Gay marriage in California (dangerous, centers, estimated)

[katnip kid]

Originally Posted by jaijai

I certainly think homosexuality is natural but if it's "nature's birth control" it's not working very well.
We've got a population situation that is a bit out of control.
I imagine that what truetimbers said is true .... the percentage of homosexuals in any given population has remained roughly the same throughout time. That's just my guess although i think that there are stats to back that up? How valid they are, again, i don't know.
There are certainly many more homosexuals living openly though so it could seem that the population is increasing.

I doubt that stats would be easy to come by. For many reasons, many bi or gays indeed do get married and procreate. I have said it before, everyone already knows lots of gays,married or not, you just didn't know they were gay because they didn't tell you. They and their spouses think it is nobodies biz. When I came out, an older man told me there are actually many more men who are more or less bisexual than there are who are out and exclusively gay. I found this to be quite true! I also was surprised at who I would run into at events and bars! If all the married bi men and women could be openly gay and did not need to marry and have kids, that may affect the population more. Also, we are living longer due to improved medical care, vaccinations, and so forth. Food is also more readily available, at least for those in first world countries. Famine is less of an issue for some, at least for now.

[nullgeo]

Originally Posted by LeftyTrav

Folks would probably have a better outlook towards liberals such as yourself if you didn't consistently browbeat others perceived lack of intelligence when attempting to argue a point. Is it an insecurity issue with you?

Now then, moving fwd ... (had to finish my sandwich before addressing the really amusing part of what you wrote) ...
Along the lines of "Folks [having] a better outlook towards" others:
um, obviously you don't find anything hilarious or ironic about your statement coming from a conservative who has posted an anti-gay diatribe including drawing such parallels as beastiality, incest, and other amazingly disconnected perversions into the conversation?

Follow your own line of thought there ... you know, the part about what others might think better of if ....

Just sayin'

[jaijai]

Originally Posted by katnip kid

I doubt that stats would be easy to come by. For many reasons, many bi or gays indeed do get married and procreate. I have said it before, everyone already knows lots of gays,married or not, you just didn't know they were gay because they didn't tell you. They and their spouses think it is nobodies biz. When I came out, an older man told me there are actually many more men who are more or less bisexual than there are who are out and exclusively gay. I found this to be quite true! I also was surprised at who I would run into at events and bars! If all the married bi men and women could be openly gay and did not need to marry and have kids, that may affect the population more. Also, we are living longer due to improved medical care, vaccinations, and so forth. Food is also more readily available, at least for those in first world countries. Famine is less of an issue for some, at least for now.

It's my understanding (from the latest research and insight) that human sexuality is on a spectrum ... that's it's not always black and white and that on one end of that spectrum are people who are "totally" heterosexual and that on the other end there are people who are "totally" (i can't think of a better word at the moment) homosexual and that there are a whole lotta people between those two extreme ends or poles.
Perhaps it's the people floating around in between those two ends of the spectrum and who can't be o.k. with it that more nebulous place (who are probably not even conscious of it) who have issues with homosexual expression.
I don't know .... just a thought.

[LeftyTrav]

Originally Posted by nullgeo

Now then, moving fwd ... (had to finish my sandwich before addressing the really amusing part of what you wrote) ...
Along the lines of "Folks [having] a better outlook towards" others:
um, obviously you don't find anything hilarious or ironic about your statement coming from a conservative who has posted an anti-gay diatribe including drawing such parallels as beastiality, incest, and other amazingly disconnected perversions into the conversation?

Follow your own line of thought there ... you know, the part about what others might think better of if ....

Just sayin'

A couple of corrections for you...

I'm not conservative, except with my money. In the end, I err towards being a centrist. I am for abortion, against religion, lean towards gun control that works, and sadly voted for our current POTUS.

If that makes me a conservative in your mind, knock yourself out. Just don't wait too long.

You were the one who brought beastiality into the conversation, not I.

[nullgeo]

Originally Posted by LeftyTrav

A couple of corrections for you...

I'm not conservative, except with my money. In the end, I err towards being a centrist. I am for abortion, against religion, lean towards gun control that works, and sadly voted for our current POTUS.

If that makes me a conservative in your mind, knock yourself out. Just don't wait too long.

You were the one who brought beastiality into the conversation, not I.

Wrong!
I brought necrophilia into the conversation ...
... of course, I didn't bring it (necrophilia) -- or any other ridiculous parallel into play in any serious context to use as a possible consequence of allowing gay marriages -- such as you brought incest into play.

As for your positions on the other issues: well I'll be hornswaggled! You had me fooled there sport! For real? Talk about jumping to conclusions! Much as you assume I am a liberal. Well, well, well, guess we both be eating shoe-leather for supper tonight!

[LeftyTrav]

Originally Posted by nullgeo

Wrong!
I brought necrophilia into the conversation ...
... of course, I didn't bring it (necrophilia) -- or any other ridiculous parallel into play in any serious context to use as a possible consequence of allowing gay marriages -- such as you brought incest into play.

As for your positions on the other issues: well I'll be hornswaggled! You had me fooled there sport! For real? Talk about jumping to conclusions! Much as you assume I am a liberal. Well, well, well, guess we both be eating shoe-leather for supper tonight!

I apologize then....it must have been someone else bringing in beastiality. But it wasn't myself.

As for my own conclusion-jumping, I only hung the label on you based on the many posts of yours I have read....going back long before I joined. If I'm wrong about that, I again apologize.

Carry on....

[TrueTimbers]

Originally Posted by LeftyTrav

Is that what your extensive research has told you....or do you just parrot what others tell you?

Not research, just observant life experience...

I do not parrot, it is not in my nature, I am an old fashioned rural person that draws my own conclusions... and yes I am an eclectic pagan, which means I follow no ones path but my own on spiritual stuff..

[TrueTimbers]

Originally Posted by jaijai

I don't think that i stated that it's only religious beliefs that create intolerance toward homosexuality.
And actually, like TrueTimbers said, it's people's discomfort with their own sexuality and/or sexuality in general that is the root of the intolerance.
Religious doctrine, beliefs, dogma, etc. simply support the intolerance .... toward homosexuality as well as other aspects of human expression / behavior.
And yes, the notion that government sanctioned marriage between homosexuals will lead to the allowance of a brother marrying a sister (as an example) is totally absurd. It won't happen.
And coming "out of the closet" as a gay or a lesbian is a healthy expression / manifestation of human freedom and is part of a process of getting beyond intolerance toward those who are different ... not harmful!
Incest is harmful (on a number of levels) and comparing the two is just stupid.
Your basic argument is semi-intellectual, abstract nonsense.

Oh you always make so much sense and say things in such an articulate way....... Pretty soon I am going to just post... "ya what jaijai said"

[TrueTimbers]

Originally Posted by nullgeo

You may label me a liberal ... though I have never -- ever, in any context at any time -- considered myself such ... and I could give you quite a lot of fun reasons why ... but we'll skip that ...

Lables are rather silly......One could have fun though freaking people out though with some of the reasons though....

[Flame Angel]

Originally Posted by nullgeo

Again, thanks be that you have wandered over here to the California forum ... it will be so very much fun to watch you interact with a number of folks here who actually have a brain

Hey, and you picked a really non-sequitur kinda post to enter the fray ... nothing you say really follows at all your quote of what I posted

Originally Posted by nullgeo
Oh, here we go again ... the C D forum anti-gay crusader has saddled up to sound the alarm ...
Back up your statement with actual data, statistics ... not just your survey of your own local parish anti-gay supporters. I would be curious to review ... and I don't even contend what you say ... it may or may not be so. What I do note is that you have a history here of trying to speak for others without being appointed spokesman. So if the interior is anti-gay -- show us how you know such to be true.

In any case though, with regard to your statement I bolded above: we should follow your advice because, well, Flame Angel says it is so?

As always, you have consumed a fair number of worlds, but managed to say little of anything.

My statement stands.

And I will leave you with some wisdom. Try to let it soak in.

It isn't true because I say its true.

I say its true because it IS true.

You seem to always get the cart in front of the horse, which may work with a bulldozer and a scraper, but not where logic is concerned.

Now, back to your regular programing.

PS I AM in California.

Same Sex is NOT marriage. It is something else. I am not against it per se, it just isn't marriage.