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Amen to that! Very well said. I certainly believe in Eternal Destruction, but have recently been shown it in an awesome new light that sheds further glory on God's amazing LOVE and goodness. I gave a quick summary in another thread but I will repost it for you here.
Guilt is positional...One does not have to FEEL guilty to BE guilty...
You know, we could debate UR vs. ET vs. CI until the end of time ... The truth is that coming to believe in and truly understand the truth of the doctrine of UR is as much a heart thing as it is a head thing, and many people at this time just don't have the heart for it, so it doesn't matter if it is or can be proven one way or the other.
Out of the treasure of the heart the mouth speaks ... If someone truly loves another person, they would never give up on them. Some people can understand that, but many cant.
I agree Ironmaw it gets tobe tedious going around in circles, and you right to say it's a heart thing too,and the comviction i have in my heart is UR is of God,and if i stood back to see what that treasure i am drawing from my heart was continually,God is against us,he hates sin and sinners,according to some,wrath,hell and judgement i would hope that i was open enough to God to at least admit something is not quite right.Basically neglecting the more important parts of the law justice, mercy and faithfulness. Don't you find it odd that Jesus said they were neglecting justice,and the fundy believes justice 100% of the times means God is going to condemn to ETor annihilation those who don't accept there message.
And there is the issue - what is He against? I think we all live by the motto that "God hates sin but loves the sinner", so where does that leave us? What then is God's purpose in redemption?
To separate the sin from the sinner.
Isn't that what He does in a believer? To be sure, the Cross is meant to put to death the natural man, because the only way to "cure" the flesh is to kill it. So we come to judgment, to wrath and to fire...
And there is the issue - what is He against? I think we all live by the motto that "God hates sin but loves the sinner", so where does that leave us? What then is God's purpose in redemption?
To separate the sin from the sinner.
Isn't that what He does in a believer? To be sure, the Cross is meant to put to death the natural man, because the only way to "cure" the flesh is to kill it. So we come to judgment, to wrath and to fire...
I really like this post!!
God lets Esau (the flesh) have its way, until it's time for Jacob (the Spirit) to inherit the blessing..
Sodom is destroyed and then restored.
16 Therefore all they that devour thee shall be devoured; and all thine adversaries, every one of them, shall go into captivity; and they that spoil thee shall be a spoil, and all that prey upon thee will I give for a prey. 17 For I will restore health unto thee, and I will heal thee of thy wounds, saith the LORD; because they called thee an Outcast, saying, This is Zion, whom no man seeketh after. (Jer. 30)
And there is the issue - what is He against? I think we all live by the motto that "God hates sin but loves the sinner", so where does that leave us? What then is God's purpose in redemption?
To separate the sin from the sinner.
Isn't that what He does in a believer? To be sure, the Cross is meant to put to death the natural man, because the only way to "cure" the flesh is to kill it. So we come to judgment, to wrath and to fire...
Indeed, God hates sin, but loves the sinner. He desires all men came to Him, but he knows it will not happen. This is why he fortells the stories of separating sheep and goats, good fish from bad fish, and weeds from grains.
Matthew 13:47-50 “Once again, the kingdom of heaven is like a net that was let down into the lake and caught all kinds of fish. 48 When it was full, the fishermen pulled it up on the shore. Then they sat down and collected the good fish in baskets, but threw the bad away. 49 This is how it will be at the end of the age. The angels will come and separate the wicked from the righteous 50 and throw them into the blazing furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
Indeed, God hates sin, but loves the sinner. He desires all men came to Him, but he knows it will not happen. This is why he fortells the stories of separating sheep and goats, good fish from bad fish, and weeds from grains.
Matthew 13:47-50 “Once again, the kingdom of heaven is like a net that was let down into the lake and caught all kinds of fish. 48 When it was full, the fishermen pulled it up on the shore. Then they sat down and collected the good fish in baskets, but threw the bad away. 49 This is how it will be at the end of the age. The angels will come and separate the wicked from the righteous 50 and throw them into the blazing furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
It appears that you believe that every person is EITHER a sheep or a goat, EITHER a wheat or a tare. (This is also traditional Christian teaching.)
However, some people believe that EVERY person is both a sheep and a goat, wheat and tare. (flesh and spirit)
Well as for me and my house rather than lauding God hates sin, we will proclaim God loves the sinner. Out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks. Those who abide in his love bring forth out of their hearts the answer to sin,those who don't abide there love to point out the consequence of sin.
Those who know how bankrupt and undone they are without his mercy and grace in their lives, would never dare utter anything against the wicked,knowing the enormous debt that he freely forgave them.
All you who are in so much debt you are going under , your heavenly father is not holding your debt against you, God was in Christ for us reconciling us back to himself, not counting our sins against us.2 Cor 5:19
He's not out to get you because of your sin,He's the great physician who is out to heal you.
It appears that you believe that every person is EITHER a sheep or a goat, EITHER a wheat or a tare. (This is also traditional Christian teaching.)
However, some people believe that EVERY person is both a sheep and a goat, wheat and tare. (flesh and spirit)
There's a big difference!
Blessings!
Brian
Every person is born tare/goat/bad fish, but becomes wheat/sheep/good fish when we are saved. God loves us and wants us to be righteous, but some refuse to be.
The Bible doesn't lie: the angels WILL separate the wicked from the righteous.
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