Alaskan Politics (statewide and nationwide) (teenage, disabled, rebuild)

[Geechie North]

Originally Posted by Grannysroost

Ok - what is a fruit-fly generation....help me....

..
Who knows?

My point was that historically speaking, the US changes whatever semblence of ideology it has every 25 years, or so.
Although the overall track is to liberalize.

[Geechie North]

Originally Posted by Moose Whisperer

Carter - 4 years

Clinton - 2 years

Maybe only a fruit-fly generation this time.

.

Carter marked the end of the "Liberal phase" of 1932-80, our longest period in modern times.
Clinton, the most conservative Democrat since Grover Cleveland, was a blip in the Conservative period of 1980-2006, just as Cleveland was a blip in the Conservative period of 1869-1902.

[Moose Whisperer]

Originally Posted by Grannysroost

Ok - what is a fruit-fly generation....help me....

You can raise an entire generation of fruit flies in about two weeks, that's why they are ideal for lab experiments.

Point is it's a really short period of time!

[Moose Whisperer]

Originally Posted by Geechie North

.

Carter marked the end of the "Liberal phase" of 1932-80, our longest period of modern times.
Clinton, the most conservative Democrat since Grover Cleveland, was a blip in the Conservative period of 1980-2006, just as Cleveland was a blip in the Conservative period of 1869-1902.

Maybe there are blips or bleeps, or phases on some generational time scale, but real individuals and groups usually become corrupted by their newly found power rather quickly. This is particularly true whenever one party gets overwhelming, unchecked access to the reigns of power.

The current, incoming group will have access to quite a bit of unbridled power. Add this to all of the pent up rage they have accumulated over the past 8 years, my belief is they will get drunk off of their own hubris fairly quickly. Then we'll see another swap. Followed by another.

Just like the stock market, you can get all sorts of short term swings inside of a long term trend.

[Geechie North]

If you are talking criminal, or personal corruption- that is very true; a few will always fall for it... more in the latter stages of the movement. But do not confuse corruption with satisfaction of an interest group. Just as the GOP (and some Dems) made the gov't function chiefly for the benefit of the wealthy over the past 26 years, this election was about doing the same thing for the middle class. If the Dems accomplish that, they'll be in power for quite a long time.

[Grannysroost]

Originally Posted by Moose Whisperer

Maybe there are blips or bleeps, or phases on some generational time scale, but real individuals and groups usually become corrupted by their newly found power rather quickly. This is particularly true whenever one party gets overwhelming, unchecked access to the reigns of power.

The current, incoming group will have access to quite a bit of unbridled power. Add this to all of the pent up rage they have accumulated over the past 8 years, my belief is they will get drunk off of their own hubris fairly quickly. Then we'll see another swap. Followed by another.

Just like the stock market, you can get all sorts of short term swings inside of a long term trend.

I agree....Reality says

[RayinAK]

Originally Posted by Geechie North

If you are talking criminal, or personal corruption- that is very true; a few will always fall for it... more in the latter stages of the movement. But do not confuse corruption with satisfaction of an interest group. Just as the GOP (and some Dems) made the gov't function chiefly for the benefit of the wealthy over the past 26 years, this election was about doing the same thing for the middle class. If the Dems accomplish that, they'll be in power for quite a long time.

You are being idealistic, and there is nothing wrong with that, but the reality is much different. For example, if you look at the members of Congress, you will realize that quite a few are quite wealthy, and that they always plan for their best interest. Nancy Pelosi is perhaps the richest woman in Congress.

Also, you will also notice that a few of them have always complained about the war in Iraq, but still pass every war budget Bush drops in front of them. Not only that, but that's when all the pork is added to the bills passed.

I don't believe for a moment that this election will benefit the middle class. The fact is that some of the present tax breaks already help the middle class, and once these expire in 2010 (?), all will pay more taxes to one degree or another.

Finally, if Congress messes around with our 401Ks, every tax payer who has a 401K will lose.

[Grannysroost]

Originally Posted by RayinAK

You are being idealistic, and there is nothing wrong with that, but the reality is much different. For example, if you look at the members of Congress, you will realize that quite a few are quite wealthy, and that they always plan for their best interest. Nancy Pelosi is perhaps the richest woman in Congress.

Also, you will also notice that a few of them have always complained about the war in Iraq, but still pass every war budget Bush drops in front of them. Not only that, but that's when all the pork is added to the bills passed.

I don't believe for a moment that this election will benefit the middle class. The fact is that some of the present tax breaks already help the middle class, and once these expire in 2010 (?), all will pay more taxes to one degree or another.

Finally, if Congress messes around with our 401Ks, every tax payer who has a 401K will lose.

Unless you are young enough it can recover...otherwise like most of us at least mid 40's and up - we worry and SS might not be there, which has always been a threat and the reason for the 401K's....

[Floyd_Davidson]

Originally Posted by RayinAK

You are being idealistic, and there is nothing wrong with that, but the reality is much different. For example, if you look at the members of Congress, you will realize that quite a few are quite wealthy, and that they always plan for their best interest. Nancy Pelosi is perhaps the richest woman in Congress.

Being "wealthy" is an indication of success. Would you rather see a Congress made up of people who are generally successful in life, or people who can't do anything right?

You say someone else is idealistic, but use logic that (if generally followed) would bankrupt any company or any country...

Also, you will also notice that a few of them have always complained about the war in Iraq, but still pass every war budget Bush drops in front of them. Not only that, but that's when all the pork is added to the bills passed.

You will note that "a few of them" is never a majority, and that a majority is what passes bills. Stop being idealistic, and look at how politics works on a practical level: Once it is obvious that the budget bill is going to pass, it would be non-productive for most members of Congress to vote against it. And complaining that the major expenditure authorization bill from Congress has "pork" (meaning an appropriation for somebody other than "me") is absurd! That is the bill which is supposed to have appropriations in it. Burying something in an unrelated bill is where the problem is, and yet you complain when it is done right!

I don't believe for a moment that this election will benefit the middle class. The fact is that some of the present tax breaks already help the middle class, and once these expire in 2010 (?), all will pay more taxes to one degree or another.

However, you are also unable to be practical about this too. The rich have been getting richer and the poor have been getting poorer, while the middle class shrinks... and you would continue the system that is causing that.

Finally, if Congress messes around with our 401Ks, every tax payer who has a 401K will lose.

If Congress doesn't change the way the economics of this country are being handled, that is what will cause every tax payer to lose. Granted the very rich won't be affected... but everyone reading this, including you Ray, will be.

[Rance]

He's having BBQ!

McCain at ease after loss - Roger Simon - Politico.com

I wonder if he'll invite Sarah and Todd?