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math--I'm not sure what you are talking about when you say NEPA was designated forever wild. Other than state parks and game land, what is there designated to not be developed? How does that affect big business development?
In this day and age I never understood why people thought merely a high school diploma "entitles" them to a high wage for the rest of their lives. If you don't either go through a vo-tech program, go to a trade school, apprentice somewhere to learn a trade, go to college, etc., then you have nobody but yourself to blame for being in an unsavory financial situation.
Hi Paul -
We cannot make assumptions or reproach everyone without a college degree/diploma and/or with a lower paying job, presuming they've had the same advantages as others & are merely financially careless or unmotivated. "Blame" is a very critical word. Sure, there will always be those with a sense of entitlement who want to put out little effort & reap big rewards. Perhaps we travel in vastly differing circles, but, I haven’t routinely met folks who believe a HS diploma entitles them to any particular perks, although I have met a handful of college grads who do feel this way. Yes, we can pick an unrealistic bunch from any grouping of people, regardless of age, field, area of this country or other country.
There are also those who throw away a college education & float through, partying more than studying, as someone else is footing the financial bill for their extended high school games. Not everyone with a diploma/degree is brilliant... not everyone without is inept/unmotivated.
We don't know each other's stories & it's very easy to assume & dismiss, but, it is unfair. I really wish you'd lighten up on customarily espousing this judgement of others. You've mentioned before that you're someone who often strives to be accepted & it would therefore be of the utmost grace to offer acceptance & non-prejudiced views towards others, rather than dismissing them with casual estimations. I used to feel the same when you were in a l o n g period of calling any women on the board over 30 a "soccer mom". Again, not everyone of a certain age is a pear-shaped, matronly, sneaker-clad grandma with a yellow sweater looking for thick waistbands on her polyester "slacks" to coordinate with her cat's matching sweater vest. My dear, you might be quite surprised at how young 40, 45 & even 50 looks today on those who routinely care for themselves... & not even know it's staring you straight in the face unless told. I've seen 50-yr old men at the beach with tighter abs & nicer skin than the puffball, 20-yr olds standing next to him. If we want to be accepted for what we are, we must offer an open-mind first.
Many folks have family situations that require they immediately work after high school, for many reasons - helping out single parents/raising siblings, marriage/pregnancy (unplanned & planned), having to leave home to fend for themselves, etc., in which case, the opportunities for university, community college or even trade schools aren't options. Some need to hit the ground running, would welcome the education option, might have even been very successful at it & given it their all, but it just wasn't in the cards for them at that time. Perhaps opportunities for education will open up for them down the road, but, some will find themselves in situations which may disallow advanced education, again, for a whole host of reasons - "unexpected" children, working 2nd/3rd shifts, caring for parents or extended family.
Don't forget that there are some who aren't capable of a university environment. They may not have the learning capabilities. They are wonderful people, work their hardest at their jobs (menial as others may judge them to be), are valuable employees & helpful, pleasant co-workers... but cannot handle the scope of subject matter or workload.
Others may not be able to handle the mental & emotional stress of college. As an aside, some find that in the work world after college, as well. I was amazed when I lived in Seattle in the mid-90's, how many former Wall St. hot shots, sales execs & all around Type-A's owned $40K espresso carts, trading in their uber-salaries, bonuses & commissions for a less stressed way of life with less traffic, less responsibilities, less expenses, more family time, more play time, fresh air & far less money. One man I bought coffee from regularly was a former doctor/research scientist. He decided around age 50, he was headed for more accolades in his career with another lauded, published book/study & a bigger bank account... that he'd soon be splitting in 1/2 once his wife divorced him, if he didn't begin to spend time with her & their kids. He left his NYC apartment & lab & decided to work from 7am-1pm, manning his own street corner cart. He was enjoying his life with his family for the 1st time. At age 50, his hectic life of stress cleanly etched in his face made him look 15-yrs older. I had some of the most brilliant conversations with him. When I told him this, he looked at me in awe & said it was the first time he'd had time in his life for casual conversation. His previous life was conferences, meetings, planes, long lab hours, busy schedules, boxed food, long hours of documentation & sleeping in hotels.
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... but the burden lies on the potential EMPLOYEE to SELL THEMSELVES to prospective employers, not the other way around. I myself am still in college and have ALREADY had LOCAL job offers; I don't know why everyone else whines about being dirt poor. If this area's economy is truly THAT horrid, then why are the parking lots of seemingly every local restaurant and shopping center always PACKED on weekends with dozens of NEWER vehicles? Obviously if people can afford to live here and make payments on NEWER vehicles, then things aren't too bad.
We all know there's far less work in Wyoming Valley as there're far less people & companies, in general. We all know the workforce also has always tended to be more blue collar there. When I was a kid, the mines were still opened. Most of my schoolmates had blue collar parents. Nothing wrong with that... just not helpful in careers one trains for if going the college route & there is only so far on the income/promotion level one can rise being a small retail store manager for a local operation.
If one has financial goals, desires to take EU vacations, send kids to college or support a large family... they may be hard pressed to find what they need there, sadly. Now some big box stores have moved in, so perhaps regional/district management positions may be in the future of a few, but, when I was a kid, they didn't exist. Many folks reluctantly left the area out of necessity. They still do. At least one of my nieces will leave after graduation with her medical degree. Blue collar jobs are hard & admirable work (I've had them in the past)... but not all of us have careers which can transfer to living in W-B, otherwise I'd have gladly moved back many years ago for a quieter, less traffic/crime, fresher air existence with a hometown feel.
So, sell oneself on an interview? Yes, but there needs to be a job vacancy beforehand or opportunity available. Many retirees are in the area from NY/NJ, considered wealthy by the area's standards after selling their high-priced homes. The area affords them early retirement because COL is so low. I'd venture to guess (yes, it is a guess) a good portion of the upscale cars are from those who didn't grow up & make a living in the Valley. You also know there're a significant amount of out-of-state students in the area, too, with a nice vehicle complements of mom & dad. Good for them. I don't judge them. It's just that if you had your small family-based store, did seamstress work from home while raising your kids, worked in a plant, or worked for local, small companies... many folks have always & still do struggle to make ends meet & are not driving high-end vehicles.
We need to collectively have more compassion for folks who make an honest wage & have sincerely done the best they could at the time, with what they had available to them. Sometimes circumstances are thrust upon us... layoffs, mass firings, hostile takeovers & oustings, outsourcing... I've experienced each of these... & took all my education & experience & worked at Starbucks for $7.50/hr or $5.50/hr + meager tips as a hairdresser to make ends meet, looking for my next opportunity to find better paying work. I'd feel discouraged if every person who saw me harshly judged me based on assumptions they had about me during for those lean days. I was doing the best I could, paying my bills, not accepting unemployment & doing my job well.
And... remember my friend, I don't even own a yellow sweater or anything with a waistband!
You're my buddy & I love your posts & your POV, but can you expand it a little? Keep writing. I welcome suggestions, too, don't forget.
Happy President's Day... VV
Last edited by Baltic_Celt; 02-18-2008 at 04:19 PM..
The newer vehicled people may also be ones like my, who lives here but commutes an hour for a big enough salary to let me stay home and afford the finer things in life while living in this beautiful area.
And, my husband has no college degree, self taught smarty who has an awesome job that's so nerdy I dont understand at all. So sometimes college means squat. I have a master's degree and made a whopping $21k teaching here at a catholic school, I could have made more as a barista at starbucks
Paul the "newer" vehicles mean nothing. The average household has what close to $9,000 in credit card debt and thats not including their mortgage. Newer suv's and cars are not that hard to get. I have a few friends that have H2's and guess what they are paying for it. They don't have much left at the end of the month but they have that truck. Today's financing and dealerships make it very easy for someone to get over extended in their debt with a big new fancy car. These cars are no indication of anything other then the fact that people are able to bury themselves in debt.
Just like alot of the Mcmansions that we see in the area and thats the same around the country. The mortgage companies would put anyone in a house for many years and now we are seeing a huge increase in foreclosures around the nation.
The job market around here is poor. I'm not knocking you because your a kid this time but you'll see. A college degree is a promise of nothing in the world remember that. There are not alot of family sustaining jobs in the area Paul and just because someone did not or could not goto college doesn't mean that they don't matter. We have had this discussion before. The classifieds in the Scranton area are shrinking on a weekly basis and thats not good for any area.
When I first moved here I was told that the people around here ,would rather eat there kids than spend money on food. lol lol As far as jobs that pay go you can blame the Scranton Chamber of Commerce for that one
math--I'm not sure what you are talking about when you say NEPA was designated forever wild. Other than state parks and game land, what is there designated to not be developed? How does that affect big business development?
the state owns soooooooooo many acres of pocono land that its hard or close to impossible to support large industrials either because of space, epa regulations or lack of roads and transportation facilities for products.
obviously it must be true because we have no large industrials or even corporations in nepa.
what was interesting was origionally we were looking at a development in lower mcungie before selecting tanglwood north. the homes were almost 75,000 more as well as taxes were double but it was just a hop to work in allentown or bethlehem. we decided to forget about the relocating to work part and took the lower priced home and lower taxes in tanglwood even though we knew we couldnt pull the plug full time just yet because there was really no work that would make it worthwhile for me to leave my job and move now..
hopefully depending on how the liquidation of some primo real estate over looking central park goes we may be able to move full time in a year or 2
In this day and age I never understood why people thought merely a high school diploma "entitles" them to a high wage for the rest of their lives. If you don't either go through a vo-tech program, go to a trade school, apprentice somewhere to learn a trade, go to college, etc., then you have nobody but yourself to blame for being in an unsavory financial situation.
I have never prescribed to the belief that one must spend thousands upon thousands of dollars to be successful. I just sort of fell into Culinary. I was in Philadelphia to work with a Music Management Company to try an sell my music and needed a job. My manager knew the owner of the Gentlemen's Club Delilah's Den and asked a favor of him hire me. They needed a cook and I said I could do it only having worked fast food several years back. I have now surpassed the average salary in the industry so it is really how you apply yourself to a situation . Wisdom through experience in my opinion will always outweigh diplomas. Yes, they can help and some will not hire without them but I am proof that you can reach the top of profession by learning on the job if you are given the chance.
Regarding NEPA, I just got home from visiting a work friend of my wife's. They are both from Brooklyn and used to work in the Stock Exchange. When I told them how I read about so many unhappy people here they laughed and said to try and live in Brooklyn. Enough said...
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My dear, you might be quite surprised at how young 40, 45 & even 50 looks today on those who routinely care for themselves... & not even know it's staring you straight in the face unless told. 
If this area's economy is truly THAT horrid, then why are the parking lots of seemingly every local restaurant and shopping center always PACKED on weekends with dozens of NEWER vehicles? Obviously if people can afford to live here and make payments on NEWER vehicles, then things aren't too bad.
