"Urban" inner areas of Dallas with good schools? (Richardson: 2014, rent)

[Wittgenstein's Ghost]

Originally Posted by dag7763

No, I'm not particularly concerned with diversity. I'm more concerned with quality schools and neighborhoods, why do you say that like its some kind of slight or scoff towards me. I have lived in diverse neighborhoods like where I grew up in Manhattan with people from every country in Europe (including my own parents), and now I live in a 95% white neighborhood that's majority Italian American. Both are nice. Unlike lots of these posters here, I'm not so obsessed with race that I have to go into some social justice warrior soap box speech when talking about unrelated topics.

You were replying to another one of the trolling comments that was an attempt to derail my thread. I couldn't give crap in hell if some insecure person felt antsy because "the mean white people were staring at him" my advice is to get a grip and stop being your own worst enemy. The only color that matters is green.

This thread is about schools, not antsy and racially obsessed insecure people complaining about sticking out in a neighborhood. When I drive through Spanish Harlem I stick out too, I deal with it or avoid the area. So thanks for the advice about Richardson. I cannot up my budget. If you would like to further discuss neighborhood quality and schools you're welcome too, if not please make a thread entitled "Whiny and Insecure Racial Musings about Dallas from Social Justice Warriors"

Thanks

Wow, this is a baffling post. Obviously, based on your continued debate with J800, your concern is not merely that your thread will get derailed. Based on this post (the one I've quoted), I think it's obvious that you do in fact have a bit of a soap box of your own. J800 posted some personal experience, and whether it was relevant to your thread or not, it was insightful. Your response is petty and immature. Telling people who are socially ostracized due to their race that they are insecure whiners if they dislike the stares of racists is unbelievably insensitive. Further, telling someone that they should either deal with racism or avoid an area rather than complain about racism and stay is simply ignorant.

Originally Posted by ravensix

Questionable anecdote. Would like some documentation on the beat-to-death canard you're using.

You want documentation of a personal anecdote? That seems silly. J800 may very well not wish to share such documentation, even if it does exist, due to a desire to maintain anonymity. That is understandable. It is also entirely possible that there is no documentation for something that very well may have simply been a conversation.

You are criticizing J800 for making serious allegations that you believe lack merit, yet you are making some very big assumptions and leveling serious allegations at J800 -- also without merit.

[f4shionablecha0s]

The suburb pushers on here will always twist someone into moving out to the boondocks.

Woodrow Wilson is a good public high school that's in the city. There are also charter school options and the DISD magnets are the best high schools in Texas.

[rantanamo]

Lakewood, Munger Place, Junius Heights, Wilshire Heights. Any of those areas feeding into Woodrow Wilson. I did my masters thesis on it. Great school. As said before, magnets are amongst the best in Texas and have been rating in the top 5 nationally in some publications. Despite the mention, Hillcrest and WT White also get their share of wealthy neighborhood kids. Park Cities are not Dallas proper, but are within the Dallas City Limits. Lake Highlands is Richardson ISD.


And for the first page poster that said no one is running from blacks but are running from poverty, why does everyone here mention only northern suburbs as if the huge swath of middle to upper middle class suburbs don't exist. One could get a lot more house down there and the schools are not that much different along with low crime. There is a problem whether we want there to be or not.

[bencronin04]

Originally Posted by rantanamo

And for the first page poster that said no one is running from blacks but are running from poverty, why does everyone here mention only northern suburbs as if the huge swath of middle to upper middle class suburbs don't exist. One could get a lot more house down there and the schools are not that much different along with low crime. There is a problem whether we want there to be or not.

How are the schools not different? Can you list one public non-magnet HS south of downtown that has top 20 north Texas SAT scores?They're vastly different. Race does play a factor, but performance > race.

[bencronin04]

Just to make it a little easier, you have to go to the 45th spot. I'm not familiar with that district, so that may even be a magnet seeing as it's named Cedar Hill "Collegiate". OP, I'd also like to point out that you do not see a single DISD public school on this list. The three mention to you within DISD have average SAT's of, Woodrow Wilson:1346 , WT White:1276 and Hillcrest:1329

1780 - Highland Park (Highland Park)
1726 - Plano West (Plano)
1719 - Southlake Carroll (Carroll)
1709 - Plano Senior (Plano)
1703 - Flower Mound (Lewisville)
1699 - Coppell (Coppell)
1650 - Lovejoy (Lovejoy)
1646 - Marcus (Lewisville)
1639 - Plano East (Plano)
1635 - JJ Pearce (Richardson)
1631 - Grapevine (Grapevine-Colleyville)
1628 - Hebron (Lewisville)
1626 - Colleyville Heritage (Grapevine-Colleyville)
1626 - Liberty (Frisco)
1623 - Centennial (Frisco)
1622 - Keller (Keller)
1618 - Allen (Allen)
1613 - Boyd (McKinney)
1587 - Wakeland (Frisco)
1586 - North (McKinney)
1577 - Paschal (Fort Worth)
1576 - Prosper (Prosper)
1574 - Frisco (Frisco)
1569 - Argyle (Argyle)
1568 - Martin (Arlington)
1562 - McKinney (McKinney)
1561 - Pottsboro (Pottsboro)
1555 - Rockwall (Rockwall)
1551 - Melissa (Melissa)
1543 - Heritage (Frisco)
1536 - Central (Keller)
1535 - Garland (Garland)
1534 - Heath (Rockwall)
1534 - Sherman (Sherman)
1525 - Richardson (Richardson)
1520 - Guyer (Denton)
1519 - Howe (Howe)
1516 - Lone Star (Frisco)
1515 - Mansfield (Mansfield)
1515 - Wylie (Wylie)
1514 - Byron Nelson (Northwest)
1514 - Creekview (Carrollton-Farmers Branch)
1512 - The Colony (Lewisville)
1511 - Lake Highlands (Richardson)
1508 - Cedar Hill Collegiate (Cedar Hill)

[aggie972]

Assuming I had a talented kid, what would matter more to me than average sat score of an entire school would be average sat score/academic achievement specifically of the middle class white kids in the school. If Woodrow had a full track of honors/ap/ib classes where the students were performing similarly to honors students at the Plano schools, then I'd be less concerned about the average of the entire school. Looking at NMSF numbers it doesn't look like they're there yet though.

[bencronin04]

Originally Posted by aggie972

Assuming I had a talented kid, what would matter more to me than average sat score of an entire school would be average sat score/academic achievement specifically of the middle class white kids in the school. If Woodrow had a full track of honors/ap/ib classes where the students were performing similarly to honors students at the Plano schools, then I'd be less concerned about the average of the entire school. Looking at NMSF numbers it doesn't look like they're there yet though.

You care more about middle class white kids that reach NMSF than average SAT scores? Average gives you a much better picture of the school as a whole, rather than NMSF at the very top.

[bencronin04]

But yes you are correct in regards to the NMSF at Woodrow. Hell last year DISD did not have one NMSF at any high school outside of their magnet schools. On that same note, I can only find one south of downtown Dallas....

46 - Plano West (Plano ISD)
33 - Flower Mound (Lewisville ISD)
24 - Coppell (Coppell ISD)
22 - Southlake Carroll (Carroll ISD)
18 - Plano Senior (Plano ISD)
15 - Hebron (Lewisville ISD)
15 - Liberty (Frisco ISD)
14 - Highland Park (Highland Park ISD)
14 - Plano East (Plano ISD)
13 - Marcus (Lewisville ISD)
12 - Allen (Allen ISD)
12 - Paschal (Fort Worth ISD)
11 - Colleyville Heritage (Grapevine-Colleyville ISD)
8 - Grapevine (Grapevine-Colleyville ISD)
6 - Richardson (Richardson ISD)
5 - Martin (Arlington ISD)
5 - Newman Smith (Carrollton-Farmers Branch ISD)
5 - Trinity (Hurst-Euless-Bedford ISD)
4 - Boyd (McKinney ISD)
4 - Frisco (Frisco ISD)
4 - Lewisville (Lewisville ISD)
3 - Argyle (Argyle ISD)
3 - Arlington*(Arlington ISD)
3 -*Birdville (Birdville ISD)
3 - Garland (Garland ISD)
3 - Guyer (Denton ISD)
3 - Heritage (Frisco ISD)
3 - Lovejoy (Lovejoy ISD)
3 - Mansfield (Mansfield ISD)
2 - Centennial (Frisco ISD)
2 - Faith Christian (private)
2 - JJ Pearce (Richardson ISD)
2 - Keller (Keller ISD)
2 - LD Bell (Hurst-Euless-Bedford ISD)
2 - Richland (Birdville ISD)
1 - Berkner (Richardson ISD)
1 - Byron Nelson (Northwest ISD)
1 - Central (Keller ISD)
1 - Creekview (Carrollton-Farmers Branch ISD)
1 - Duncanville (Duncanville ISD)
1 - Fossil Ridge (Keller ISD)
1 - Lake Highlands (Richardson ISD)
1 - Lamar (Arlington ISD)
1 - Lone Star (Frisco ISD)
1 - North (McKinney ISD)
1 - North Crowley (Crowley ISD)
1 - Poteet (Mesquite ISD)
1 - Prosper (Prosper ISD)
1 - RL Turner (Carrollton-Farmers Branch ISD)
1 - Rockwall (Rockwall ISD)
1 - Summit (Mansfield ISD)
1 - Timber Creek (Keller ISD)
1 - Wakeland (Frisco ISD)
1 - Wylie East (Wylie ISD)

[aggie972]

Originally Posted by bencronin04

You care more about middle class white kids that reach NMSF than average SAT scores? Average gives you a much better picture of the school as a whole, rather than NMSF at the very top.

Yes, because I want to isolate the quality of the instruction and the environment of the school, and make my comparisons that way. For instance let's say school A is in a poor neighborhood, but it has the same quality teachers as school B which is in a rich neighborhood. School A has the same access to textbooks, technology, labs, etc. as school B, and has a method of grouping all the smart/driven students into honors classes together.

If school B has higher "average" SAT scores, but school A keeps pace when you control for factors like poverty, single parent households, differing cultural attitudes toward learning, etc. then I wouldn't be as uncomfortable sending my kid to school A assuming my kid was honors/AP material. Because unless school A forced my kid to take classes with the general population and sit there bored while the teacher had to discipline rowdy students or explain partial fractions over and over to the least capable student in the class, then I don't care that much what the "average" SAT score is. Would you advise your kid to go to, say Yeshiva University in New York at $39,000 a year over UT Plan 2 Honors at $10,000 a year to study business because the average student at Yeshiva got higher test scores?

Now it seems like in the real world (or at least in DISD), that school A doesn't really exist. But that's why I wouldn't focus solely on average SAT scores.

[bencronin04]

Originally Posted by aggie972

Yes, because I want to isolate the quality of the instruction and the environment of the school, and make my comparisons that way. For instance let's say school A is in a poor neighborhood, but it has the same quality teachers as school B which is in a rich neighborhoods. School A has the same access to textbooks, technology, labs, etc. as school B, and has a method of grouping all the smart/driven students into honors classes together.

If school B has higher "average" SAT scores, but school A keeps pace when you control for factors like poverty, single parent households, differing cultural attitudes toward learning, etc. then I wouldn't be as uncomfortable sending my kid to school A assuming my kid was honors/AP material. Because unless school A forced my kid to take classes with the general population and sit there bored while the teacher had to discipline rowdy students or explain partial fractions over and over to the least capable student in the class, then I don't care that much what the "average" SAT score is. Would you advise your kid to go to, say Yeshiva University in New York at $39,000 a year over UT Plan 2 Honors at $10,000 a year to study business because the average student at Yeshiva got higher test scores?

If it was a better environment for them over all, yes. Outside and peer influence plays a much large roll in performance of a student at the k-12 level as opposed to the collegiate level. "Everyone" goes to grade school, a select few go to prestigious 4 year universities.

The scenario you're referring to, DISD already does, they just don't keep the students at the normal high schools. They pull them and put them in magnet programs. Why? More resources and a better social environment. The kids aren't worried about getting beat up because of some stupid gang initiation, they are there to learn and excel like all the other classmates in their school.

And yes, you shouldn't focus solely on SAT scores to select what school would be best for your family. But when you could move into say JJ Pearce or WT White feeder zone (same housing prices and within 10 minute drive of each other), I think a difference of 359 SAT points should have a significant factor on your decision.