Please give me 10 reasons why NOT to move to the Austin area. (Houston: deductible, exemption)

[NETransplant]

oh...and one other thing...

in regard to the sunsets and sunrises, horselover....

all places have an east and west...not just Texas.....

[Moonlady]

Well, I get it for 2 reasons - my DH is a Texas native (Houston area) and when I took him to the breathtaking, majestic Rocky's, he was overwhelmed. On the last day of the trip I asked him how he felt about the beautiful scenery all around us and he said "too many rocks". So, OK, not everyone likes the same scenery! I also had a boss who was born and raised in West Texas. I was raised on the east coast and we took a business trip there and I was remarking about how beautiful all the tall trees were and he said he "hated it" because he couldn't see the horizon!

So, I don't think you can argue personal taste...that's what it is after all.

[TexasHorseLady]

And again, NETransplant, you prove my point. You don't seem to be able to help yourself, bless your heart!

[Lakewooder]

Listen to the wise lady!

[romesq]

Originally Posted by TexasHorseLady

And again, NETransplant, you prove my point. You don't seem to be able to help yourself, bless your heart!

THL, something tells me that the import of "bless your heart" will not be understood by NET . . . .

[TexasHorseLady]

I suspect you're right, romesq!

all places have an east and west...not just Texas.....

Yes, they do. Not all places have broad horizons, though, that make it easier to enjoy the entire sunrise or sunset.

[twange]

Originally Posted by NETransplant

I'll agree that most of you make valid points, and I guess I do come across a bit arrogant, etc. But you all have to admit that HorseLady is off her damn rocker...what the hell kind of idiot gets sick of natural beauty (oh, and the blue bell ice cream blows, btw)...this woman is whacked...

opinions on cities, etc are subjective, based on one's preference, experiences, etc. I don't like Austin for several reasons, as I am sure many people have a disdain for NYC, etc....it's all relative....but I'll hold true to the points that I have made about austin...heat is a fact, not an opinion...awful sprawl is fact, not opinion...etc, etc, etc

As a born and bred yankee from the Great Lakes region who has spent much time in the NE, I'm sort of embarrassed at this poster's tone. Not personally embarrassed, mind you, but socially disappointed. Like when a member of your family makes a public ass of themselves. They are "your people" but you find yourself slowly inching away from them, just in case bullets start flying.

Guilty by association...

Anyway, NEtransplant. While I do agree with you about Austin's lack of walk-ability and public transportation options(it's very poor comparative to other cities of it's size), your style, name-calling and general vitriol towards Austin and its admirers is divisive and counter-productive. Austin is a fast-growing city with many awkward characteristics that seem to work against the city's potential at times. Unlike cities of the NE, Austin began developing well after the auto became ubiquitous. But all cities go through cycles and growth/decline patterns. Austin is in it's late adolescent stage at the moment - that clumsy time when it can be hard to fully determine what the end result will look like. Whether or not the city gets properly nurtured to become a fully, mature adult remains to be seen. If you are unable to be happy here while the city "loses its tail", so to speak, then maybe you should leave. While dissent is absolutely crucial, Austin's future needs are best met with well considered ideas and solutions.

As to the hostility towards newcomers, I haven't really experienced too much. I think human interaction is mostly like looking in a mirror - you get what you put into it...

I will say that just going by this board alone, there are generally two dominant groups:

1.) Newcomers who criticize the city for what to them, seems to be an egregious lack of public amenities(particularly for the city's size). Mostly, these are people from larger, often older, more established cities with 1-2 centuries head start on Austin in terms of infrastructure. Their observations are not necessarily wrong, but can come off as arrogant and insensitive to those content with Austin as currently constituted.

2.) Long-time residents, who because of their affection for what Austin was years ago(when they either moved here or were born), automatically resist any change, even if it's positive and good - especially when the idea comes from someone who isn't originally from here, i.e. outsider. They often project a jingoist and provincial tone that can be just as divisive and counter-productive. How could your opinion count when you're not a native?

Often newcomers see things very quickly and clearly, simply because they are in a heightened state of observation. Because they are new here, the tendency is to look really hard and possibly over-analyze their new surroundings. This of course can lead to inaccurate and/or unfair comparisons to their previous city. But it can also be very illuminating.

Folks who have lived in one place a long time can become jaded and so accustomed to their own behavior, attitude and surroundings, that they may be unaware of a city's problems and shortcomings(lack of sidewalks and public transportation for instance). They're simply living their life in a way that they are used to doing. This happens in every city. Conversely, they also have the benefit of having a long perspective of the city's history, trends and therefore are more in tune with local sentiments and personality.

Both of these viewpoints are critical to any city's health.

[TexasHorseLady]

I agree with you that newcomers to anything can often see things from a different perspective - though Austin, by its very nature, is made up of people who have at one time or another been "newcomers". However, it's also important to determine what is a true shortcoming and what is simply different from where the newcomer came from. Lack of sidewalks, for example, for some is anaethema, when, in fact, many of us have been walking on the roadsides, sans concrete, quite successfully and happily for decades - here or elsewhere, as it happens. So that would, to someone who is accustomed to sidewalks and doesn't want to get dirt or grass on the bottoms of their shoes, evidently, be a shortcoming; to someone else, it would not be.

Myself, I don't care either way. I can walk on the roadside without sidewalks (as my children learned to do when they were little), or I can walk on sidewalks (though the latter is not as good for my plantar fasciitis - not crazy about living in a house with a slab foundation, prefer pier and beam, for the same reason). I'm not hampered by either situation.

Newcomers, having given their feedback, need to understand that just because that's how they did it back in Wherever, that doesn't mean that it's a shortcoming in Austin not to do it that way or not to have whatever "amenity" they consider vital. Some such amenities have been proposed (usually by "newcomers") and considered and repeatedly rejected by Austin voters, for example - the City Council here is famous for making us say "No!" over and over and over and over again until they finally wear us down, much like a two-year-old having a tantrum until it gets its way - but I digress, and that's another topic for another time.

Long-time residents need to listen to what the newcomers have to say, consider it, and either accept or reject that it's something that is needed or would be a true enhancement to life in Austin - not life in NYC, not life in California, not life in D.C., but life in Austin. They are not the same places and, thankfully for all of us, they don't need to be identical or have identical amenities and approaches to life in order to be valid, worthwhile, functioning communities. Thus, there is a place for all of us, and if you come to Austin and find that it's not your cup of tea, you have the choice of moving to one of those places that is - you don't have the choice of making Austin over into a semblance of where you came from. Not without a fight, you don't.

[twange]

I had a feeling you were going to pounce on my use of the word "shortcoming". I considered and reconsidered using it, but in the end decided to keep it. IMHO, Austin's lack of pedestrian infrastructure is a shortcoming for a city of it's size. This is not based only on my hometown, but on all the cities I have ever visited - tiny, small, medium, large and giant. That doesn't mean I hate Austin. It does not mean I want it to be NYC. It's just an objective observation by someone who ranks walk-ability very high on a city's amenity list. No city is perfect, but why is it that even hinting a criticism on this board gets you the "stop trying to change Austin" lecture. Cripes! I'm a pretty reasonable person. But I'm sure you won't be the last...I bet if I started posting under a different name, saying I've lived here for 40-50 years, reaction would be different.

I'm a little disappointed that you sort of turned my post into an "us vs them" conversation, as if everything proposed by a "newcomer" has to pass some sort of long-timer sensibility test. Long-timers aren't the only citizens here who get to vote, pay taxes, support local business, send their kids to schools, go hear music, actually play music, etc...Nor were my comments meant as a "this is how it was where I came from" statement. If that's how you interpreted that post, maybe I need to work on my writing skills.

As per sidewalks and pedestrian infrastructure, my argument is based on safety, sustainability(as in getting more people to walk instead of driving for every little thing), and increased foot traffic which benefits small local businesses...it's not for fear of "getting my shoes dirty". Was that simply sarcasm? And for the record, I'm talking about Central Austin and it's neighborhoods, not rural areas with dirt roads. That's obviously not an issue since traffic is light and there's much more space between houses and such.

When I see someone in a disability scooter or a wheelchair, trying to negotiate their way through auto traffic, around utility poles, tree roots, gravel, 6 inch high curbs...I see a severe lack of walking culture and infrastructure. To me this is a UNIVERSAL CITY ISSUE, not a scheme to make Austin NYC. Any city with a substantial population should have adequate sidewalks. Hell, even most traditional small towns have good sidewalks, at least in their business districts. If Austin wants to be considered green, it needs to address this, otherwise it's all bunk. YOU might be able to walk in the street comfortably where you live, but where I live, walking around and biking is kind of dangerous. Can I do it? Of course I can. I could walk to Canada if I wanted to...that's not the point. You can simply tell by the design that walking is an afterthought and I think that's a shortcoming. If that's unreasonable to you, I'm not sure what else I can say

[TexasHorseLady]

You might note that I said that I was fine with or without sidewalks. I also said that old timers needed to look at what newcomers had to say and evaluate it as to whether it might be a welcome addition or not so much, rather than outright rejecting anything they have to say. Perhaps then you won't be so disappointed, and will see that I tried to acknowledge that both have their place.

Sidewalks are a side issue to the primary one of just HOW new ideas are accepted (and presented, for that matter), and why, for that matter.