Atheists: things that make you go...hmm? The big questions without good answers. (beliefs, faith)
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Some of the earlier posts in the thread, -those that came from atheists at least, seemed to be largely along the lines of (in a nut shell): "I'm okay with saying 'I don't know'".
And that's fine because that's the kind of thing I say all the time as well.
I mean we actually don't have a choice, because if we don't have answers, we don't have answers and that's that.
But even though that might be my stock answer, I do wonder if maybe I mull the big questions over more than most. Because actually I do want to know the answers to the things that amaze me.
And I also sometimes think that 'I don't know' is kind of just as lazy an answer as 'god did it' because what it says is you can't be bothered to think that hard (no offense to anyone as I said I do it too).
Yes and no. One must remember people often make decisions based on their rule of thumb thinking. Even when thinking rationally instead of subconsciously, people often suffer from cognitive bias. People are not taught to ask what is more probable, and what are the alternatives (Bayesian thinking), so 'I do not know' is the best they can do. And sometimes people do not know why they subconsciously hold a belief.
And sometimes they do not care. What is the best football team? I do not know, who cares?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cruithne
And especially when things seem impossible. The puffa fish for example that I posted on page one. How the heck does a tiny fish with a tiny brain achieve that? Most humans couldn't even do that.
Because it evolved to do that following a few rules (just as birds flock using three simple, subconscious rules), and the female evolved to like an ordered pattern. Even a small brain has many neurons, so the processing power is there. And although it looks impressive, is it as impressive as the amount of processing you need to do to simply walk while keeping your balance and looking at a distant object?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cruithne
And there ends my contribution to getting the thread back on track.
That was certainly a question back in the day. How does a spider know to build a web, let alone how to. Before discovering DNA and its' place in evolved instinct, the only answer other than 'God' was 'We don't know'.
Some of the earlier posts in the thread, -those that came from atheists at least, seemed to be largely along the lines of (in a nut shell): "I'm okay with saying 'I don't know'".
And that's fine because that's the kind of thing I say all the time as well.
I mean we actually don't have a choice, because if we don't have answers, we don't have answers and that's that.
But even though that might be my stock answer, I do wonder if maybe I mull the big questions over more than most. Because actually I do want to know the answers to the things that amaze me.
And I also sometimes think that 'I don't know' is kind of just as lazy an answer as 'god did it' because what it says is you can't be bothered to think that hard (no offense to anyone as I said I do it too).
And especially when things seem impossible. The puffa fish for example that I posted on page one. How the heck does a tiny fish with a tiny brain achieve that? Most humans couldn't even do that.
And there ends my contribution to getting the thread back on track.
To many people are here to focus on stopping religion. If we state things likes "hey, lets look at what we think and see who is doing what"
we are met with with ...
"If you are not talking a god here (it's alive but not with a planning, intelligent, will) you are off topic. Remember the only reason for atheists to be here is in refuting the claim of a theism or religion or at least a spirituality. We are not here to put forward speculative non -theist alternatives. Take them to the science forum and argue them there. I'm not going to keep on explaining this."
Hmmm ... what classification can we use or do we have that matches what we see better? The answer is probably in-between a deity and anti-deity (anti-deity is more political but that is what it is at this point). Do we have a classification that does match what we see around us be reasonable even though we do not have all the answers?
Is "ok, but we have to stop religion" reason enough for atheist not to talk about things that makes us go "hmmmm, that idea seems reasonable? "
I simply do not have the background in physics, maths and cosmology to be able to make judgements about the scientific hypotheses and theories about the origin of yje cosmos or of the origin of life, for the later it is organic chemistry that I lack. For answers to those questions I trust the scientific method to be self correcting and simply accept that those hypotheses and theories are sound and plausible. I simply don't need absolute answers to those questions.
When it comes to evolution, the rise of humans and the spread of civilizations my background is strong enough to evaluate papers and books on those subjects for myself and believe that those questions have been addressed sufficiently for me to say that we do have answers.
Right now I'm 70 years old, I doubt that the answers to the first set of questions will be answered much better before I am no longer able to even care. In the meantime I am happy just investigating smaller questions.
I am not personally invested in the answers to those large questions to be upset if other posters do not agree with my stance of them.
Yes and no. One must remember people often make decisions based on their rule of thumb thinking. Even when thinking rationally instead of subconsciously, people often suffer from cognitive bias. People are not taught to ask what is more probable, and what are the alternatives (Bayesian thinking), so 'I do not know' is the best they can do. And sometimes people do not know why they subconsciously hold a belief.
And sometimes they do not care. What is the best football team? I do not know, who cares?
Good answer!
Quote:
Because it evolved to do that following a few rules (just as birds flock using three simple, subconscious rules), and the female evolved to like an ordered pattern. Even a small brain has many neurons, so the processing power is there. And although it looks impressive, is it as impressive as the amount of processing you need to do to simply walk while keeping your balance and looking at a distant object?
Yeah I suppose so. Also a good response.
I suppose we just take the things we can do for granted, while marvelling at the things other creatures in nature can do, that we can't.
Still it's no less impressive.
The puffer fish and the example of the spider buried in one of my earlier links, that can learn to build a different sort of web, means that these creatures are not just acting on instinct, they are actually thinking about what they are doing.
Which is amazing to me. I'm totally on board with evolution obviously. Evolution is neat and simple and straightforward and self explanatory almost. But thinking and making decisions? That's a whole other ball game.
Just FYI. I was really so tempted to use this thread as an April Fools to say I'd 'found God' like our dear Transponder did back when he still had the Arequipa pseudonym some April Fools years back.
I resisted. I'm still godless, so you can all relax.
That was certainly a question back in the day. How does a spider know to build a web, let alone how to. Before discovering DNA and its' place in evolved instinct, the only answer other than 'God' was 'We don't know'.
Okay.
But what is instinct?
There's largely no explanation for it.
A few years ago I remember either posting a thread or gave a long response to someone about research into quantum entanglement as a possible explanation for how birds migrate.
Awesome. Science has given quantum entanglement a name and established it as a thing. But actually nobody really knows why two particles can interact even when separated by great distances.
We are really no further on, frankly.
Some animals abandon their young only a few days after birth and yet the animal knows how to survive.
Several species live almost their entire lives in practical isolation. They somehow just know what to do.
Why?
Yeah I suppose so. Also a good response.
I suppose we just take the things we can do for granted, while marvelling at the things other creatures in nature can do, that we can't.
Still it's no less impressive.
The puffer fish and the example of the spider buried in one of my earlier links, that can learn to build a different sort of web, means that these creatures are not just acting on instinct, they are actually thinking about what they are doing.
Which is amazing to me. I'm totally on board with evolution obviously. Evolution is neat and simple and straightforward and self-explanatory almost. But thinking and making decisions? That's a whole other ball game.
The thinking and making decisions is in the province of consciousness which most atheists refuse to see as playing any role as the substrate for our Reality.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
These are the ongoing questions that Used to make us go 'Hmmmm...' Now they only think they should.
