"Urban" inner areas of Dallas with good schools? (Howe: homes, high school)

[In_Correct]

That is a crazy thread. I have to keep myself from replying to the very angry offended people. I will quickly say that those people can reply with whatever observations that they want to. They should not require OP's permission.

I do have a few questions and comments.

Once again, I do not agree with (regardless of skin colour or ethnicity) that students from low income, and even dysfunctional households does not automatically make them an academic failure.

I am not worried about magic winning numbers when I compare schools. I believe that the statistics lie.

Believe it or not, (which you won't) There are those who have graduated college and are "affluent", but they are more dysfunctional than "thugs".

Even more shocking: There are those who have masters degrees who are on welfare. Some of them mainly graduated just to make themselves look good.

I believe that the educational system is political. I do believe some students have "no chance" no matter which school or programme they attend. I believe education is best self-taught.

Perhaps I am wrong. Somebody tell me that I am wrong. (With proof)

Also, I am wondering if racism is around much more than I thought. Is it really that bad, or are other people exaggerating?

And finally, what is the point of even asking these repetitive "good school" questions by starting thread topics in the first place?! Can't this information be found elsewhere on the City Data website? And I think that everybody's desires for schools varies anyways, so it should be better if people look up the information themselves, and then decide based on the information?

[bencronin04]

Just as a side piece to diversity in the Park Cities, my oldest started t-ball this weekend with the Park Cities YMCA. The team had 13 children of which only 9 were Caucasian. Granted it doesn't mean that the kids live within HPISD (we don't), nor that they will be going to an HPISD school, it was just nice to see. When I played 20 years ago, every team was completely Caucasian.

[CGGirl]

I'm from NYC originally and went to public school my entire school career and later went on to some of the best universities in this country, despite having been eligible for reduced lunch during several years of elementary. I also didn't speak very good English until about 1st or 2nd grade even though my dad made sure that they did not put me in ESL. Many of my friends from elementary school were also on free or reduced lunch. Many of my friends from elementary school went on to prestigious private schools (on scholarship for many) and elite colleges and universities. It seems to be a very Dallas thing to say that a child who is a minority and lives in an apartment and isn't wealthy must somehow equate to "less than".

Why is this the case? I'm very curious.

[Wittgenstein's Ghost]

Originally Posted by CGGirl

I'm from NYC originally and went to public school my entire school career and later went on to some of the best universities in this country, despite having been eligible for reduced lunch during several years of elementary. I also didn't speak very good English until about 1st or 2nd grade even though my dad made sure that they did not put me in ESL. Many of my friends from elementary school were also on free or reduced lunch. Many of my friends from elementary school went on to prestigious private schools (on scholarship for many) and elite colleges and universities. It seems to be a very Dallas thing to say that a child who is a minority and lives in an apartment and isn't wealthy must somehow equate to "less than".

Why is this the case? I'm very curious.

On average, people who are raised in the environment you describe do not go on to the best universities in the country. Statistically, the odds are heavily against them. The fact that exceptions, such as yourself, exist does not mean the general idea is false. Oprah Winfrey grew up in one of the poorest counties in the US. That doesn't mean that growing up in poverty doesn't make one less likely to become a billionaire.

[CGGirl]

Originally Posted by cordata

The whole "white student" school population is really just a proxy for higher education and income. I don't think whites are any better than blacks or hispanics but the percentage of whites is a good indicator of higher family income and education level which will lead to better educational outcomes for the kids.

Except that higher income does not always equate to higher educational level. Back in the DC area, most of the people that I knew with higher incomes did have a high level of education, i.e. more than just a 4 year degree. I've been in TX several years and while I've known many people and families with high income levels, most didn't have anything beyond a 4 year degree and many have them from TX schools.

Also, in my own personal experiences, I've found that those whose parents didn't or don't have a lot tended to work harder than those who were a bit spoiled. The kids who had parents that high disposable income were always partying in high school while those of us who simply had hard working parents (who weren't wealthy or affluent) made sure to study first. My husband went to public school most of his life in TX (and he's Caucasian) and his experience matches my theory.

[CGGirl]

Originally Posted by J800

Gonna have to disagree with this. I know several well-to-do black families in PH that have mentioned the looks they get while being out or in the neighborhood.

Hell, I remember when my parents (both AA) were very close to buying in Highland Park and the surrounding neighbors were ready to disown the seller and post negative reviews about the realtor if they sold to a minority family.

Even as a young (21-24) African-American male making a little over 6 figures, I still sense the "antsy" feeling that the other poster mentioned when I'm in certain areas. Whether it's to visit co-workers for dinner in HP or to shop, it's generally true. It's just something a lot of people don't like to admit about Dallas.

Sadly, I believe this to be true. I no longer make 6 figures now that I'm self-employed and a mom but I used to make 6 figures and I received an excellent education (on merit and not through aff. action I'll add) and in NY and DC, I could go anywhere and receive great service. I moved to Dallas from one of the ten richest counties in the country (it has been on the list for at least the past 10 years). I ate at some fancy schmancy restaurants and shopped at some very nice stores and was always treated wonderfully. Here in Dallas, I went to a boutique kids shop with my daughter and I really wanted to buy something there but I chose not to because I was not spoken to once. Despite their being no one in the store, I was not helped at all. I stayed and looked at the items that I had intended to buy and then went online and bought the items from an out of state small business.

Sure, some may say it has nothing to do with the color of my skin but considering that I had heard about this great Southern hospitality, I sure tend to get bad service quite a bit if my husband is not with me.

[CGGirl]

Originally Posted by Wittgenstein's Ghost

On average, people who are raised in the environment you describe do not go on to the best universities in the country. Statistically, the odds are heavily against them. The fact that exceptions, such as yourself, exist does not mean the general idea is false. Oprah Winfrey grew up in one of the poorest counties in the US. That doesn't mean that growing up in poverty doesn't make one less likely to become a billionaire.

Oprah is rich but correct me if I'm wrong, she doesn't have a bunch of degrees nor did she go to top schools. Point being that being rich does not always correlate to one's education level.

Also, I don't think the odds are that stacked against them. Maybe here in Dallas or in TX as a whole they are. In NYC, our public schools were/are quite large (as in lots of students) and if I go down the list of my friends from elementary and junior high, almost all of them are very highly educated and/or well off financially. The key is not your parents' education level or income. The key is the quality of the education you get. Why don't I ever see a discussion about the quality of the teachers in DISD school or the quality of the curriculum? Luckily, my husband is very well read and naturally gifted with intelligence because he didn't get taught a lot in the TX school system. I'm continually surprised at what he didn't learn in school. Things that I learned in junior high, he learned late in high school or not at all. It seems TX schools don't value history much (unless it's TX history) and math doesn't seem to be a big thing either. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong. I'd like to see more discussion about that - the schools and the curriculum - than the racial and economic makeup of the student body or their parents.

[Wittgenstein's Ghost]

Originally Posted by CGGirl

Oprah is rich but correct me if I'm wrong, she doesn't have a bunch of degrees nor did she go to top schools. Point being that being rich does not always correlate to one's education level.

I wasn't making any claim about Oprah's education level. I was pointing out that there are exceptions to every rule, but anecdotal stories of overcoming long odds don't mean that those long odds aren't actually prohibitive in most cases.

Originally Posted by CGGirl

Also, I don't think the odds are that stacked against them. Maybe here in Dallas or in TX as a whole they are. In NYC, our public schools were/are quite large (as in lots of students) and if I go down the list of my friends from elementary and junior high, almost all of them are very highly educated and/or well off financially. The key is not your parents' education level or income. The key is the quality of the education you get. Why don't I ever see a discussion about the quality of the teachers in DISD school or the quality of the curriculum? Luckily, my husband is very well read and naturally gifted with intelligence because he didn't get taught a lot in the TX school system. I'm continually surprised at what he didn't learn in school. Things that I learned in junior high, he learned late in high school or not at all. It seems TX schools don't value history much (unless it's TX history) and math doesn't seem to be a big thing either. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong. I'd like to see more discussion about that - the schools and the curriculum - than the racial and economic makeup of the student body or their parents.

Statistically, students from poor backgrounds are less likely to graduate college. That trend is overwhelmingly strong, and it isn't just a Texas trend. The problem is much deeper than the quality of the teachers and the curriculum.

A student from the bottom quartile is six times less likely to graduate college than a student from the top quartile:





http://www.theatlantic.com/business/...graphs/274250/


The reason you don't hear as much discussion about the quality of the teachers or the curriculum is that those things are much harder to quantify.

[CGGirl]

Yes, I understand the fact but my question is why. Many here seem to say that the why is because of race or class. My theory/argument is that, while there might be a correlation, these kids aren't doing worse academically because they are poor or minority. They are doing worse for other reasons. Seems odd that I've seen so many disadvantaged students of color do well when they have access to good teachers and a good curriculum. That's what makes me think that it's not related to color or class. That's all I'm saying.

[jgn2013]

Originally Posted by hbdwihdh378y9

You're out of your mind. Which way does the immigration arrow point? Asians move to countries built by Whites, not the other way around.

Interesting.

Asians are always used as the example of a model minority, yet when it's suggested that they are ahead of white kids in any way, people get offended and push them to the back of the line. If I said that blacks and Latinos should act like Asians...no problem. If I say that whites should act like Asians...you have a problem. Figures.