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Campbell, I'm still waiting for you to address this little fly in your ointment...Your God's year could equal 1000 years during creation doesn't do it, because we are talking about the time gap between the flood and exodus.....
How do eight people generate millions in only 857 years of 24 hour days....I'm very interested in how you are going to wriggle out of this one, unless of course you are willing to admit that either the flood or the exodus couldn't have happened...
I won't hold my breath since I have never once seen you admit that you were wrong about anything, even when ( as in this case) the bible proves itself wrong.
There is no fly in the ointment here sanspeur. Many believe the flood occured around 3300 B.C. And just as many believe the Exodus occured in 1446 B.C. That would mean a difference of 1,854 years. Your timing is off sanspeur by about 1,000 years. No one has to wriggle out of anything. You only have to consider the accurate Biblical account. It is the Bible that proves itself correct. Please don't expect us to accept your incorrect numbers. And of course the flood occured, and that is why we have pictures from the NAMI of the inside of the Ark on Mt. Ararat. And the Exodus occured, and that is why they found the Red Sea crossing site.
There is no fly in the ointment here sanspeur. Many believe the flood occured around 3300 B.C. And just as many believe the Exodus occured in 1446 B.C. That would mean a difference of 1,854 years. Your timing is off sanspeur by about 1,000 years. No one has to wriggle out of anything. You only have to consider the accurate Biblical account. It is the Bible that proves itself correct. Please don't expect us to accept your incorrect numbers. And of course the flood occured, and that is why we have pictures from the NAMI of the inside of the Ark on Mt. Ararat. And the Exodus occured, and that is why they found the Red Sea crossing site.
They are not my numbers...They are straight from answers in genesis, (their bible chronology) the site on which you so often rely. As expected you would rather choke to death than admit the possibility that you could be wrong...In any case even accepting your numbers, tell me how the earths population could go from 8 people to millions in 46 generations. Even barring deaths I don't see how this is possible.
I don't believe either event actually happened, but even if one of them did that would rule out the other.
According to the King James Version of the Bible, the Flood was 1656 years after Creation.
Irish archbishop James Ussher calculated that the creation of the world took place in 4004 BC. If 1656 is deducted from 4004 then the worldwide flood of Noah's time was around 2348 BC.
So you are saying that you are more of an expert than the bible and James Ussher...Have I got that right?
Still no Egyptian documentation. Or anyone else's, for that matter.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Campbell34
Some people believe that God's 6 days of creation are six 24 hours days. Others like myself believe each day = 1,000 years. So sometimes the Bibles timeline is not as clear as some would have us believe. So it's not really a question of believeing the Bible, as much as it is understanding the Bible.
You bet! Selective Beliefs of Convenience again, huh? Tom, you really ought to have that looked at; maybe an ointment or sumthin... Still, this past year has felt like a thousand years for me, I tell yah! But still, my Cesium-Atomic receptive watch assures me it's only been a year. Science is such a spoil-sport for fairy-tales, ain't it?
In your case, it's clearly a question of believing parts of the fable, which you assemble in a badly fitting mosaic of lies and assumptions. Here, you say 1 year = a thousand; there, you say C14 dating was accurate on inorganic materials; here you accept a preliminary suggestion of soft dino tissue later proven to be nothing of the sort, then there... you claim that NAMI™ has actual photos from inside The Ark, which of course they don't. NAMI's a total and continuing fraud, as I've proven in the past.
But then here you assiduously ignore simple population dynamics math, which clearly disallows such massive population growth in an insufficient time frame. 106 trillion, Tom... really?
As Rafius correctly notes below, you really lost it this time. Talk about being irrelevant: Bill Clinton has nothing on your arguments! Remember now, we're talking about Egyptian documentation, which in and of itself disproves the Creation timetable as well as a total lack of that culture's documentation of a massive, inundating global flood. Oh yeah, with subsequent co-existing trained dinosaurs that have vanished in only the past 1500 years, without so much as a single trace sample, unlike them complete, bones'n'skin Alaskan and Russian mammoths we've found (13k - 18k yrs old, BTW. Determined by the very C14 dating you love to hate/love/hate...). Yep: What a laugh.
Sorry. You lose. You needn't to admit it though; it's obvious to us all. Your lack of personal honesty, credibility, scientific education and accountability are perhaps the most egregious problems here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rafius
Totally irrelevant, old thing....nothing to do with creation. Creation was all done and dusted before the period we are addressing. Bible chronology says that the flood took place around 2300 BCE. "Many", according to you, claim it took place between 3400 - 4990 BCE. Which are you going with?
Answer: whichever fits the argument of the day, and forgetting what he claimed yesterday. As in....
Quote:
Originally Posted by Campbell34
There is no fly in the ointment here sanspeur. Many believe the flood occured around 3300 B.C. And just as many believe the Exodus occured in 1446 B.C. That would mean a difference of 1,854 years.
to this rubbish rifleman notes: As always, you try to invoke the "Appeal to the Majority" and to some imagined widespread scholarly agreement, which in fact does not exist. Your constant assurances that "many scientists are now finding ____________" is a load of very old but oft-repeated manure, since no such agreement on your tepid ideas ever exists, except in your mind.
Your timing is off sanspeur by about 1,000 years. No one has to wriggle out of anything. You only have to consider the accurate Biblical account. It is the Bible that proves itself correct. Please don't expect us to accept your incorrect numbers. And of course the flood occured, and that is why we have pictures from the NAMI of the inside of the Ark on Mt. Ararat. And the Exodus occured, and that is why they found the Red Sea crossing site.
Well, let me correct you here again, tommo. Since no-one of any credibility has ever found that elusive crossing or your silly Ark, you're again left with nothing except what the rubble-head web-site authors, always grubbing for funds and airline tickets, splutter to the confused and frantic.
And so, we'll just suffer and chuckle through you re-posting it over and over again. What a hoot!
I must say that there is always lots of entertainment value in any thread that old Tom participates in...They say laughing is good for the soul, but even not believing in a soul, it's still good.
There is no fly in the ointment here sanspeur. Many believe the flood occured around 3300 B.C. And just as many believe the Exodus occured in 1446 B.C.
...but you Campo...YOU, what do YOU believe. Do you believe the "many" that say 3400 - 4990BCE or do you believe the Bible chronology that says around 2300 BCE?
We are all expecting you to run with 2300BCE for the flood and 1440BCE for Exodus because that's what the Bible chronology says and we all know how much you love to use the Bible as evidence mate. So how say you?
The story of the Exodus is like a combination lock. ALL the tumblers have to line up in order to open the lock. And those land marks have to be found in an accurate sequence. And when you consider the number of such. Then you will understand, that this is something that cannot be fabricated. Now if you don't want to consider the evidence or the written word. Then what can one say? It's like finding a treasure map, and then saying. "Well, I don't believe the map and it's 20 paces. I believe it was 100 paces". You have to follow the information given, or there is no reason to follow anything at all. Do you not agree?
I agree that you completely misunderstand me as usual. I understand that you are doing your usual business of eagerly believing anything which supports your literal Bible - faith.
I know that cultists - and that is what Wyatt and his followers are - look around Dainiken - style for anything that looks like it fits their theory.
Now I agree that these 'tumblers' all look like they line up. As they are presented. I have already noted some problems both with the written word (the results of which you selectively ignore) and with the 'evidence' some of which already looks doubtful.
I would like to go so far as to say that the landmarks do appear to support the Exodus story, but I honestly cannot, because there are checks which first need to be made and I am having trouble in doing so because of the poor reporting of the context of these features (1). I am willing to be agnostic about this matter which is more than you are of course.
However, to return to the OP, how about the Written support? We know there is none outside the bible, but do you not agree that the Bible account itself is Chronologically unworkable?
(1) you could help if you could direct me to any pics or vids which give a view in context of these boundary - markers, pillars and the mountain.
They are not my numbers...They are straight from answers in genesis, (their bible chronology) the site on which you so often rely. As expected you would rather choke to death than admit the possibility that you could be wrong...In any case even accepting your numbers, tell me how the earths population could go from 8 people to millions in 46 generations. Even barring deaths I don't see how this is possible.
I don't believe either event actually happened, but even if one of them did that would rule out the other.
According to the King James Version of the Bible, the Flood was 1656 years after Creation.
Irish archbishop James Ussher calculated that the creation of the world took place in 4004 BC. If 1656 is deducted from 4004 then the worldwide flood of Noah's time was around 2348 BC.
So you are saying that you are more of an expert than the bible and James Ussher...Have I got that right?
Don't you get it? Answers in genesis is not the end all for Biblical truth. There are a number of opinions out there for when the flood occured, and the Exodus happened. And many of them have good reasons for their beliefs. Yet it is now common knowledge that archbishop James Ussher as sincere as he was about his Biblical timeline. Most theological circles no longer accept his chronology. I'm saying you are looking at a mans view from the past. And it is a view that is nolonger believed by many Bible scholars.
Henry Morris gives the following examples of possible population growth rates of the earth at various times in history.
If the average family has 4 children who later have families of their own, and that each set of parents lives to see all their grandchildren. For these conditions which are not at all unreasonable, the population at the end of 5 generations would be 96, after 10 generations, 3,070; after 15 generations, 98,300; after 20 generations, 3,150,000; and after 30 generations, 3,220,000,000. In one more generation (31) the total would increase to 6.5 billion.
I agree that you completely misunderstand me as usual. I understand that you are doing your usual business of eagerly believing anything which supports your literal Bible - faith.
I know that cultists - and that is what Wyatt and his followers are - look around Dainiken - style for anything that looks like it fits their theory.
Now I agree that these 'tumblers' all look like they line up. As they are presented. I have already noted some problems both with the written word (the results of which you selectively ignore) and with the 'evidence' some of which already looks doubtful.
I would like to go so far as to say that the landmarks do appear to support the Exodus story, but I honestly cannot, because there are checks which first need to be made and I am having trouble in doing so because of the poor reporting of the context of these features (1). I am willing to be agnostic about this matter which is more than you are of course.
However, to return to the OP, how about the Written support? We know there is none outside the bible, but do you not agree that the Bible account itself is Chronologically unworkable?
(1) you could help if you could direct me to any pics or vids which give a view in context of these boundary - markers, pillars and the mountain.
EXODUS PATH CONFIRMED BY NASA SATELLITE
Well, here is some information I'm sure you have never heard about before. It appears before the Gulf War. America shifted its Keyhole-satellite into a position over the Iraqi desert. To the surprise of many, a very thin red line appeared which orginated from the ancient site of Rameses in the Land of Goshen (EGYPT) ran eastward, skirting the Red Sea. And continued down to the Gulf of Aquaba, and then emerged from the east side of the Red Sea and continued onward, eventually ending up in present day Saudi Arabia at the foot of a 3,465 mountain known as "Jabal al Lawz". Well, surprise, surprise!
The satellite photo team stared incredulously at the photo! A red line, as if drawn by God's own finger, traced the exact route of the exodus. When the Gulf war finally came to the end. Archeologists went back to the region to discover how it was possible that such an old trail still existed today, and showed up on a satellite photo.
As they soon discovered, the million plus people, with all their livestock, pulverized the desert sand into a fine, flour-like powder. During the desert nights, the humidity rises to levels of near 100%, thus wetting the powdery sand, making a concrete-like substance. And under these conditions, that concrete-like substance was detected by American infrared satellites.
The Path discovered is the same path that was pointed to by Wyatt, Moller, Cornuke, and others. And now it is being confirmed by NASA satellites. Consider the link below.
Well, here is some information I'm sure you have never heard about before. It appears before the Gulf War. America shifted its Keyhole-satellite into a position over the Iraqi desert. To the surprise of many, a very thin red line appeared which orginated from the ancient site of Rameses in the Land of Goshen (EGYPT) ran eastward, skirting the Red Sea. And continued down to the Gulf of Aquaba, and then emerged from the east side of the Red Sea and continued onward, eventually ending up in present day Saudi Arabia at the foot of a 3,465 mountain known as "Jabal al Lawz". Well, surprise, surprise!
The satellite photo team stared incredulously at the photo! A red line, as if drawn by God's own finger, traced the exact route of the exodus. When the Gulf war finally came to the end. Archeologists went back to the region to discover how it was possible that such an old trail still existed today, and showed up on a satellite photo.
As they soon discovered, the million plus people, with all their livestock, pulverized the desert sand into a fine, flour-like powder. During the desert nights, the humidity rises to levels of near 100%, thus wetting the powdery sand, making a concrete-like substance. And under these conditions, that concrete-like substance was detected by American infrared satellites.
The Path discovered is the same path that was pointed to by Wyatt, Moller, Cornuke, and others. And now it is being confirmed by NASA satellites. Consider the link below.
Don't you get it? Answers in genesis is not the end all for Biblical truth. There are a number of opinions out there for when the flood occured, and the Exodus happened. And many of them have good reasons for their beliefs. Yet it is now common knowledge that archbishop James Ussher as sincere as he was about his Biblical timeline. Most theological circles no longer accept his chronology. I'm saying you are looking at a mans view from the past. And it is a view that is nolonger believed by many Bible scholars.
Henry Morris gives the following examples of possible population growth rates of the earth at various times in history.
If the average family has 4 children who later have families of their own, and that each set of parents lives to see all their grandchildren. For these conditions which are not at all unreasonable, the population at the end of 5 generations would be 96, after 10 generations, 3,070; after 15 generations, 98,300; after 20 generations, 3,150,000; and after 30 generations, 3,220,000,000. In one more generation (31) the total would increase to 6.5 billion.
Henry Morris twists the truth almost as badly as you do, and that's a whole bunch. below are population estimates from a LEGITIMATE site. Note that there is no catastrophic decline in population at the time of your mythical flood. Morris's assumtions are not reasonable considering that the average life expectancy during the bronze and iron ages was 35 years, and by the time of the Greek and Roman empires it had fallen to 28 years....His numbers also do not work, because people die.
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Still no Egyptian documentation. Or anyone else's, for that matter.
