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Teenagers most CERTAINLY are children ... and from a very carefully conducted evaluation, a good number of college students are too. 20 year olds riding skateboards and tiny bicycles that look to be the size of the bike I road when I was 6 years old!!! And when they aren't doing that, they are playing video games. You think these are signs of maturity?
Furthermore, 13 is technically a teenager ... which can be as young as one day older than a 12 year old. Do you think a 12 year old is wise enough to make their own decisions about life ... and what is best for themselves? Do you believe that whatever they "want" is OK for them to have or do?
But the better question is .... if there is "no agenda" to sexualize these children or mold social-sexual views ..... then none of this is appropriate for any of the kids in school at any age. Their knowledge of the entire pallet of sexual possibilities is NOT the responsibility of the government or public school system to impart to them, nor does this area of sexual education need to be comprehensive and complete by high school graduation time. That's not the purpose of education .... or is it?
With the deplorable state of academics today .... maybe refocusing the priorities toward reading, writing, math, science, and PARTICULARLY civics class would be more beneficial than assuring comprehensive sex training?
Yes, I most certainly do think a 13 year-old is capable of making some decisions for themselves, and coddling or controlling them only makes things worse... I read mature books, some with sexual content, at that age and turned out just fine. It didn't make me go have sex at 13, and somehow I've made it to 34 (almost 35) with no pregnancies, STDs, sexual hangups or other such issues. Give them some credit, and let them explore the world through books - it's safer than the alternatives, like the Internet or their peers, and you can't control their minds even if you lock them up until 18.
Well, bear in mind the alternative which I offered in the addendum in my last paragraph,
[Or alternatively.... perhaps all the authoritarian central planner types can M.Y.O.B. and allow a system of competing ideas, where schools can have a much wider degree of curriculum from which the consumer can select from such that it serve each individual consumers needs and desires most closely.]
The first two paragraphs where I said we could purge all non-science and math classes was sort of intended to illustrate to those who want to "purge" broad classes of information content from either the libraries, or even from the curriculum. It was an attempt to show them what it would be like if we took their purging idea to even greater extremes such that in doing so, it might give them a taste of what the consequences are of being too quick to break out the heavy-hand of content control when one wants to try to purge ideas in society.
Though I will admit, I am still curious what effect purging most non-science and non-math courses might have on test scores. I think a lot of people would lose interest in school (be it college or K-12), but that side effect aside, I still would like to know if that would help significantly increase our math and science scores.
I know you were being facetious, but some people really do want to follow your hypothetical model... and that scares the crap out of me. This country is quickly heading towards a Nazi-like regime, and as a Jew that makes me weep for our future generations.
Yes, I most certainly do think a 13 year-old is capable of making some decisions for themselves, and coddling or controlling them only makes things worse... I read mature books, some with sexual content, at that age and turned out just fine. It didn't make me go have sex at 13, and somehow I've made it to 34 (almost 35) with no pregnancies, STDs, sexual hangups or other such issues. Give them some credit, and let them explore the world through books - it's safer than the alternatives, like the Internet or their peers, and you can't control their minds even if you lock them up until 18.
The problem is, Americans still have that idiotic taboo concerning sex.
And as it's been proven, the more you make something taboo, the more curious the child is about it.
Teenagers most CERTAINLY are children ... and from a very carefully conducted evaluation, a good number of college students are too. 20 year olds riding skateboards and tiny bicycles that look to be the size of the bike I road when I was 6 years old!!! And when they aren't doing that, they are playing video games. You think these are signs of maturity?
We lable them adults at 18, we don't try to figure out it they are "mature" or not since it's subjective. We do know they are serving in the armed forces, voting, having sex, both gay and straight, getting married, living alone, traveling....along with skateboarding and playing videogames. We don't micromanage everything based on maturity, even using age is sketchy since maturity varies from person to person.
I don't know when a particular person should be reading about sex of any kind, but I assume it's when THEY start thinking about it and want to. Right?
And I'm confused about this thread now, are people upset about kids reading about sex or kids reading about GAY sex?
Go down to your local adult bookstore. You might be surprised what "straights" are sharing and teaching each other.
Are there still adult bookstores around? I haven't seen one in years. If so, I'm surprised as I'm sure more and better stuff is available online. Maybe you can direct me to the one you frequent... ... since you seem to be so knowlegable on the topic of what's inside.
This thread is hilarious. Where I went to school our required reading included D.H.Lawrence, Vladimir Nabokov, Joseph Conrad, Shakespeare, Chaucer. These were hard-hitting books filled to the brim with sex and violence. The themes were thought-provoking, and great for discussion and debate. Apparently young people no longer have the capacity to appreciate and study literature, or posess any type of critical thinking skills. What a bleak future if they are going to be expected to read Little House on the Prairie every year.
Then why would you deny them the opportunity to read these books? If their parents say it's okay, how is it fair to keep them from library collections?
So did subscription magazines at the school library you were employed at include any of the following?
Hustler
Playboy
Playgirl
Ball club quarterly
On our backs
Buttman
Screw
Barely legal
I have not read this thread past page 12 yet, wow is it popular!
One thing that keeps being repeated is the assertion that these books were not only assigned to high school students, but also assigned, recommended, or required for middle school students. The age of 10 keeps popping up in the discussion.
The article in the Blaze mentions mentions middle school students. It refers to Fox News as a source of the story. The linked Fox story clearly states
Quote:
A New Jersey school district has apologized to parents after requiring high school students to read books that include graphic depictions of lesbian sex and a homosexual orgy.
Quote:
One book, “Norwegian Wood,” was on a list for incoming sophomores in an honors English class.
But they also state
Quote:
The books were on a required reading list for middle school and high school students.
They refer to the Gloucester County Times as the source and link to it.
The Gloucester County Times makes no mention of middle school. The list was issued at Williamstown High School, "Norwegian Wood" was a choice on the list for a 10th grade honors English class, and "Tweak" was a choice on the list for a 12th grade honors English class.
There is no mention that the books were suggested for middle schoolers. Considering Fox News has been guilty of putting (D) next to names of Republicans caught in sex scandals, and more "errors" like that, I don't trust them when their facts differ from the source they cite, and they don't offer another source to back up the details that aren't in the cited source.
I'm about a third of the way through "Norwegian Wood" now. No homosexuality yet, but heterosexual sex, although not written in a lurid smutty way. Will give a full review when I'm done.
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