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the verse you post said NOTHING about Jesus even saying he was "GOD". Jesus was speaking in Parables when others were around. he was explaining to the Apostles why he spoke that way ,(Matt. 13:11 He answered and said to them, “Because it has been given to you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it has not been given). the verse you post was showing that MANY then refuse to want the truth. therefore, Jesus wasn't going to allow them the truth. as he allowed his Apostles to know and understand the meanings.
today, MANY refuse the truth ,just as many did in the days of old. the creator of the Topic, showed MUCH PROOF, (Scriptural), NOT HIS WORDS! yet! MANY still refuse to be even Jesus words. some would much rather believe anyone besides JESUS teachings. this is what satan wanted and he does get it. we need to understand (2Cor. 4:4, "satan blinds the minds of the unbelievers"). an "unbeliever" doesn't mean just someone who does NOT believe in "God." but also those who say they believe in "God", but NOT ALL of his words! as I've said many times, if we claim to follow Jesus. we shouldn't act as though we know MORE THAN HE! if he said he has a "GOD" and a "FATHER." then who are we imperfect humans to call him a liar? peace
the verse you post said NOTHING about Jesus even saying he was "GOD". Jesus was speaking in Parables when others were around. he was explaining to the Apostles why he spoke that way ,(Matt. 13:11 He answered and said to them, “Because it has been given to you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it has not been given). the verse you post was showing that MANY then refuse to want the truth. therefore, Jesus wasn't going to allow them the truth. as he allowed his Apostles to know and understand the meanings.
today, MANY refuse the truth ,just as many did in the days of old. the creator of the Topic, showed MUCH PROOF, (Scriptural), NOT HIS WORDS! yet! MANY still refuse to be even Jesus words. some would much rather believe anyone besides JESUS teachings. this is what satan wanted and he does get it. we need to understand (2Cor. 4:4, "satan blinds the minds of the unbelievers"). an "unbeliever" doesn't mean just someone who does NOT believe in "God." but also those who say they believe in "God", but NOT ALL of his words! as I've said many times, if we claim to follow Jesus. we shouldn't act as though we know MORE THAN HE! if he said he has a "GOD" and a "FATHER." then who are we imperfect humans to call him a liar? peace
You speak of not believing all of God's words. Yet you ignore the fact that the writer of Hebrews (chapter one) has God the Father calling the Son God while stating that He (the Father) is the Son's God. Understand? God the Father called the Son God and commanded the angels to worship the Son. The angels know that they are to worship only God, and they were told by the Father to worship the Son who was called God by the Father.
I think you already know the answer. so why ask when you have scriptures that backs up the truth? satan wants MANY to believe otherwise, and most do. instead of examining the scriptures and asking for Spiritual guidance from Jehovah God himself. you're right !.. if Jesus was the ALMIGHTY God, why would he pray to himself. some teach that he's part of a 3in1 called a "trinity." but that was NEVER taught by anyone in the Bible. Jesus taught his disciples past and present to "follow me" meaning in acts and his words. all of the scripturas you have post, MANY of us has brought those same ones to the attention of others. yet!.. they continually say, "Jesus is the God and Father."
but here's two more verse that speaks volume towards the truth of who Jesus is, (John 17:3 And this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent). Jesus CLEARLY shows that he is NOT the TRUE God. and (Matt. 7:21 Not every one that said unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that do the will of my Father which is in heaven). yes, we suppose to try hard to follow Jesus lead. but it's HIS FATHER'S WILL we must do if we want salvation. Jesus even said one can say "lord, lord" referring to himself. MANY believe pray to on call on Jesus. but Jesus taught us to pray to his Father. remember the "LORD's Prayer", MANY said it, but really didn't understand totally what it meant. peace
Actually JoJo, Jesus goes into great detail to clarify that 'He and the Father are ONE' : 8Philip said, “Lord, show us the Father and that will be enough for us.”
9Jesus answered: “Don’t you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? 10Don’t you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me? The words I say to you I do not speak on my own authority. Rather, it is the Father, living in me, who is doing his work. 11Believe me when I say that I am in the Father and the Father is in me; or at least believe on the evidence of the works themselves.
Jn 14:8-11
Pretty clear.
So let me ask you JoJo, the same think Jesus asked Philip: How is the the Father, Living IN Jesus, and Jesus living IN the Father unless THEY are One?
1 A song of Asaph. God stands in the congregation of God; in the midst of the judges He will judge.
6 I said, "You are angelic creatures, and all of you are angels of the Most High."
Verse one is speaking about earthly judges, otherwise, you are stating that G-d’s Devine council is corrupt...
Verse six is addressing those to whom G-d entrusted the Torah, Israel...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965
Eh, no he doesn’t...He is explaining it from a Christian view point...Fact is, 82:6 is not speaking of the angelic council...
What mike is missing Richard is that those scriptures are addressed to those who God entrusted the torah to and that was Israel. if read in context we see it is all about Defending the poor and fatherless: do justice to the afflicted and needy, Deliver the poor and needy: rid*them*out of the hand of the wicked,etc and when the Jew wanted to stone Jesus his reply to the Jews was Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?
Your and ye are in reference to the Jews who were entrusted with the law/torah.
Thus to insist it is speaking of some type of angelic beings is taking things out of the context they are written in.
Listen. I don't agree with everything that scholarship says but I sure as hell give scholars more credence than I do the likes of you. Now I've spent more time on you than I care for in one day.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965
So, Pneuma will get back with you tomorrow...Have a good day...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Way
Pneuma can go suck an egg.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Meerkat2
Actually pneuma gives as good as he gets, and they are both being very Christian
With one difference meerkat I do not disdain mike but he does disdain me.
I actually like mike and like speaking with him as he know his scriptures and has high regard for them and like another brother that use to be on here ( kingdomcome) he makes me think and I use as iron sharpening iron. My only criticism of mike is that he relies so heavily on his scholars that i do not believe he actually challenges what they say or not. Maybe I am wrong and he does, but if that is so why get so upset with me when I do the same thing he did?
What mike is missing Richard is that those scriptures are addressed to those who God entrusted the torah to and that was Israel. if read in context we see it is all about Defending the poor and fatherless: do justice to the afflicted and needy, Deliver the poor and needy: rid*them*out of the hand of the wicked,etc and when the Jew wanted to stone Jesus his reply to the Jews was Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?
Your and ye are in reference to the Jews who were entrusted with the law/torah.
Thus to insist it is speaking of some type of angelic beings is taking things out of the context they are written in.
First of all, I'm not missing anything. Secondly, I'm just going to post the following which asks the question ''The Gods of Psalm 82: Human or Divine?'' and then considers both sides of the issue.
You speak of not believing all of God's words. Yet you ignore the fact that the writer of Hebrews (chapter one) has God the Father calling the Son God while stating that He (the Father) is the Son's God. Understand? God the Father called the Son God and commanded the angels to worship the Son. The angels know that they are to worship only God, and they were told by the Father to worship the Son who was called God by the Father.
But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God/elohim, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.
as I keep pointing out Jesus is a part of the elohim and is not the ONE God who is our Father. they are distinct individuals
this is made plain in the very next verse.
Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.
these scripture are all talking about a hierarchy within the elohim and the Father is the highest of them all
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