my daughter and feel valued when I know that she refuses to make this sacrifice for our relationship. I'm just not worth it.
Oldwoman, I have been following your posts, and feel for you.
I am trying to put myself in your place and yes I totally understand your feeling of betrayal and anger.
Maybe you can think of it this way. You have a relationship with your daughter that is independent of all her other relationships. Maybe you can focus on that.
You can also explore with her why she feels drawn to her aunt, even though she disliked her before. and listen to it without comment as if you are talking about a stranger.
When you get angry replace it with thought of your daughter, when she was young, your feelings then. Recall the times when things were good between you. Take out some old pictures and look at them and capture that feeling in your heart. Count her good qualities, her strengths.
Focus on making yourself happy. You only have power over yourself, nobody else. Only sacrifice you can expect is your own, you cannot make anyone else do it. Sacrifice your anger for your peace of mind.
I know these things are easily said and hard to follow. but it will release you from that hard feelings you arrying.
Is it possible that your daughter at age 11 blamed you for not being there to protect her from her father and has latently at times, actively at others resented you for it even though you were gone at the time?
If that's the case it makes no real sense but it would appear she's been rebelling ever since.
Location: Finally the house is done and we are in Port St. Lucie!
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I can only relate what I have gone through. I am estranged from my biological mother. This is between her and I. My daughter is an adult and she knows why I have cut ties with my bio mother. I have enabled my kids to decide with whom they want to contact or not.
She has reached out to my bio mother and has told me that she has. I don't bear her any animosity for doing so. She has a right to talk to, have a relationship with whomever she wants. I have let her know that she may get hurt but I will be there to pick up the pieces if she needs me.
For myself, I have raised my kids to be independent of me. They are old enough to make their own choices. I am not there to make those for them. I am here to give them my love and support in whatever they chose. I will not make them chose between someone or me. She loves me and shows it all the time. As far as I know, the communication between her grandmother and her are pretty limited to very occasional phone calls. I think my daughter is trying to facilitate a reunion of sorts but I don't think I am ready to be opened up to that hurt that I know will follow.
I guess what I am saying is don't we wish to have our children live independent from us? I get why my daughter wants that contact. To her it is all about family. She has always been the child that will take people under her wing. Sometimes to the detriment of herself. She is who she is. I love her compassion for people including those to whom I don't feel compassion towards. I am definitely more jaded than she is.
Is it possible that your daughter at age 11 blamed you for not being there to protect her from her father and has latently at times, actively at others resented you for it even though you were gone at the time?
If that's the case it makes no real sense but it would appear she's been rebelling ever since.
I think Curmudgeon has nailed it. She was sexually abused by her own father. Although it's irrational and makes no sense, she is still traumatized and lashing out. She has not come to terms with what happened to her. In other words, she is messed up mentally and still feels the trauma. She is hurting just as you are NYgal.
I think she is coming to you for comfort and help. She's reaching out to you in the only way she can. In other words, she needs you and loves you. It's a strange way of showing it but she is trying in her own way. This could be an opening for the two of you but you would have the difficult task of accepting her the way she is. Yes, it's probably disgusting to have to listen to her and she angers you. It would be very difficult to calmly accept her but if you could, that might be the beginning of getting your daughter back.
I have a sister I will never speak to. I don't want to and I do not even speak her name. But in your case, you seem to want your daughter back. It seems that if you could put your anger (rightful anger) aside and listen to her and really be sympathetic, the rift between you could be healed. One thing that helped me is knowing that no matter how much you are hurting, the other person could be hurting even more. I think you should call or see her and listen to her. Help her. Accept her as she is no matter what. Both of you have been through a lot. If you accept her and help her, eventually I think she will do the same for you and she will start to understand how hard this has been for you. She is reaching out in her own way but you need to reach back. Please don't take this the wrong way--and I haven't followed the entire story but I do think in her own messed up way, she is reaching out to you for help. The next step is up to you--reject her or accept her. Both of you have been hurt badly but I think you are the more mature and capable person--you can get her back by accepting her as she is.
Is it possible that your daughter at age 11 blamed you for not being there to protect her from her father and has latently at times, actively at others resented you for it even though you were gone at the time?
If that's the case it makes no real sense but it would appear she's been rebelling ever since.
I am sure there has been and continues to be a lot of blame. And since she prefers a relationship with her father (the abuser), it's obvious to me it is still my fault in her opinion. Both of my kids suffered when I was hospitalized with the breakdown. And it didn't help a lot that their father told them they were the reason for my breakdown. I had a lot of work to do when I finally recovered and could listen to them and help them understand that they had nothing to do with it.
I can't think of anything worse than sexual abuse done to a child. I don't think that child ever really "gets over it". And they somehow carry the wrong thought that they deserved it or that it was their fault. Then pile on top of that the abuser threatens the child with hurting the mother if she ever tells. Can you even imagine the load that kid carries?
Once she knew her father and I were splitting up, she was able to tell me about it. She was 20. I did try to help her, took her to counseling, tried to comfort her that it was not her fault, it was wrong, wrong, wrong. Once her brother found out he flipped out and said she is lying. He kept after me, it's not true, Mom, she's lying to you. It never happened. That caused quite a bit of trouble between both kids. I stuck by my daughter. I believed it was important to support her and believe her. Why would she lie about that?
More time passes, years actually. Son gets married. Has three kids. Son, daughter, daughter. My son must have inherited the cheating gene from his father, tells his wife he's leaving her for another woman. His oldest daughter accuses him of sexual molestation. My daughter calls son's wife and tells her that she believes he did it....... now she isn't sure who abused her, her father or her brother. So my son is arrested and sent to prison for five years and five years on paper. His future is pretty wrecked. Once you are accused and serve time for sex offense, it is written on your driver's license and not kept a secret.
My daughter could have but chose not to bring charges against her father.
So the million dollar question....... did he (ex and/or son) do it?
I invite anyone who would like to have lived through that and then tell me what went wrong..... I'd be curious to hear what you might say. I can guarantee you nobody wants to take up the offer.
I thank everyone here and Moderator is correct - so many on this thread are in pain. It make no sense to be hurtful towards each other or to judge. I have always been an open book about my life. No secrets however there are a couple of things I wish to keep private as they do relate to my daughter and it's her decision to share it not mine. I respect her that much.
I love my daughter but she has hurt me so much. I am scared to death I will get so hardened. I want her to call and ask me to lunch but at the same time, it scares me. Will she lash out? I don't know.
Have a good day tomorrow - Hugs to all!
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