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Old 07-19-2018, 01:53 PM
 
Location: NNJ
15,074 posts, read 10,108,006 times
Reputation: 17276

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Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Why? It's bad business to pay employees more than their labor is worth. That's what causes businesses to close: Mismanagement.
Worth of anything is whatever someone is legally allowed to pay for it.... Business is more than willing to relocate just like people have been doing.

Either way, both businesses and people are complacent in labor subsidized by tax payer funds.
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Old 07-19-2018, 01:58 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,037 posts, read 44,853,831 times
Reputation: 13718
Quote:
Originally Posted by usayit View Post
Worth of anything is whatever someone is legally allowed to pay for it.
Not necessarily. There is no minimum value on real estate. Many homes sell for far below even what the tax assessor claims they're worth.
Quote:
Either way, both businesses and people are complacent in labor subsidized by tax payer funds.
Then eliminate public assistance for all but the truly incapacitated. People should live within their means. No one is owed a minimum standard of living. Problem solved.
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Old 07-19-2018, 02:00 PM
 
Location: NNJ
15,074 posts, read 10,108,006 times
Reputation: 17276
Quote:
Originally Posted by ottomobeale View Post
Walmart pays above the median for such type of work. $11 and up.
many other big box stores are still in the $8-9.50 range.

We are going to put them all out of business?
No business should be allowed to subsidize their labor costs with tax payer funds... period.

No Walmart won't go out of business. They do so because they can... To line the pockets of the executives living wealthy in part with tax funds. Even worse, Walmart receives tax breaks and tax subsidies.

If Walmart indeed cannot pay enough so that their employees do not require public assistance, then yes... they should go out of business. Just like the establishments mention in NYC.
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Old 07-19-2018, 02:20 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,037 posts, read 44,853,831 times
Reputation: 13718
Quote:
Originally Posted by usayit View Post
No business should be allowed to subsidize their labor costs with tax payer funds... period.

No Walmart won't go out of business. They do so because they can... To line the pockets of the executives living wealthy in part with tax funds. Even worse, Walmart receives tax breaks and tax subsidies.
Apparently, you don't realize that CalPERS, the California Public Employees Retirement System is a major owner of Walmart stock shares. California public employees' pensions and retirement benefits are funded via the earnings/gains that Walmart stock shares yield (same for the other corporate shares CalPERS owns). To believe that only executives benefit from corporate profits is extremely naïve, at best, but more likely extremely under-informed and foolish. Anyone who has a pension, retirement account, annuity, etc., all benefit from corporate profits and gains in stock share prices.
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Old 07-19-2018, 02:28 PM
 
Location: The Eastern Shore
4,466 posts, read 1,607,081 times
Reputation: 1566
I love all you folks on here saying things like, "If you don't like being poor, just get a better job!" or "better yourself!", or "work 2-3 jobs!", or all the similar things that have been said like this. I don't think you guys understand the reality of the world. Even if every single poor person in this country went back to school and got PhD's, someone would still have to flip burgers, and run cash registers, and bring you your food at restaurants, etc etc etc. Meaning you would now have a ton of people in a ton of debt, that are still flipping burgers, and wholly overqualified. Hell, we are running into that kind of thing now, where you have people way overqualified for the positions they are in.


Your whole, "Just get better!" doesn't work, period. Will it work for a few? Sure. But to sit here and say it is all the person's fault because they don't have a degree or a trade is simply false, and idiotic.... at best. It is merely some scenario you guys think up, and somehow think it is the trump card or something. It would be great if that was all it took to make more money and not struggle, but anyone that halfway understands how the world works knows it isn't.
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Old 07-19-2018, 03:05 PM
 
Location: Chicago, IL
9,701 posts, read 5,115,103 times
Reputation: 4270
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Why? It's bad business to pay employees more than their labor is worth. That's what causes businesses to close: Mismanagement.
And the only factor that matters when judging what their labor is worth is what kind of profit they generate. If a burger flipper generates $X/profit of an hour, it doesn't matter how lowly you think of that person, skillset, or position. They have a right to argue that their wages should correlate to the money they add to the bottom line.
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Old 07-19-2018, 03:20 PM
 
Location: NNJ
15,074 posts, read 10,108,006 times
Reputation: 17276
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Apparently, you don't realize that CalPERS, the California Public Employees Retirement System is a major owner of Walmart stock shares. California public employees' pensions and retirement benefits are funded via the earnings/gains that Walmart stock shares yield (same for the other corporate shares CalPERS owns). To believe that only executives benefit from corporate profits is extremely naïve, at best, but more likely extremely under-informed and foolish. Anyone who has a pension, retirement account, annuity, etc., all benefit from corporate profits and gains in stock share prices.
Deflection again.... the point is that Walmart specifically benefits for tax payer funded assistance labor and that contributes to their bottom line. It doesn't matter who is benefiting from it.... it is federal tax payer funds. As a tax payer who doesn't reside in CA I certainly not benefiting from them.

The issue isn't illegal immigration or who benefits from Walmart stocks in CA. It is simply that any business entity private should not be subsidizing labor costs with tax payer monies. I may be naive but at least i can stay on topic and don't resort to deflection.

Quote:
Walmart receives an estimated $6.2 billion annually in mostly federal taxpayer subsidies. The reason: Walmart pays its employees so little that many of them rely on food stamps, healthcare and other taxpayer-funded programs.

Walmart avoids an estimated $1 billion in federal taxes each year. The reason: Walmart uses tax breaks and loopholes, including a strategy known as accelerated depreciation that allows it to write off capital investments considerably faster than the assets actually wear out.

The Waltons avoid an estimated $607 million in federal taxes on their Walmart dividends. The reason: income from investments is taxed at a much lower tax rate than income from salaries and wages.
http://www.jwj.org/how-u-s-taxpayers...lthiest-family

This is just as wrong as the businesses in NYC that do the same on a smaller scale.

Last edited by usayit; 07-19-2018 at 03:28 PM..
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Old 07-19-2018, 03:32 PM
 
Location: NNJ
15,074 posts, read 10,108,006 times
Reputation: 17276
Quote:
Originally Posted by ImissThe90's View Post
I love all you folks on here saying things like, "If you don't like being poor, just get a better job!" or "better yourself!", or "work 2-3 jobs!", or all the similar things that have been said like this. I don't think you guys understand the reality of the world. Even if every single poor person in this country went back to school and got PhD's, someone would still have to flip burgers, and run cash registers, and bring you your food at restaurants, etc etc etc. Meaning you would now have a ton of people in a ton of debt, that are still flipping burgers, and wholly overqualified. Hell, we are running into that kind of thing now, where you have people way overqualified for the positions they are in.


Your whole, "Just get better!" doesn't work, period. Will it work for a few? Sure. But to sit here and say it is all the person's fault because they don't have a degree or a trade is simply false, and idiotic.... at best. It is merely some scenario you guys think up, and somehow think it is the trump card or something. It would be great if that was all it took to make more money and not struggle, but anyone that halfway understands how the world works knows it isn't.
Education and access to programs to improve oneself is a major problem. It is the key to bettering one's financial standing.

However, upping minimum wage to a living wage and/or welfare in of itself isn't going to solve that problem. I say this as a person who has been there... and still predominantly have friends/family in that situation (I am the one lucky one in my circle of friends). I am also not a Trump supporter. This is a totally different discussion.. access and cost of education and that poverty is absolutely inheritable.
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Old 07-19-2018, 03:41 PM
 
17,308 posts, read 12,260,346 times
Reputation: 17262
Yeah upping the minimum wage alone just ups the poverty line itself and decreases the value of everyone's dollar.
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Old 07-19-2018, 06:34 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles (Native)
25,303 posts, read 21,468,776 times
Reputation: 12318
Quote:
Originally Posted by notnamed View Post
Yeah upping the minimum wage alone just ups the poverty line itself and decreases the value of everyone's dollar.
While also putting the existence of small businesses at risk.

It’s a lose lose policy really .
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