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It's not really true that 'right wing' Christians are all gun bearing folk though. Look at the Amish for instance, they are pretty conservative and right on when it comes to following the teaching of Jesus Christ to love our enemy, turn the other cheek and pray for those who persecute us. They also aren't involved in politics which I think is wise aswell.
Yea, well, you don't understand the meanings of fulfill the law or kill the law...So, let's talk about the flip side, if Jesus came to kill the Law, then what would he have done to accomplish this?...
What Does It Mean to "Fulfill the Law"?
by Lois Tverberg
Do not think that I came to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I did not come to abolish but to fulfill. Matthew 5:17 (NASB)
A difficult passage for many Christians is Jesus' saying in Matthew 5:17 that he "came not to abolish the law but to fulfill it." A traditional way of interpreting it is to say that when Jesus "fulfilled the Law" he brought it to an end, even though in the next several verses, Jesus says quite forcefully that this isn't true. The key is that the phrase "fulfill the Law" is an idiom, and found several other places in the New Testament and in Jewish sayings from Jesus' time. By studying these passages we can understand the saying more fully. Moreover, we can read Paul's important writings about "fulfilling the law," and see what they mean for us.
"Fulfill the Law" as a Rabbinic Idiom
It will help us greatly to know that the phrase "fulfill the Torah" is a rabbinic idiom that is still in use even today. The word we read as "law" is torah in Hebrew, and its main sense is teaching, guidance and instruction, rather than legal regulation. It is God's instructions for living, and because of God's great authority, it demands obedience and therefore takes on the sense of "law." The Torah is often understood to mean the first five books of the Bible, but also refers to the Scriptures in general. In Jesus' time, and among Jews today, this is a very positive thing - that the God who made us would give us instructions for how to live.1 The rabbis made it their goal to understand these instructions fully and teach people how to live by it.
The translation of "to fulfill" is lekayem in Hebrew (le-KAI-yem), which means to uphold or establish, as well as to fulfill, complete or accomplish.2 David Bivin has pointed out that the phrase "fulfill the Law" is often used as an idiom to mean to properly interpret the Torah so that people can obey it as God really intends. The word "abolish" was likely either levatel, to nullify, or la'akor, to uproot, which meant to undermine the Torah by misinterpreting it. For example, the law against adultery could be interpreted as specifically against cheating on one's spouse, but not about pornography. When Jesus declared that lust also was a violation of the commandment, he was clarifying the true intent of that law, so in rabbinic parlance he was "fulfilling the Law." In contrast, if a pastor told his congregation that watching x-rated videos was fine, he would be "abolishing the Law" - causing them to not live as God wants them to live. Here are a couple examples of this usage from around Jesus' time: - What Does It Mean to "Fulfill the Law"?
If Jesus or any of his disciples came teaching Israel not to keep the laws of Moses and they would deserve a sinner's death. Stephen would have deserved to be stoned, and Jesus would have deserved to been killed.
Paul was brought into court time and time again against charges that he was teaching Jews not to keep the laws of Moses and liars had to be paid to tell this lie against Stephen, but what does Paul do when his life is in grave danger against the rumors that Paul was teaching Jews not to keep the laws of Moses?
Judge for yourself.
Paul's Arrival at Jerusalem
17And when we were come to Jerusalem, the brethren received us gladly. 18And the day following Paul went in with us unto James; and all the elders were present. 19And when he had saluted them, he declared particularly what things God had wrought among the Gentiles by his ministry. 20And when they heard it, they glorified the Lord, and said unto him, Thou seest, brother, how many thousands of Jews there are which believe; and they are all zealous of the law:
21And they are informed of thee, that thou teachest all the Jews which are among the Gentiles to forsake Moses, saying that they ought not to circumcise their children, neither to walk after the customs. 22What is it therefore? the multitude must needs come together: for they will hear that thou art come. 23Do therefore this that we say to thee: We have four men which have a vow on them; 24Them take, and purify thyself with them, and be at charges with them, that they may shave their heads: and all may know that those things, whereof they were informed concerning thee, are nothing; but that thou thyself also walkest orderly, and keepest the law.
Tens of thousands of Jews believed, they remained Pharisees, and they became even more zealous in keeping the laws of Moses and Paul has to be informed of the lies being said that he was teaching all Jews to forsake the laws of Moses, and so he EVEN SACRIFICES to just prove those lies to be lies.
But if Paul is a two faced liar and EVEN lying to the congregation in Jerusalem, then he deserves to die.
Was Paul lying to everyone there, and so was he only doing these things because he was terrified that he would be found guilty in court for teaching Jews to forsake the laws?
If Jesus or any of his disciples came teaching Israel not to keep the laws of Moses and they would deserve a sinner's death. Stephen would have deserved to be stoned, and Jesus would have deserved to been killed.
Paul was brought into court time and time again against charges that he was teaching Jews not to keep the laws of Moses and liars had to be paid to tell this lie against Stephen, but what does Paul do when his life is in grave danger against the rumors that Paul was teaching Jews not to keep the laws of Moses?
Judge for yourself.
Paul's Arrival at Jerusalem
17And when we were come to Jerusalem, the brethren received us gladly. 18And the day following Paul went in with us unto James; and all the elders were present. 19And when he had saluted them, he declared particularly what things God had wrought among the Gentiles by his ministry. 20And when they heard it, they glorified the Lord, and said unto him, Thou seest, brother, how many thousands of Jews there are which believe; and they are all zealous of the law:
21And they are informed of thee, that thou teachest all the Jews which are among the Gentiles to forsake Moses, saying that they ought not to circumcise their children, neither to walk after the customs. 22What is it therefore? the multitude must needs come together: for they will hear that thou art come. 23Do therefore this that we say to thee: We have four men which have a vow on them; 24Them take, and purify thyself with them, and be at charges with them, that they may shave their heads: and all may know that those things, whereof they were informed concerning thee, are nothing; but that thou thyself also walkest orderly, and keepest the law.
Tens of thousands of Jews believed, they remained Pharisees, and they became even more zealous in keeping the laws of Moses and Paul has to be informed of the lies being said that he was teaching all Jews to forsake the laws of Moses, and so he EVEN SACRIFICES to just prove those lies to be lies.
But if Paul is a two faced liar and EVEN lying to the congregation in Jerusalem, then he deserves to die.
Was Paul lying to everyone there, and so was he only doing these things because he was terrified that he would be found guilty in court for teaching Jews to forsake the laws?
Boast in Christ.
Excellent point.
I believe this was the root of the subject. Though some have little treasure to give.
Just as our Lord gave instruction about piety.
Whats going on here?
8 And the next day we that were of Paul's company departed, and came unto Caesarea: and we entered into the house of Philip the evangelist, which was one of the seven; and abode with him.
9 And the same man had four daughters, virgins, which did prophesy.
Luke 16King James Version (KJV)
16 And he said also unto his disciples, There was a certain rich man, which had a steward; and the same was accused unto him that he had wasted his goods.
2 And he called him, and said unto him, How is it that I hear this of thee? give an account of thy stewardship; for thou mayest be no longer steward.
3 Then the steward said within himself, What shall I do? for my lord taketh away from me the stewardship: I cannot dig; to beg I am ashamed.
4 I am resolved what to do, that, when I am put out of the stewardship, they may receive me into their houses.
5 So he called every one of his lord's debtors unto him, and said unto the first, How much owest thou unto my lord?
6 And he said, An hundred measures of oil. And he said unto him, Take thy bill, and sit down quickly, and write fifty.
7 Then said he to another, And how much owest thou? And he said, An hundred measures of wheat. And he said unto him, Take thy bill, and write fourscore.
8 And the lord commended the unjust steward, because he had done wisely: for the children of this world are in their generation wiser than the children of light.
9 And I say unto you, Make to yourselves friends of the mammon of unrighteousness; that, when ye fail, they may receive you into everlasting habitations.
10 He that is faithful in that which is least is faithful also in much: and he that is unjust in the least is unjust also in much.
11 If therefore ye have not been faithful in the unrighteous mammon, who will commit to your trust the true riches?
12 And if ye have not been faithful in that which is another man's, who shall give you that which is your own?
13 No servant can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.
14 And the Pharisees also, who were covetous, heard all these things: and they derided him.
15 And he said unto them, Ye are they which justify yourselves before men; but God knoweth your hearts: for that which is highly esteemed among men is abomination in the sight of God.
16 The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.
17 And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail.
19 There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine linen, and fared sumptuously every day:
20 And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores,
21 And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores.
22 And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;
23 And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
24 And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.
25 But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.
26 And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.
27 Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house:
28 For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.
29 Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.
30 And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.
31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.
If Jesus or any of his disciples came teaching Israel not to keep the laws of Moses and they would deserve a sinner's death. Stephen would have deserved to be stoned, and Jesus would have deserved to been killed.
Paul was brought into court time and time again against charges that he was teaching Jews not to keep the laws of Moses and liars had to be paid to tell this lie against Stephen, but what does Paul do when his life is in grave danger against the rumors that Paul was teaching Jews not to keep the laws of Moses?
Judge for yourself.
Paul's Arrival at Jerusalem
17And when we were come to Jerusalem, the brethren received us gladly. 18And the day following Paul went in with us unto James; and all the elders were present. 19And when he had saluted them, he declared particularly what things God had wrought among the Gentiles by his ministry. 20And when they heard it, they glorified the Lord, and said unto him, Thou seest, brother, how many thousands of Jews there are which believe; and they are all zealous of the law:
21And they are informed of thee, that thou teachest all the Jews which are among the Gentiles to forsake Moses, saying that they ought not to circumcise their children, neither to walk after the customs. 22What is it therefore? the multitude must needs come together: for they will hear that thou art come. 23Do therefore this that we say to thee: We have four men which have a vow on them; 24Them take, and purify thyself with them, and be at charges with them, that they may shave their heads: and all may know that those things, whereof they were informed concerning thee, are nothing; but that thou thyself also walkest orderly, and keepest the law.
Tens of thousands of Jews believed, they remained Pharisees, and they became even more zealous in keeping the laws of Moses and Paul has to be informed of the lies being said that he was teaching all Jews to forsake the laws of Moses, and so he EVEN SACRIFICES to just prove those lies to be lies.
But if Paul is a two faced liar and EVEN lying to the congregation in Jerusalem, then he deserves to die.
Was Paul lying to everyone there, and so was he only doing these things because he was terrified that he would be found guilty in court for teaching Jews to forsake the laws?
It's not really true that 'right wing' Christians are all gun bearing folk though. Look at the Amish for instance, they are pretty conservative and right on when it comes to following the teaching of Jesus Christ to love our enemy, turn the other cheek and pray for those who persecute us. They also aren't involved in politics which I think is wise aswell.
....
Tens of thousands of Jews believed, they remained Pharisees, and they became even more zealous in keeping the laws of Moses and Paul has to be informed of the lies being said that he was teaching all Jews to forsake the laws of Moses, and so he EVEN SACRIFICES to just prove those lies to be lies.
But if Paul is a two faced liar and EVEN lying to the congregation in Jerusalem, then he deserves to die.
Was Paul lying to everyone there, and so was he only doing these things because he was terrified that he would be found guilty in court for teaching Jews to forsake the laws?
Paul gave his defense in Chapter 22, which was essentially that he had been a zealous Pharisee himself until he was given the insight that the forms and ceremonies were not what was important. Note that he did not teach that the Jews should not observe them, but that they should not require them of gentiles because the purpose of the Law and ceremonies was fulfilled in living in community with God and man on the basis of that concern for the well-being of everyone that is the love Jesus taught.
In fact NO "law" can be perfect because it can not address the one requirement noted, it can only require physical compliance.
Paul gave his defense in Chapter 22, which was essentially that he had been a zealous Pharisee himself until he was given the insight that the forms and ceremonies were not what was important. Note that he did not teach that the Jews should not observe them, but that they should not require them of gentiles because the purpose of the Law and ceremonies was fulfilled in living in community with God and man on the basis of that concern for the well-being of everyone that is the love Jesus taught.
In fact NO "law" can be perfect because it can not address the one requirement noted, it can only require physical compliance.
WHOEVER keeps the laws of Moses and teaches others to keep the laws will be the greatest in the kingdom of heaven.
Paul gave his defense in Chapter 22, which was essentially that he had been a zealous Pharisee himself until he was given the insight that the forms and ceremonies were not what was important. Note that he did not teach that the Jews should not observe them, but that they should not require them of gentiles because the purpose of the Law and ceremonies was fulfilled in living in community with God and man on the basis of that concern for the well-being of everyone that is the love Jesus taught.
In fact NO "law" can be perfect because it can not address the one requirement noted, it can only require physical compliance.
Then he should have been teaching the Jews to abandon Torah as well...
WHOEVER keeps the laws of Moses and teaches others to keep the laws will be the greatest in the kingdom of heaven.
Right or wrong?
Jesus was wrong?
That an element of the people who believed in the Way thought that following their traditional rules was the correct interpretation of the Way is manifest. That it is true is not so evident. NO Law can be perfect, but the INTENT of the Law is, and it is fulfilled in the "New Commandment" that overrides the letters of Law that bind you.
Then he should have been teaching the Jews to abandon Torah as well...
Following Torah is not wrong, it is just not necessary for anything but community within Judaism.
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