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Old 10-30-2015, 06:39 AM
 
Location: The Ranch in Olam Haba
23,707 posts, read 30,758,648 times
Reputation: 9985

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tall Traveler View Post
Are you being honest, you would put yourself under the control of ISIS rather than under Merkel (I don't know if she's Christian but she is European)....honestly how you feel??????? If yes, please enjoy a nice vacation in Ramadi and report back how safe you felt....might want to bring your wife and daughter as well.

By the way, you are living in a society that is predominantly Christian, why don't you leave considering how unsafe you feel and move to some of those Muslim ME countries that would welcome you with open arms and make you feel safer than those horrible Christians who are making you feel unsafe.
I said most and not all. The majority of the Middle East is relatively safe. Thinking ISIS (or groups similar to them) who are in a minority of areas which are currently in some type of war is living with blinders on. I spend over six months a year in the Middle East (six weeks in Israel and a week in Jordan) and have never had a issue. Iraq was made unsafe by the US and what followed is a direct result of the US and its interference of the status quo. As to Germany, it's basically the US with German as it's language.

As to Europe, I've been called numerous names and have dealt with Jew Bashing more than once.

As to my family, my wife is a whitebread American and both my sons are US Marines who have been to Afghanistan & Iraq for multiple tours. I was also a US Marine in the early 80's and was in Lebanon when the infamous incident occurred.

Let me give you some advice: Stop watching American media. Here's a link to other sites for getting the news.

NewsNow: World News news | Breaking News & Search 24/7

And as to being an American, the Christians in the US are not the same as the Christians in Europe. The America I live in is a mixture of people from different places and different religions and for a majority of the country we get along pretty well. So take off your blinders, take a step back and take a panoramic look around you.

BTW, Take your bigot remark and stick it where the sun don't shine.
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Old 10-30-2015, 06:51 AM
 
17,291 posts, read 29,411,909 times
Reputation: 8691
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pruzhany View Post
You need to read unbiased history. Islam was in it's infancy when it entered Europe around 700 AD and also took Jerusalem around the same time period. The First Crusade waited 400 years to make a bloody path to Jerusalem killing everyone who didn't think the way they did. The Muslims learned brutality pretty well from the Catholics and the response was multiple times worse to make a statement that they are not to be messed with. The current Extremists are using that method of response as a statement. The current secular/moderate Muslims for the most part follow the current European model which is pretty weak IMPOV.

As a Middle Eastern Jew, I trust Muslims more than I trust Christians. I feel safer in most of the Middle East than I feel when I'm in Europe.
LIKE THE GUY SAID: Islam f***** with Europe, first. Subjugating and conquering lands that were NOT THEIRS. From Iberia to Constantinople.

This, by the way, after it also spread across North Africa, subjugating populations which ALSO were not Arab.


And yes, it did take HUNDREDS of years before the Christian Kingdoms fought back and took what was theirs. Meanwhile, Islam had sacked and conquered the previous Christian lands. The Crusades and reconquista were merely...."comeuppance," as the kids say today.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Umayya...st_of_Hispania



And let's not FORGET the relatively modern history of the brutal Ottoman Empire! Why do you suppose SE European white people are counted amongst Muslims?

http://www.serfes.org/orthodox/memoryof.htm


If anything, it's European meddling in the Middle East that is fairly recent (after Ottoman involvement in WW1), and actually way less protracted - since it typically involves doing the bidding of the Arab rulers (Invading Iraq the first time for the comfort of Saudi and Kuwaitis for example).


And now you say you're more comfortable with Muslims in the Middle East than in Europe? Good. Maybe Europe and the US can leave your country to its own devices and see how you fair. The majority of modern animosity towards "the west" lies in large part because we support your country's existence. Mix that with stone age beliefs of an immature religion and it's a recipe for disaster.
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Old 10-30-2015, 07:02 AM
 
Location: The Ranch in Olam Haba
23,707 posts, read 30,758,648 times
Reputation: 9985
Quote:
Originally Posted by TriMT7 View Post
...
And now you say you're more comfortable with Muslims in the Middle East than in Europe? Good. Maybe Europe and the US can leave your country to its own devices and see how you fair. The majority of modern animosity towards "the west" lies in large part because we support your country's existence. Mix that with stone age beliefs of an immature religion and it's a recipe for disaster.
My country is the United States of America. What's yours?
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Old 10-30-2015, 07:08 AM
 
28,675 posts, read 18,801,179 times
Reputation: 30989
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pruzhany View Post
US is not simply in the Middle East just for the Oil. That view takes too narrow of the view of how things work in the ME. The US is there to represent Big Business and get contracts related to the Oil industry which Europe has had control of since the first drop was ever found. Instead of using the Bribery system that the EU uses, the US uses the Military assistance option which as we know doesn't work too well. Have people not noticed that certain European countries are very hesitant to join in on any Military related situations and wonder why? For those of us who work in the ME, we can see and listen to the languages spoken and we can tell you these contractors are not Americans.
Yes, it is all about the oil, but the worldwide oil industry is not simple.

That's why the US had no interest when Libya invaded Chad, and had no interest in Africa until oil contracts were signed in Nigeria...then suddenly the US AFRICOM was created.
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Old 10-30-2015, 07:13 AM
 
28,675 posts, read 18,801,179 times
Reputation: 30989
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
We did indeed depose their regime.

Perhaps it would have been better for us all if Clinton hadn't signed the Iraq Liberation Act into law.
Let's point out all the facts about that:

The bill was sponsored by Representative Benjamin A. Gilman (Republican, NY-20) and co-sponsored by Representative Christopher Cox (Republican, CA-47). The bill was introduced as H.R. 4655 on September 29, 1998. The House of Representatives passed the bill 360 - 38 on October 5, and the Senate passed it with unanimous consent two days later. President Clinton signed the Iraq Liberation Act into law on October 31, 1998.

Introduced by Republicans, it passed with veto-proof majorities in both houses.
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Old 10-30-2015, 07:17 AM
 
17,291 posts, read 29,411,909 times
Reputation: 8691
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pruzhany View Post
My country is the United States of America. What's yours?
And I imagine the "6 months I spend in the Middle East each year" is.... Saudi Arabia.... or Israel?


BTW: Nice deflection!
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Old 10-30-2015, 07:22 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,030 posts, read 44,853,831 times
Reputation: 13715
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph_Kirk View Post
Let's point out all the facts about that:

The bill was sponsored by Representative Benjamin A. Gilman (Republican, NY-20) and co-sponsored by Representative Christopher Cox (Republican, CA-47). The bill was introduced as H.R. 4655 on September 29, 1998. The House of Representatives passed the bill 360 - 38 on October 5, and the Senate passed it with unanimous consent two days later. President Clinton signed the Iraq Liberation Act into law on October 31, 1998.

Introduced by Republicans, it passed with veto-proof majorities in both houses.
Which included Democrats, no? The House and Senate didn't have 2/3 Republican majorities at the time (necessary to override a presidential veto). So why didn't Clinton simply veto the bill, and why wouldn't the Democrats at the time support him in doing so?
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Old 10-30-2015, 07:26 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,030 posts, read 44,853,831 times
Reputation: 13715
Things would have turned out VERY differently had Clinton not stated Iraq had WMDs in 1998, and had not signed the Iraq Liberation Act into law in 1998.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ENAV_UoIfgc
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Old 10-30-2015, 07:32 AM
 
Location: Phoenix
30,374 posts, read 19,177,636 times
Reputation: 26266
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pruzhany View Post
I said most and not all. The majority of the Middle East is relatively safe. Thinking ISIS (or groups similar to them) who are in a minority of areas which are currently in some type of war is living with blinders on. I spend over six months a year in the Middle East (six weeks in Israel and a week in Jordan) and have never had a issue. Iraq was made unsafe by the US and what followed is a direct result of the US and its interference of the status quo. As to Germany, it's basically the US with German as it's language.

As to Europe, I've been called numerous names and have dealt with Jew Bashing more than once.

As to my family, my wife is a whitebread American and both my sons are US Marines who have been to Afghanistan & Iraq for multiple tours. I was also a US Marine in the early 80's and was in Lebanon when the infamous incident occurred.

Let me give you some advice: Stop watching American media. Here's a link to other sites for getting the news.

NewsNow: World News news | Breaking News & Search 24/7

And as to being an American, the Christians in the US are not the same as the Christians in Europe. The America I live in is a mixture of people from different places and different religions and for a majority of the country we get along pretty well. So take off your blinders, take a step back and take a panoramic look around you.

BTW, Take your bigot remark and stick it where the sun don't shine.
What bigoted remark...I made no bigoted remark and didn't attack you personally as you are doing telling me to stick it where the sun don't shine? I just was advising you to follow the natural progression of leaving what you claim is unsafe ground of Christendom to go to the safe territory of ISIS ville and tell us how safe the Muslims are compared to the horrible Christians you deal with (by the way, the Jew bashers you mentioned, how do you know they are Christians because Christians I know don't do that?). Too bad the Christians in the ME are making Israel feel unsafe forcing the Muslims to protect them.

I don't watch US media at all. I live in Peru and watch primarily BBC. I don't have blinders on, I've worked all over the world including multiple ME countries as well as Asia, Europe, S. America, N. America and haven't spend appreciable time in the USA in over a decade....so no blinders.
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Old 10-30-2015, 07:37 AM
 
Location: The Ranch in Olam Haba
23,707 posts, read 30,758,648 times
Reputation: 9985
Quote:
Originally Posted by TriMT7 View Post
And I imagine the "6 months I spend in the Middle East each year" is.... Saudi Arabia.... or Israel?


BTW: Nice deflection!
Dubai if you must know.
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