Hawaii vs. New Zealand (economy, parks, south, Florida)
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I was able to speak Japanese decent when I was there, but that was quite some time ago....almost 20 yrs, so my Japanese is far from fluent. Could I pick it up again, probably. My wife's family all lives in Europe except her mother who lives in Florida, so we would/could have family in England, France, Italy, and Israel and I speak French about as well as I speak Japanese, but my wife speaks French pretty close to fluent except her dialect is all wrong being an American. We both love Europe and have visited quite a few times since being married and she grew up spending her summer's on Corsica with her family. Her entire family lives in the ocean every chance they get, and my wife is the same way. I think she is solar powered because her energy level and love of life goes up immensely when the sun is out and the heat is soaking into her. We have started to narrow our focus on San Diego or Oahu. I lived off and on in California for 20 years and don't remember any earthquake in San Diego that was more than a tiny little rumble. I doubt we buy a house on the La Jolla cliffs so I'm not too worried about the earthquake factor even though it does exist. Traffic is an issue that our friends in San Diego have told us about as well, but I'm not too sure about the pollution. Haven't heard much about it from anyone but you, but I also have not went looking for that type of information either.
Sorry to assume youd did not speak "much" Japanese. It is great that you do. Keep it alive. If you move to Hawaii, where the greater number of tourists are Japanese too, it will be very helpful. Even in the mainland, there is much business done with Japan. It is a difficult language to learn, compared to latin based one, so do keep it alive. An easy way is to rent Japanese DVD for children, with English sub-scipts. The language is simple enough for you to figure out, and your kids can pick up some while improving their English reading skills. French is a gorgeous language too. How lucky you to have family in France! WOW! I'll visit often if I was you.
While I advertized loudly the incredible , almost inexhaustible wealth of diversity of landscape and climates in North America, the U.S. is the largest piece of land in the world, by far, with such an uniform bland culture. Anywhere you go in the U.S., the downtown look the same. The chain stores and restaurants are the same. There will be "the" black neighborhood, The rich neighborhood. The Latino neighborhood. The middle-class neighborhood. Same type of houses. So predictable! New Orleans is famous simply because it has kept a "little bit" of culture.
In Hawaii also, ethnic groups cling to their culture, in an Aloha spirit. Not in a sectarian one. I like it a lot, having some "culture" alive. Not blending it all in name of assimilation.
In Europe, not only each country has its very distinct culture, food, architecture, music, but even each part of those tiny (compared to U.S.) countries has its own too. Sicilia is very different from Venice or Milan. A Corsican is nothing like a Parisian. Ibiza is different than Spain. You cannot drive more than 120 miles without being in a completely different area, landscape and culture. And then you are less than a 2 hours plane ride of about 3 dozen countries. Malta, Israel, London, Denmark, Egypt... The quality of life, in all aspects, including food, is much higher in Europe than in the U.S... if you consider that variety is the spice of life, like I do.
Yes, I visited or resided in most countries in Europe.... I have to admit that I have a very severe wandering bug syndrome, not to blame on my parents. But I am aware of it (1st step), so it is under control. I will not let it affect my family. I get my "fix" about twice a year taking trips in the U.S. There is way more than enough to discover and explore in the U.S. And I wait for retirement to do as I please again. if I am healthy enough to travel..... I might end up a dotting grand-pa in Cocoa beach...
I totally understand about sunshine and ocean. Can't live without it neither. And I am supposed to be rooted in Pensylvania! But nope. I do not miss it a bit. I also get depressed, almost listless after a while, if I live in a gloomy area for an extended period of time. If you see how the population shifts in the U.S. over the decades, you will see that it moves toward the South.
No matter what's going on in my life, if I sit on a beach for an hour around sunset, watch the waves, and the sky... I will be perfectly happy. An inner fundamental peace sets in. I situate myself again as a tiny little entity in the universe, living for a few nano-seconds compared to eternity, and nothing really matters any more. That's what the ocean does to me. Put me back in my place, like a grain of sand, or a wave that last a few seconds and vanish back in the ocean to make new waves. If I stay far away from the ocean for more than 6 months, I have a visceral need to go back. It's like half my brain start to harrass me, whispering "Go to the ocean.... Go to the ocean... Go smell the ocean... " I am not joking.
If you want to decide for a next town where you will plan to stay "forever", I completely agree you should strive for an optimal place to suit your "search for happiness", as well as PRACTICAL. No "building castles in the sand" dreams. Be practical, and do not hesitate to compromise. You probably won't have it all. Do not hang on those things you have to give up, else you will never enjoy fully what you do have.
Right now, ENJOY your 4000sf mansion and the ability to save money for a better life. Those are not negligeable assets. Lots of people would envy you for those, much more than you could envy somebody living in Hawaii.
Do not spoil your happiness focusing on what else you wish for. That's part of the treatment of the wandering bug.
I know I had a slight chance to make it in Hawaii with my family, but it was too slight. I did not feel it was responsible. And I do not have any regret or hangover. I don't even go to Hawaii. There is so much more to explore on the mainland. Of course, I already live on a wonderful beach.... this should explain.
About the pollution in San Diego, it did experimented it mildly, but it is possible that my brother see it worse than it is, since his daughter developed asthma and other breathing symptoms. Which, by the way, disappear as soon as she visits us in FL.
Happy New Year.
Last edited by SurferCocoa; 01-01-2012 at 01:04 PM..
Traffic is an issue that our friends in San Diego have told us about as well, but I'm not too sure about the pollution. Haven't heard much about it from anyone but you, but I also have not went looking for that type of information either.
Very surprising. I never looked into it before. I was convinced that San Diego was better than Houston. I have no idea how it will be in 20 years, going down this path.
Houston is right behind San Diego when it comes to pollution. San Diego is the 7th worst, and Houston is the 8th worst.
On the other hand Brevard (Melbourne/Palm Bay) is the 3rd cleanest city in the whole U.S.A. for short term particles, and the 14th for long term particles, whatever this mean. Many FL cities show up in the top cleanest in the U.S., contrasting sharply with CA.
The San Diego region ranks seventh worst in the American Lung Association's annual State of the Air report when it comes to ozone pollution. Los Angeles-Long Beach-Riverside was number one. Debra Kelly with the American Lung Association in San Diego said the elderly, youngsters and people active outdoors are most affected by ozone. "Ozone or smog is an irritating gas that actually causes burns on lung tissue, like a bad sunburn," said Kelly. "It can cause health problems the day you breathe it in and long after. Ozone can damage the respiratory track causing inflammation and irritation, coughing, tightness in the chest and shortness of breath. It can also worsen asthma symptoms and even contribute to new cases." She said ozone can make diseases like bronchitis worse and it contributes to early death. Kelly said ozone is worse during the summer in San Diego.
Last edited by SurferCocoa; 01-01-2012 at 08:10 PM..
^^San Diego is fine, it depends on where those readings are, even Los Angeles. If you are on the coast you are fine, its inland where polutants stack up because of the mountains. Its not pancake flat and wide open like Florida. Their are no mountains for a thousand miles in Florida, so your pollution just blows out to sea. Youve done alot of internet research to discredit places you know nothing about.
And according you your source on clean air: Florida had 5 cities in the top 25 for year round air particle polution, but two California cities ranked above any of them as well as Honolulu. Also your #3 ranking for Brevard had a California coastal area right on their heals....
@lane_change
I was born in New Zealand, lived in Hawaii, California and now Texas. I'll just give you my opinion:
New Zealand from my perspective is an outstanding place to live, and is as beautiful as its reputation suggests. It is a bit like California in that it has tremendous range in topography and to a lesser extent climate. The north island would give you what you seek, a slower simpler lifestyle with beach culture if you desire that. Keep in mind, beach culture is not static, its not Florida or SoCal all over the world or country for that matter. Many coastal enthusiasts love "their" beaches, no matter where they are. The only thing that would hold me back is distance if you still have parents/family here that you are close to. Its just very very far from the US. If you were truly content with a simple slower lifestyle, and not pushing kids for ultimate achievment, New Zealand would suit you.
Hawaii is very alluring for me, because of the polynesian cross cultures, the beauty and climate. It can also be a great place to live if your goals include exploring the South Pacific and Asia. If you can find settle employment situation you would enjoy. However, much like NZ, it is somewhat isolated and do you see it as a place your kids may stay long term? Who knows, I guess.
California. I think still has what you would like, but you have to look at smaller towns and even think of some of the beach towns as micro environments. I would open up my horizon from San Diego to as far north as Monterey. When I lived on the central coast, I thought the beaches were going to be to cold or foggy, I was wrong. When you live there its totally different. Loved it. Love the cool comfort all year round. The earthquake fear mongering was funny, and typical. I too grew up from age 7 in California and never felt an earthquake. California is down now, but I think if you find your place, you can still enjoy the best of the state. Dramatic highs and lows in topography and natural beauty that no other state can match.
Texas/Florida. You live in Houston so you know how the Gulf is (not that great), it just leaves much to be desired. Ive travelled and worked extensively in Florida and Texas and if you dont like the weather in Houston, you wont in Florida. I have family in Orlando (from OC), they tell me they wish they were back in California. They hate the climate/humidity/daily thunderstorms in summer & bugs. I also have family in Clearwater, pretty beaches and Miami, but I dont think those places would suit what you are looking for.
Its all about finding that place, that you love to be. Good luck...
Not true. I own property in San Diego and am offered earthquake insurance on it every year.
I mean it's so expensive, it's like another small mortgage. Like enough money to buy a small home in Wisconsin.
In CA, even people who make over $100K struggle to qualify for an average mortgage over $500K. Especially now that the NoIncomeVerification scam ended. If they add the cost of earthquake insurance, they will then not qualify. I was talking of cost, not availability.
You say it is offered. Did you buy it?
Pretty much everybody has hurricane insurance in FL. But few have earthquake in CA. That is a fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by slo1318
^^San Diego is fine, it depends on where those readings are, even Los Angeles. If you are on the coast you are fine, its inland where polutants stack up because of the mountains. Its not pancake flat and wide open like Florida. Their are no mountains for a thousand miles in Florida, so your pollution just blows out to sea. Youve done alot of internet research to discredit places you know nothing about.
Houston is the same. Houston is fine depending where you take the readings. The main source of pollution are the oil refineries. If you are far from them, the pollution is minimal. The O.P. said he is in a place with good schools, so for sure he is far from the polluters. There are no good schools in the badly polluted areas of Houston. In fact, sadly enough, all the executives of the oil industry stay very far from them too. The offices are in the "energy corridor" as it's called, and it is the least polluted place.
Houston is also flat as a pancake, and the the pollution dissipates and does not accumulate, like in CA. In San Diego, there is no place that is exempt. It all depends on the wind. It even gets the L.A. smog, if the wind blows South. The pollution stay trapped along the coast because of the mountains.
I am absolutely not trying to discredit any place. I was very surprised about what I learned for San Diego, which is a place I use to love, and considered settling in. I would have sworn that it was much better than Houston. Even when my brother blamed the air for his daughter's breathing problems, I was a little doubtful.
My research on the Internet was simply to be accurate, and not speculate on the state of affairs, since those are important issues to the OP. It's main complaint about Houston is the lack of nice beaches and the pollution. Else, he seems surprisingly well situated, with a beautiful home, and his wife being able to hold a well paid full time job, take care of 2 kids, and study for a master or PHD at the same time. If you are giving up those assets, it better be for a better place! I knew there was a pollution problem in San Diego too, and I wanted to find out how bad it was, or if it was just some unjustified rumors. It is also important to know for planing for the future. If it's like this now, so what in 10 years?
It does not matter if there is a good explanation for the clean air in FL, or very good excuses for the polluted one in San Diego. It does not change the facts. Unless you think that the advantage of having mountains nearby, makes it worth it living in a highly polluted area.
Last edited by SurferCocoa; 01-02-2012 at 05:49 AM..
Quotes from the movie Get Shorty....this is what this reminds me of.
Ray "Bones" Barboni: I'm from Miami-f**kin'-Beach and you wanna show me the ocean, huh? And what about sun, does it ever shine around here, or is this smog around all the time?
Limo Driver With Sign: They say the smog is the reason we have such beautiful sunsets.
Ray "Bones" Barboni: That's what they say, huh? What a bunch of f**kin bulls**t.
Houston is the same. Houston is fine depending where you take the readings. The main source of pollution are the oil refineries. If you are far from them, the pollution is minimal. The O.P. said he is in a place with good schools, so for sure he is far from the polluters. There are no good schools in the badly polluted areas of Houston. In fact, sadly enough, all the executives of the oil industry stay very far from them too. The offices are in the "energy corridor" as it's called, and it is the least polluted place.
Houston is also flat as a pancake, and the the pollution dissipates and does not accumulate, like in CA. In San Diego, there is no place that is exempt. It all depends on the wind. It even gets the L.A. smog, if the wind blows South. The pollution stay trapped along the coast because of the mountains.
I am absolutely not trying to discredit any place. I was very surprised about what I learned for San Diego, which is a place I use to love, and considered settling in. I would have sworn that it was much better than Houston. Even when my brother blamed the air for his daughter's breathing problems, I was a little doubtful.
My research on the Internet was simply to be accurate, and not speculate on the state of affairs, since those are important issues to the OP. It's main complaint about Houston is the lack of nice beaches and the pollution. Else, he seems surprisingly well situated, with a beautiful home, and his wife being able to hold a well paid full time job, take care of 2 kids, and study for a master or PHD at the same time. If you are giving up those assets, it better be for a better place! I knew there was a pollution problem in San Diego too, and I wanted to find out how bad it was, or if it was just some unjustified rumors. It is also important to know for planing for the future. If it's like this now, so what in 10 years?
It does not matter if there is a good explanation for the clean air in FL, or very good excuses for the polluted one in San Diego. It does not change the facts. Unless you think that the advantage of having mountains nearby, makes it worth it living in a highly polluted area.
Houston has more pollution/traffic/refineries.......no mountains. The wind doesnt blow south from LA.
Its all relative....were not talking about Beijing here.
California has tremendous variety of topography and climate which is an enormous advantage over Florida, and every other state for that matter.
Lane_change. I think I contributed all I know for your search.
10 years ago, when I got married and pregnant, I went through the exact same search as you do, with the same criterias. Your thread catched my attention because you were comparing N.Z. to Hawaii, and you are a military brat, and you have 2 kids. I do a lot of counseling, not so much to military brats, but to their kids. So I jumped in.
I usually do not send Internet links, since I trust that the OP is doing his own research, and is looking for people's personal experience. Not statistics. I sent the pollution one simply because I never did any research on air quality. I know Hawaii smells delicious and the air is so revitalizing, you can feel it. And I know that when I came back from Orlando, I feel also the sweet breeze on the Atlantic coast. But it is all very subjective. So I went to look, and I was very surprised to find out we had the cleanest air in the U.S. If I knew it, I would have trumpeted it earlier. Or that San Diego was "that" polluted. I get annoyed when I visit my brother in San Diego, and he says we cannot take his girl to the beach because of the pollution. I use to think he is not really in his right mind, and that the beach would do good to her... Now I understand better.
The pollution in San Diego is mostly coming from the Ozone. And Ozone has no odor. It is not like black stinky exhaust fume from a car, like downtown. And you would not think it is on the beach.
You say you have friends there. I am quite sure they can tell you how hard it is to go to any beach on a summer weekend. Last time I was there, we ended up driving to San Onofre, without my niece and her mom, of course. Poor girl has to stay home.
In winter, it is still wonderful to walk on PB around 5 or 6 and watch the sunset.... and the pollution is not as bad in winter.
Another thing that degraded in San Diego is the access to Baja. There has been such gruesome violence in the past years (think beheadings!) and stricter control at the border, that it has become difficult and scary to take a camping trip next to the border. You have to drive much farther south in Baja (if you dare taking your chances), to feel reasonably safe. It is quite a spoiler. Baja use to be an "extra bonus".
At their age, the most important thing for your kids, besides food and water, is to spend time with their parents. No gorgeous breath-taking views is going to make them much happier. Kids like nature, but they like activities in nature. Like at the beach, or at the snow, lots to do.
If your wife, who must be a remarkable young woman, was able to get a master or a PHD while working full time, once she finishes her study, she should have plenty more time for the kids. While a typical 8 to 5 job she might be obliged to accept, with a 30mn commute (1 hour both way) will be very stressful.
Saving money is also a legitimate way to fulfill your dreams later on. As I say, young kids are easy to please. Once they are teen, and want to do their own thing, then it becomes more important to be in a beach place like Hawaii. If you save enough money, maybe you could move there when the kids turn 12 or 13. They would have a blast!
You can also take some extra time off from work (unpaid vacation) and have wonderful ski trips, or Hawaiian trips, or a Disney cruise.
The more the place you live in is expensive, the more you have to work to pay for it, the less time you have to enjoy it. But staying in a less desirable location, and saving money to take great vacations is also a valid way to go.
It is a pity you do not like your mother-in law. FL is a terrific place to visit, as you surely know. They have a Legoland, which is more appropriate for your kid's age than Disney. Beaches, and lots of nature to enjoy. Did I mention clean air?
So, be patient, and do not forget to appreciate fully all the blessings you have. Do not spoil your life with looking at all the wrong things in Houston. Just think, you have cleaner air than in San Diego and you did not even know it! And the beaches might not be great, but hey! you have "some" beaches! Galveston is a popular tourist spot, so there must be something to like over there. Get a kayak, and enjoy the lakes.
Last edited by SurferCocoa; 01-02-2012 at 09:52 AM..
Ok, I have to jump in here. My wife went for training in houston texas (and just like everywhere else in the world) and there are negatives. Negatives that I personally could not live with. The air is terrible! Due to all the oil processing that they do it makes the air hard at times to breathe. And the summers are HOT HOT HOT!!! They broke records over 110 degrees, my wife hated it. Record Heat of 2011 - weather.com
There is no rain this is true, they have the opposite, drought!!! They crave rain there and when my wife was there she said on the news they hoped for rain because drought was killing crops. Yes there are great jobs there (unlike Florida! I can't believe florida is even a question in here, come on guys!!! Florida is going through a terrible housing crisis, their unemployment as of now is STILL 10.0%, so there are no jobs.) but as with any place you move to. Do research, weigh the positives and negative, and see if this is a place that is right for you. That is my advice. But no where is paradise guys, not in hawaii, aruba, new zealand, texas, miami, nowhere, their are problems everywhere. It is all 100% mental, there are some people living in shack in a third world country and are happy as can be, there are others that live malibu with millions of dollars and are nearly suicidal!
We are heavily leaning towards Hawaii based on the initial research, but San Diego is still our 2nd choice. We are going to plan our summer vacation this year to Hawaii or San Diego and go to the other location in the winter. Probably will do San Diego in the summer and Hawaii in the winter since San Diego does actually get cold unlike Hawaii.
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