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In my fellowship with believers over the years, I've seen those that really had a passion to know Him deeply saw the restitution of all things. For most, the process of dying to the old man and receiving His life (a process of many years and tears) lifted the veil from their eyes.
Sin is debt - once it is paid it is no longer debt, how do you think that Jesus paid the debt for those in Christ?
Eternal means NO BEGINNING and NO Ending. That means an ETERNAL sin always was. So maybe you want to restate that.
Paul
Jesus lived 33 years on this earth surrounded by sin , He came to heal the sinner not to condemn like the church system does , Jesus's approach to sin and the sinner is entirely different from the organized religious christian church system . He saw them as sheep without a shepherd , to put it plainly lost.
Who in their right mind is going to bash a lost man over the head with "you better repent you sinner or else"who doesn't know where he is or where he's going.
That is what we are talking, about the truth. It seems that many cannot handle the truth that God will work all things according to the counsel of His own will and not the creature's will. God bless.
That is what we are talking, about the truth. It seems that many cannot handle the truth that God will work all things according to the counsel of His own will and not the creature's will. God bless.
Yes God will work all things according to His will and not ours.
That is what we are talking, about the truth. It seems that many cannot handle the truth that God will work all things according to the counsel of His own will and not the creature's will. God bless.
At least your closer to calling a spade a spade, Shana.
One of us is deceived, yes?
Still waiting to hear from you on this most excellent display from Camps.
The very universalists that have been 'recruited' to this site even shared that all of you were led astray by the internet.
This isn't something that's mainstream or widely accepted and many scholars....you know, people who actually have knowledge about these things based on more than wiki, tentmaker, or Ray Smith....and those scholars disagree with the (false) teaching.
You can dress it up and try and sell it anyway you like...but it ain't what you profess. Sorry.
Glad it's pretty much just floating out here on the world wide web deceiving just a few instead of many. Not much anyone can do about it but just meet lies with Truth, so you see what we have here at City-Data....another 'us vs them' mentality of folks arguing and no one changing anyone's mind.
Sounds productive doesn't it?
Surely something God would want us doing, right?
Whatever.
I asked in another thread, "If God wanted us to know that His.... well here's the actual quote:
Quote:
If God has always intended UR for His wayward children why didn't He make it as plain as the nose on our faces? Why all the mystery? Why not fill the bible with things like, "And thy suffering in the fires for thy transgressions, while great, shall be but temporary; they shall purify thee but for a short while and thou shall then return to Me without blemish as gold." Or, "Because you have rebelled against My Word you will reap torment in hell-fire, but it certainly shall not last forever, for I will try you until your sin has been purged away and then will I receive you unto Myself as a wayward son is received by his father." I mean, words like that leave no doubt whatsoever that God intends to redeem all mankind. But the Bible doesn't give us even one clear-cut affirmation of UR like that anywhere, does it? If it does, I beg you, point it out to me.
So Shana, do you believe as Camps does that you and I believe in a different God?
I mean, as loud, obnoxious, and deceptive as Camps is, at least he's being clear here.
Either he's worshiping the God of the bible or I am....but not both.....what do you say?
I just saw this post when you posted it, Alpha. I am eating my Chinese food for tonight. I believe that we worship the same God. We just see Him differently on some things. Our understanding of Him on some things seems to differ. I don't believe that He eternally torments any one or that He annihilates anyone. I believe that His love and power are able and will bring about His purpose for all mankind, that being the eventual restoration of all to Him. God bless.
If God has always intended UR for His wayward children why didn't He make it as plain as the nose on our faces? Why all the mystery? Why not fill the bible with things like, "And thy suffering in the fires for thy transgressions, while great, shall be but temporary; they shall purify thee but for a short while and thou shall then return to Me without blemish as gold." Or, "Because you have rebelled against My Word you will reap torment in hell-fire, but it certainly shall not last forever, for I will try you until your sin has been purged away and then will I receive you unto Myself as a wayward son is received by his father." I mean, words like that leave no doubt whatsoever that God intends to redeem all mankind. But the Bible doesn't give us even one clear-cut affirmation of UR like that anywhere, does it? If it does, I beg you, point it out to me.
Did Jesus reveal all things to Him disciples at the same time? Also, if eternal hell/torment is what happens to the lost why wasn't this presented at the very beginning and to all mankind since God loves all mankind and have all to be saved and come to a knowledge of the truth? Why was it not revealed to His chosen people, to the prophets, or even to the apostles? Yes the scriptures gives us very clear cut affirmations that God will restore all to Himself. The scriptures have been shared time and time again . God bless.
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God bless.
