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The terms malakos and arsenokoites were not translated as homosexuals, until 1946.
And a very good translation. Do you know what term the people of the Greco-Roman empire used, in reference to those who practiced Male to male sexual relations?
So now you are trying to justify telling me to go burn in hell? Really? Is there any end to the depths of garbage you will sink to attack me? Telling someone that you want them to suffer great torment because they won't embrace homosexuality is very disgusting display of humanity born out of hate. The fact that your side hates us because we won't bow to the agenda only proves we are on the side of truth. The flaming hypocrite is you, claiming to be a loving Christian and yet talk trash like this. Keep those insults coming, buddy. It only makes YOU look bad.
And I know you will never accept the sinful reality of homosexuality because you are so personally attached to the issue. Unlike you, I can look at it objectively instead of being so biased. If I'm wrong, prove it. But you failed miserably at that task.
Curious, would you be all butt hurt if someone said to you that they hope you get to see your god face to face today?
I am not shifting any blame on jeff. I just wish he would respond for once with honesty to what the post says without veering off into the perfunctory "you're attacking/persecuting/picking on me". I mean, c'mon, we're adults here.
It's classic blame shifting.
People here keep making personal comments/judgments/accusation about posters (ad hominem), and when they manage to draw a reaction, they throw in the "you have a perception complex" line.
Curious, would you be all butt hurt if someone said to you that they hope you get to see your god face to face today?
The really ironic thing about your comment is that you believe you've insulted someone. You have not. The funny thing is that you've wished them a blessing - yet you are so far into justifying yourself, as any sinner does, that you have no idea what you are saying - or wishing upon someone else.
I don't think anyone who had made their peace with God would be hurt by an imminent encounter. I certainly would not. I look forward to it.
On the other hand, a sinner who had NOT made peace with God should have every reason to be afraid of such a meeting.
Warnings have been given by the printed Word of God, by word of mouth and by testimony of those who've known God's good grace of forgiveness.
SIN is the operative word here, and gays are no less guilty of sin than everyone else.
They just like to think they are.
Unless they repent of their wickedness to God, they shall not know the kingdom of God and shall know the second death. Be aware. Be warned.
People here keep making personal comments/judgments/accusation about posters (ad hominem), and when they manage to draw a reaction, they throw in the "you have a perception complex" line.
You have basically nailed how Bible fundamentalists look upon the world who believes it is in the hands of an angry God. It is entirely understandable that you do because it comes from being sin conscious rather than righteousness conscious. Speaking righteously is not calling out what you believe is sin in another, speaking righteously is the exact opposite. Righteousness calls out things how they should be not how they appear.
People here keep making personal comments/judgments/accusation about posters (ad hominem), and when they manage to draw a reaction, they throw in the "you have a perception complex" line.
Right. I don't even really mind the insults or feel persecuted. It would be silly to really care what nicknames on a computer screen think about my words. I can barely tell a Jerwade apart from a Pcamps. They all sound the same to me! The thing that does tick me off is their stubborn refusal to acknowledge that yea we are personally insulting and attacking anyone who doesn't support homosexuality here. Or trying to justify such disgusting behavior and comments.
Hello there Romulus, I see that you stated, that the bible supports the belief that an actual place of eternal torment awaits millions upon millions of people. I don’t know from where you received that erroneous load of rubbish, but it certainly is not to be found in the Scripture.
You misread me. I said no such thing. Read my post again. I said that JEFF believes in a literal hell where millions of people will receive literal eternal torment. I believe no such thing. I have no idea what happens when people die but I'm pretty confident that there is no such place as hell. The concept of the traditionally held evangelical belief about hell is a cruel myth that appears to have been invented and maintained to keep people in abject fear of God so that they will toe the church party line. I said in my previous post that someone turned the tables on Jeff and threw his (Jeff's) cruel but erroneous belief back in his face. He (Jeff) didn't like it and often brings this up in his posts even though he (Jeff) doesn't seem to have any qualms about condemning others to his 'Dante's Inferno' version of hell.
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Originally Posted by The Anointed
Revelation 20: 10; reveals that the eternal torment is reserved only for the devil, the beast and the false prophet…….. “Then the devil who had deceived them, was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had already been thrown, and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.”
Jesus said that we all must die once then go off into judgement, where the righteous disembodied Spirits enter into a state of rest, and over them, the second death (Which is that of the spirit) has no power, while the unrighteous disembodied spirits, suffer terrible mental torment as they await the great day of Judgement.
Isaiah also re-enforces this belief in Isaiah 57: 1-2; he says; “Good people die, and no one understands or even cares. But when they (Good People) die, no calamity can hurt them. Those who lead good lives find peace and rest in death.
It is on the day of the great judgement, when those who chose life are divided from those disembodied spirits who had chosen death. It is then as revealed in Revelation 21: 8; that the cowards, traitors, perverts, murderers, the immoral and those who practice magic, etc, etc, are cast into the lake burning with fire and sulfur, which is their second death, the death of those minds/spirits.
No more suffering, just eternal and everlasting oblivion.
Could be. I have no idea what happens when people die. However, please get it right once and for all that I don't believe in mainstream Christianity's concept of hell. You clearly misread my post. I agree with you (surprise, surprise) that it's a lot of erroneous rubbish.
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Originally Posted by The Anointed
You then went on to say that the scribes used by the author of the bible, had no idea what homosexuality was and so they were unqualified to address the subject.
You got that part of my post right.
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Originally Posted by The Anointed
Well I believe that they, as almost everyone else who lived in those days, were well aware as to what same gender sex was, but perhaps you are suggesting that those scribes, never having experienced male to male sex themselves, and had never been sodomised, nor had they ever sodomised another male, were unqualified to address the subject, and only those with that experience behind them, are qualified to address the subject.
Let's put this into perspective, Anointed. The jury, in the year 2019, is still out as to why some people are born with a tendency for same-gender attraction. While they don't know the 'whys' or the 'hows' there IS a general consensus within the medical science world that one's sexual tendencies are pretty much genetic, give or take a few variables. Now, let us zoom back in time to when the Bible authors penned the Bible. Are you seriously suggesting that these people who (to quote TroutDude) 'pooped in holes in the ground' were better educated within medical science circles than their 2019 counterparts? They may well have witnessed same gender sexual practices (who could know?) but they sure as hell would not have had an inking as to why some human beings are sexually attracted to the same gender.
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Originally Posted by The Anointed
You continued on the subject of homosexuality by saying; “Moreover, I state this with absolute confidence that I'm right. There is no sitting on the fence for me when it comes to this particular issue.” Suggesting that although the bible scribes, according to your own words, had no idea what homosexuality was and so they were unqualified to address the subject, you believe that you are qualified to do so.
Like Star Trek's Mr. Spock, I use logic when it's required. Logic tells me that the ancient people of several thousand years ago would not have had the knowledge on MANY things that we today possess. So yes, I do believe that I an qualified - as are you - to state unequivocally that the folks of many centuries ago only knew as much as they knew and could not POSSIBLY have had the knowledge of human sexuality comparable to that of we today. This has everything to do with using logical deduction to arrive at logical conclusions.
Seriously? You're telling me to read Paul's writings? As if I haven't?.
I honestly don't know. No disrespect intended...I have no idea what your background is, other than you call yourself Christian, and you have said you don't believe in the doctrine of Inspiration.
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I didn't accuse Paul of being a legalist. Once again, you get stuck in that all-or-nothing, black-and-white mindset. Can't you see it?
You seemed to say he was. I'm sorry if I misread it.
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Yes, I am AWARE that he was accused of the opposite, but his Pharasaical background still comes through his letters demonstrating his misogyny and rigidity. We can't possibly say "this came from God one hundred percent". It came from Paul, who was a human being trying to teach others what he had learned, not a mouthpiece through which God dictated words.
I'm thinking the many women that he worked with in ministry would disagree.
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Just memorizing verses and reciting them back is not the way to study Scripture. It's never all or nothing, never just black and white, either/or.
No disagreement. For that reason I don't tend to memorize proof texts, as much as I'm able to point to passages, or chapters.
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In my church, there's a saying that we follow Scripture, Tradition, and Reason. God gave us brains and the ability to think and use our reason and judgment. We still won't always get it right, but isn't it wrong to not even use the gift of intellect, even in Christianity?
Right. I don't even really mind the insults or feel persecuted. It would be silly to really care what nicknames on a computer screen think about my words. I can barely tell a Jerwade apart from a Pcamps. They all sound the same to me!
Except you obviously do care, Jeff. If you didn't, you wouldn't be on here whining about it post after post after post...
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Originally Posted by jeffbase40
The thing that does tick me off is their stubborn refusal to acknowledge that yea we are personally insulting and attacking anyone who doesn't support homosexuality here. Or trying to justify such disgusting behavior and comments.
Yea, mainly because we aren't doing that. You don't have to "support homosexuality" to say, bake a cake. You don't have to "support homosexuality" to call for them to be treated equally. The only people being "attacked" are those who support discrimination or spread falsehoods.
There was even one poster 2 weeks or so ago, can't remember their name off the top of my head, that I had a conversation with, I believe on this thread. They don't believe in gay marriage and think homosexuality is a sin, but they also don't advocate for not allowing them to get married or being treated differently. I can just agree to disagree with someone like that. They have their beliefs, but they don't push them on the rest of society. That isn't what people like you do though, is it?
People here keep making personal comments/judgments/accusation about posters (ad hominem), and when they manage to draw a reaction, they throw in the "you have a perception complex" line.
No, that's not it.
Certain posters (and people in real life, too, for that matter) see everything through a prism of them being criticized or attacked or disparaged, even when that's clearly not the intent of the writer or speaker, as the case may be. They don't see the actual content of what was said, only the perceived criticism or attack, because always being criticized is the paradigm within which they move and function.
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