Photo radar speed change at 101 & 35th ave. Is anyone fighting these? (live, law) - Phoenix area - Arizona (AZ) - Page 3 - City-Data Forum

AZ_Ryan · 06-18-2009, 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flaghigh

Don-
I had my hearing in June 5 and here is the scoop with the mysterious 35th ave and 101 camera and 55 speed limit. The officer that was at the court stated that ADOT had the speed sign around 43rd and 101 from May 2008-January 7th 2009 due to no shoulder for the I17 work. Those that were able to get out of the ticket were able to use that since this was a tempary construction sign that can be moved and that day that you were driving there was no sign and if the office can attest that he was not in the area around that same time to say it was there then you may have a chance. I had printed articles and that did not do much so if you are able to state that you did not see a sign since it is movable it could have been moved by someone or blown down then you may have a chance since I truely believe it was moved by the time I went through. Good Luck to you in July

Thats complete BS. There was no 55mph sign at 43rd ave since May of 08. Otherwise I'd have about 500 tickets.

Flaghigh - what happened in the end? Was there a ruling or do you have to go back? Did you see a judge? Does the ADOT officer have evidence of this mysterious movable sign?

AZ_Ryan · 06-19-2009, 05:34 PM

Well I had my hearing today and let me tell you Don and Flaghigh left out some details I wish I had known.

Folks let me tell you that there is little chance of disputing one of these and winning.

At the hearing they have a hearing officer, a rep from Redflex, and DPS officer. The hearing officer has the authority to rule on the case, but does give you a chance to appeal (2 weeks)

The Redflex rep has a lot of evidence against you. They supply documents verifying the camera calibration before and after your violation, they have pictures like the ones you received in the mail, and worst was a scatter gram of the average vehicle speed a few minutes before and after you violation. More an that latter.

The DPS offer is supposedly the one patrols the area of freeway in question on a regular bases. He says there were 55mph signs posted before the camera since May of 08 but were removed on Jan 7th of 09. When I asked him, he rejected any chance of the sign having been moved or blown over.

At the end the hearing officer reviews the evidence and singles out the scatter-gram. He says this is the best piece of evidence for him to determine the case. In my case the average vehicle speed an my scatter-gram was 58mph and mine was 68mph. "Why was everyone else going slower than you if there was no sign?" he says. I also strongly got the impression that the see the same photo radar dispute several times a day and pretty much have their minds made up before they start. Unless you can produce picture or video evidence that there was no 55pmh sign at the exact location the DPS officer specified before Jan 7th, you have no case. The hearing officer even eludes to this himself. He also gets irritated if you try to argue. He rulled that I pay and gave me the opportunity to file an appeal. Obvioulsy I had nothing to fight with so I payed.

The bottom line is if you don't know what to prepare for your are screwed. I would not recommend anyone fight these unless you have picture or video evidence. Keep in mind the evidence must be BEFORE Jan 7th. They freely tell you the signs were moved and the 65MPH speed was restored after that time. Unfortunately for the people who got caught days before the change you are screwed. They will uphold it and there is nothing you can do.

Next time I get one of these I will throw it away and take my chances. You have a better chance that way than fighting it in court.

jgunn72 · 06-19-2009, 09:09 PM

Step 1: buy a device or devices that tell you where the cameras are to avoid getting a ticket. For instance, a good budget option may be a 99$ Iphone with the free trapster software loaded. This has all the fixed cameras and the mobile cameras are marked by you and other users. Due to the change in policy, the mobile cameras don't move as much and are thus easier to mark on trapster. Course there is the monthly At&t fee but hopefully it's not a whole not more that you were paying for your old cell phone.

Step 2: If despite #1 you STILL get a ticket, make Arizona legally serve you your ticket as due to a legal precidence, a ticket by mail has no legal binding and they must hand deliver the ticket to your house.

Step 3: If you do get served, pay the ticket as due to the kangaroo court, there is little to no chance you will get it overturned.

Don T. Lykcameras · 07-22-2009, 11:48 AM

Thought I'd follow up with the final results of my experience after my trial on 7/20. AZ_Ryan details were very accurate and were replicated to the letter in my trial. However I was able to catch a break. There are so many of these trials that a judge RARELY is hearing these cases. Insted they have "legal representatives" from the court listening to the states and the civilian arguements. According to the posts here from people with prior experiences with these "legal representatives" the decision seems to side with the state in most every case unless you have "bullett proof" evidence indicating your ticket was given prior to the signs and speed limits being changed on 1/7.
The break I got was the "legal representative" was 45 minutes late for the trial. The court moved three cases, including mine, into Judge Williams court and he personally listened to the arguments & evidence. All three tickets were dismissed by Judge Williams. I do not believe it was important to have any pictures or documentation of the signs. I say this because the first trial of the day the defendent had nothing but a verbal "i don't think this is fair" argument and her ticket was dismissed. I had the video of the stretch between 59th Ave & beyond the camera, showed it to the judge, and my ticket was dismissed. Judge Williams decision was based on "in order to stay consistent with my previous decisions I am dismissing this charge".
It is my opinion, and just that, if you apeal the "legal representatives" automatic guilty decision and get in front of Judge Williams we will dismiss the charge. I realize this will require everyone to once again drive to Surprise, miss work, and deal with another court date, but Judge Williams appears to have decided the situation surrounding these tickets and the 35th Ave camera does not warrant a ticket.
Hope others find this helpful and get the same results I was fortunate to get.
Good luck.

Rick Lee · 07-22-2009, 11:58 AM

I was in traffic court around 1994 and the judge dismissed every case in the room, saying she wanted to get home to watch Nancy Kerrigan skate (Olympics were on tv). I was happy to take it, but it just goes to show what kangaroo courts we have for traffic law.

jiminscottsdaleAZ · 08-01-2009, 06:38 PM

I found snapthisaz.com which appears to be a new site. They let you upload your photo from the photo radar ticket and if you get the most votes in a month they will pay your ticket. You can keep uploading your photo each month until you win. Only one guy so far but he gets $200 if no one else uploads a photo. Kind of a funny picture.

Robert A · 08-01-2009, 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jiminscottsdaleAZ

I found snapthisaz.com which appears to be a new site. They let you upload your photo from the photo radar ticket and if you get the most votes in a month they will pay your ticket. You can keep uploading your photo each month until you win. Only one guy so far but he gets $200 if no one else uploads a photo. Kind of a funny picture.

Please stop spamming. Please.

jiminscottsdaleAZ · 08-02-2009, 09:39 AM

Sorry just blogging, I guess you can call it what you want. Let's just talk about what you want to talk about...

eddriver · 08-02-2009, 10:50 AM

Last Saturday I was doing 55 on 10/17 with a pack of cars as I pass the photo radar, a car to my left blows by doing at least 10 mph faster than me. The camera flashes. I look down and see 55 on my speedometer.
Yesterday I received a letter with my photo saying I was doing 67 in a 55 zone.

jiminscottsdaleAZ · 08-02-2009, 11:10 AM

The other gotchas are when you go through an intersection with a red light camera and the camera also snaps a picture for speeding. I don't know what the buffer is for speeding but I went through one the other day at 48st and Broadway and I was only 5 over mainly to get past the yellow. This to me is more cunning then the highways because you come up to an intersection, the light turns yellow and if you try to stop you will be slamming on the brakes but you are not sure how long you have till it turns red so you speed up so you don't get the red light ticket but then they get you for speeding 5 over.... Seems like you have to slow down below the speed limit way before the intersection in order to avoid this trap, which seems overreaching to me...