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Old 07-27-2012, 09:39 PM
 
808 posts, read 1,679,209 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobtn View Post
Why would they? We're doing more complex things now than were done decades back, when the majority of any workforce were hired simply based on having four working limbs.

Robots can mimic those limbs beautifully; they take no breaks, file no grievenecs, take no vacation or sick time.

AS Thomas Friedman said well "The days of being average and getting by well are over".
College provides no more job skills than a HS degree unless you're majoring in something professional. Let's be real. What does college teach you how to do? To actually do? Or do you follow the line that you learn how to learn in college?

Job skills are learned on the job.
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Old 07-27-2012, 09:51 PM
 
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan
29,827 posts, read 24,917,786 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KnownUnknown View Post
College provides no more job skills than a HS degree unless you're majoring in something professional. Let's be real. What does college teach you how to do? To actually do? Or do you follow the line that you learn how to learn in college?

Job skills are learned on the job.
College is good when it comes to conveying ideas and concepts. The private sector is good for actually teaching a worker how to do their job efficiently, effectively and precisely. Part of that comes from the fact that there are no make up tests because half the class failed... There is the door if you can't do the job right. That's a lesson that you can't afford not to learn

What was frightening about my experience in college vs. the real world was how far apart the two actually were. No employer is going to invest that level of time and patience with a worker. You can either do the work or you can't, and if you can't learn it, someone else will. The whole everybody is a winner thing being spoon fed to students from K-12 and above is making this a rather uncompetitive and soft nation I'm afraid. Worse, when folks can't make it in the private sector, they end up right back in the education system, essentially "hiding out". Even WORSE is the fact that the government is basically financing this and producing a huge bubble. This bubble just surpassed credit card debt, and still it's not being talked about. Instead, it's being packaged into triple A rated debt that many are betting their retirements on... This REALLY scares me...

One thing that stood out in my mind from my time in nursing school... The instructor basically told us we will learn more in one week on the job than we will learn during our entire time in nursing school. This is coming from a college instructors themselves....
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Old 07-27-2012, 09:54 PM
 
Location: NJ
18,665 posts, read 19,975,497 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KnownUnknown View Post
College provides no more job skills than a HS degree unless you're majoring in something professional. Let's be real. What does college teach you how to do? To actually do? Or do you follow the line that you learn how to learn in college?

Job skills are learned on the job.
Real is the fact college grads unemployment rate is never above 60% high school grad rate.
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Old 07-27-2012, 09:58 PM
 
808 posts, read 1,679,209 times
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HS graduates don't spend their lives saddled with student debt. Don't get me wrong. College is necessary, but not because it actually teaches you anything. I didn't learn anything in college that I can apply to a job.
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Old 07-27-2012, 10:00 PM
 
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan
29,827 posts, read 24,917,786 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobtn View Post
Real is the fact college grads unemployment rate is never above 60% high school grad rate.
Which is exactly what one would expect, since we send our best and brightest to college. What you're basically saying is our best and brightest have a better shot at obtaining gainful employment. No argument here. Statistics tend to convey a wide variety of ideas, depending on the angle you look.

The idea that sending EVERYONE to college to obtain a 4 year degree is what scares me. This does not create more high paying jobs, it just creates more competitors for these high paying jobs. Someone still has to clean toilets and mow lawns
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Old 07-27-2012, 10:02 PM
 
Location: NJ
18,665 posts, read 19,975,497 times
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Originally Posted by KnownUnknown View Post
HS graduates don't spend their lives saddled with student debt. Don't get me wrong. College is necessary, but not because it actually teaches you anything. I didn't learn anything in college that I can apply to a job.

24k on average-with a 500k difference in lifetime earnings. I had mine paid off in a few years for less than half a car payment per month.
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Old 07-27-2012, 10:04 PM
 
Location: NJ
18,665 posts, read 19,975,497 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andywire View Post
Which is exactly what one would expect, since we send our best and brightest to college. What you're basically saying is our best and brightest have a better shot at obtaining gainful employment. No argument here. Statistics tend to convey a wide variety of ideas, depending on the angle you look.

The idea that sending EVERYONE to college to obtain a 4 year degree is what scares me. This does not create more high paying jobs, it just creates more competitors for these high paying jobs. Someone still has to clean toilets and mow lawns

Our best and brightest w/o a degree would be in the same shape as a typical 22 year old hs grad. Not pretty in 2012 per the Bureau of Labor Statistics. Now I agree all should not go, but stopping flat after 12 w/o formal education, training, OR degrees is suicidal.
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Old 07-27-2012, 10:05 PM
 
808 posts, read 1,679,209 times
Reputation: 813
Not sure if serious or trolling.
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Old 07-27-2012, 10:07 PM
 
808 posts, read 1,679,209 times
Reputation: 813
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobtn View Post
Our best and brightest w/o a degree would be in the same shape as a typical 22 year old hs grad. Not pretty in 2012 per the Bureau of Labor Statistics. Now I agree all should not go, but stopping flat after 12 w/o formal education, training, OR degrees is suicidal.
This is the problem. Is it formal education, or job training the people need? If you want to find a job? My bet is it's job training. Because no one goes to school to be a paper pusher in an office. No one goes to school and studies white collar work. And since we're moving towards this whole, "service based economy" those are the jobs out there. Service based work is where the jobs are. Manufacturing as far as the number of jobs goes, isn't there. Instead it's service work.

You learn that, on the job, not in a classroom from a textbook.
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Old 07-27-2012, 10:11 PM
 
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan
29,827 posts, read 24,917,786 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobtn View Post
Our best and brightest w/o a degree would be in the same shape as a typical 22 year old hs grad. Not pretty in 2012 per the Bureau of Labor Statistics. Now I agree all should not go, but stopping flat after 12 w/o formal education, training, OR degrees is suicidal.
Sitting on one's butt expecting opportunities to appear tend to lead to a lifetime of soar behinds. I'm very thankful I was not born 7 years later and just now coming out of HS... What a treacherous path they have to navigate... The unfortunate thing is entry level training positions are almost non existent, school counselors push the same few career paths that are saturated and seeing falling wages, and the school system really has ill prepared them for the "real world". This is the perfect storm for a "lost generation".

I firmly believe those who try the hardest and offer the most in cranial fortitude will fair the best. What I feel is unfortunate is their efforts will not yield a reward on par with previous generations. This WILL stunt the competitiveness and strength of our nation in the long run. If you want positive results, you must reinforce them by reward.
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