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"Planet Fitness is committed to creating a non-intimidating, welcoming environment for our members. Our gender identity non-discrimination policy states that members and guests may use all gym facilities based on their sincere self-reported gender identity." (From the linked article.)
So, any man who self-reports that he is actually a woman, regardless of the truth of the matter, can use the women's dressing room? How in the world is this okay?
As a heterosexual woman, there is NO WAY I would join or continue to be part of Planet Fitness, and I am sure that many women feel the same, so I I wonder how long they will stay in business with THIS policy?!
(Btw, I am NOT against LGBT people at all, but I am against being subjected, or even possibly subjected, to being ogled in my nudity or underwear by any man who is not my husband!)
^^^ This... And you can bet money that the weirdos of society will come flocking to Planet Fitness in droves now after hearing this story.... As a man I wouldn't feel comfortable being in a dressing room with a dude who's trying to be a woman, I could only imagine how uncomfortable it would be for women who are in the locker room getting dressed with a man trying to be a woman.
What about the perverts in society who will "report themselves" or "self identify" as a woman just so they can go into the woman's locker room and get their jollies off? On second thought, I think that Planet Fitness made the correct decision! Kidding!!!!
Now, I'm the one who brought up that it is MY OPINION that there is more to this story.. And that the woman likely made a scene.. And that is likely the reason she was kicked out.. None of that is fact yet, unless there's been more released that I haven't seen on this.
I understand her position on complaining, though, if she did what I believe is likely, and made a scene about it.. I don't particularly agree with her methods. And I would not blame her if she no longer wanted to be a member of the club due to their policy.. However, it is the right of the club to make the policy. I do not agree with the policy, particularly.. So, I likely wouldn't be a member of that club. That is my right.
The planet fitness policy seems.. Odd as well.. How do they determine that someone 'sincerely' identifies as a specific gender?
According to Cormier, she returned to the gym each day between Monday and Thursday. While there, Cormier said she told women in the locker room about the individual she observed in the bathroom the weekend before.
That's unacceptable and she deserves to be kicked out of ANY organization for bullying, regardless of what their policy is on transpeople.
I think their policy is right. You know what's great about policies? You can choose to take your business elsewhere if you disagree.
Should lesbian and bisexual women also be barred from the women's locker room? After all, if you're such hot stuff, surely they'll be "oogling" you, too.
For the record, I am against being ogled by ANYONE not my husband, but the article was about a WOMAN feeling threatened by, or at least alarmed by, (rightly or wrongly) someone who at least appeared to be a MAN, so that is what I addressed.
Anyway, yes, a person DOES have the right to take their business elsewhere, and my guess is that Planet Fitness will be losing quite a few members, although they will probably be gaining some, too. (I could be wrong about this, of course, but I doubt it.)
And, of course, both you and I have the right to our opinions, although I fear that our right to express them is definitely in danger.
"The woman did make a scene. Planet Fitness cancels woman's membership after her complaints of transgender woman in locker room | MLive.com"
Quote:
According to Cormier, she returned to the gym each day between Monday and Thursday. While there, Cormier said she told women in the locker room about the individual she observed in the bathroom the weekend before.
"That's unacceptable and she deserves to be kicked out of ANY organization for bullying, regardless of what their policy is on transpeople."
Why is it unacceptable to try to educate people to a situation they may find to be unpleasant, intolerable, or whatever? If the person she was trying to "warn" thought she was being ridiculous, a bigot, or whatever, they could just ignore her or even confront her for being (supposedly) an intolerant bigot.
It is like telling people about a bad restaurant experience. Maybe the bad review is justified and maybe it isn't, but it is still perfectly acceptable to tell anyone about ANY bad experience. It doesn't mean that the listener or reader will necessarily agree.
What definitely would be unacceptable, though, would be to LIE about an experience. As far as I can gather, that was not the case here.
That's unacceptable and she deserves to be kicked out of ANY organization for bullying, regardless of what their policy is on transpeople.
Bullying ? Now you call the woman a bully for informing others of the transgender policy ?
PF had every legal right to cancel her membership for not obeying their request to shut up. My feeling is that PF didn't want the policy too well-known. Now that it is, we'll see by the marketplace how women feel about men using their restrooms.
For the record, I am against being ogled by ANYONE not my husband, but the article was about a WOMAN feeling threatened by, or at least alarmed by, (rightly or wrongly) someone who at least appeared to be a MAN, so that is what I addressed.
Anyway, yes, a person DOES have the right to take their business elsewhere, and my guess is that Planet Fitness will be losing quite a few members, although they will probably be gaining some, too. (I could be wrong about this, of course, but I doubt it.)
And, of course, both you and I have the right to our opinions, although I fear that our right to express them is definitely in danger.
Your right to express your opinions is not in danger - you never had a right to express opinions without consequences. If I heard someone running around a changing room calling out anyone based on their gender, sexual orientation, race, ethnicity, body size, etc. as this woman did, I would go right to the manager and demand that person was removed.
Feeling threatened doesn't mean that you ARE threatened. The complainant was never in any way in danger. The transwoman is in danger every day of her life.
Your right to express your opinions is not in danger - you never had a right to express opinions without consequences. If I heard someone running around a changing room calling out anyone based on their gender, sexual orientation, race, ethnicity, body size, etc. as this woman did, I would go right to the manager and demand that person was removed.
Feeling threatened doesn't mean that you ARE threatened. The complainant was never in any way in danger. The transwoman is in danger every day of her life.
My understanding is that the only LEGAL consequences for expressing an opinion were in the event that the "opinion" was wrong and presented as FACT, in which case one would be liable for slander and libel as well as possible punitive damages. Other non-legal damages might be actual violence from someone offended by such an opinion or someone having a lowered opinion of the person expressing an opinion the listener (or reader) thought was wrong, stupid, ignorant, hateful, etc. I also realize that there have been laws against "hate speech" or inciting to riot, etc. -- and rightfully so, in my opinion -- for quite some time!
However, I believe that someone always had the right to express opinions that were not actually against the law (however wrong, stupid, ignorant, etc. they may be), but, to repeat, I now am beginning to think that expressing unpopular or politically incorrect opinions will now have LEGAL consequences as well.
And, just for the record, I think violence (with very few exceptions, none of these having anything to do with the subject of this thread) in any form is just plain WRONG and should be punished. Again, that is my opinion.
In your everyday, practical life it effects you exactly none if someone identities as one gender or the other. Saying "yeah, but it's genetic!" is like arguing which color is the bestest. It doesn't matter to you, it doesn't effect you, and people are going to like/do what they want. Get over it.
No, your discomfort over someone going about their life is entirely inconsequential. If your discomfort were the metric for laws and how society operated then things would be a lot different. The majority of the country used to be uncomfortable about blacks having the right to vote. The majority of the country used to be uncomfortable about sharing restrooms with blacks. The majority of the country used to be uncomfortable with people being openly gay. Your petty discomfort counts for **** all.
There are many reasons. But the reasons are irrelevant in this matter because women are allowed to use women's restrooms.
Just flip the script. What if you were the minority and the majority tried to dictate how you lived and went about your daily life. How would you react?
Am I to assume that you will not respect someone if they don't conform to your narrow views? What if everyone behaved that way? What if you fell under the ire of someone like that? Would you just change yourself to conform to their views? What if some guy saw you about to walk into a restroom and assaulted you to keep you from entering? Would you just say "OK then, guess I don't get to use this restroom"?
Transies? Seriously? You completely support them and use derogatory terms to describe them? That's like saying "I'm not racist. I have nothing against n*****s."
So you're a bigot and keyboard tough guy.
Identity is pointless? Why are you a man? Seems pointless. If you were a woman you could carry a purse. Think of the utility. No more bulging pockets. You sound like a real attention w**** to me.
The answer is obvious but you're afraid to say it? You look like a troll to me. You make these bigoted posts, ignore reality, think everyone should think and act just like you, and never question your point of view.
See, this is the problem with you bigots. You think trans people are just confused. They're not actually what they say they are, they're just having an identity crisis. It's alright to discriminate against them because they're just trying to get attention.
Pretty disgusting behavior.
I don't think they should have their lives dictated. They are more than welcome to dress opposite and tuck their ding dong between their legs. Glad they are happy with that. They are still guys though and women should not have to have a guy in their locker room just cause he claims he's a female. This is going to open up a whole lot of abuse there is just too many pervs out there. Why can't the tranny just do their business in private or use the correct locker room.
Location: When you take flak it means you are on target
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Wow! I usually stay out of these threads. But I have to say I have never read such ignorance on Citidata before. There is a BIG difference between a transgender woman and a male dressed up as a woman.
Name one single incident where a transgender person started a problem in a bath or locker room. None, they are always started by intolerant hetrosexual women with over active imiginations. I have news for most of you ladies, we don't look that great without clothes.
And no, gender is not and never has been binary. It is the ignorance of religious doctrine from thousands of years ago that decreed it to be so. Gender isn't the problem. Religious extremism is.
Wow! I usually stay out of these threads. But I have to say I have never read such ignorance on Citidata before. There is a BIG difference between a transgender woman and a male dressed up as a woman.
Name one single incident where a transgender person started a problem in a bath or locker room. None, they are always started by intolerant hetrosexual women with over active imiginations. I have news for most of you ladies, we don't look that great without clothes.
And no, gender is not and never has been binary. It is the ignorance of religious doctrine from thousands of years ago that decreed it to be so. Gender isn't the problem. Religious extremism is.
So what you are saying is evolution really ***** up along the way and despite our evolution mainly to propagate our species just messes up? Even though evolution designed us to have certain body parts for certain reasons evolution/nature isn't as smart as we think it is and totally screws up now and again?
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