Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies > Elections
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 10-28-2022, 09:45 AM
 
18,104 posts, read 15,683,109 times
Reputation: 26808

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chas863 View Post
Please explain why anyone would fear getting doxxed from exercising their right to vote.
Please explain why anyone would fear getting doxxed from exercising 'their right' to carry weapons and watch others dropping off their ballots in official ballot boxes. Those are the people who covered their vehicle license plates (as seen in the OP's post with the video).
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 10-28-2022, 09:46 AM
 
6,005 posts, read 3,739,793 times
Reputation: 17099
Quote:
Originally Posted by lottamoxie View Post
I love the system.

They start tracking from the time you request an absentee ballot. Every absentee ballot is numbered and linked to the voter's name and address.
While that system appears to be a good one AS FAR AS IT GOES, it is not a COMPLETELY secure system because the ballot itself (as far as I know) has no unique identifying marks.

So, once all the mail-in ballots have been tracked at every step of the way, what is to prevent someone from dumping a bunch of ILLEGAL ballots into the boxes/containers at the vote counting centers after the ballots have been removed from their tracking envelopes? It is my understanding that this is what happened during the 2020 general election.

There is no way (as far as I know) to distinguish legal ballots from illegal ballots without introducing some kind of tracking system on the ballot itself which would mean that a person's vote would no longer be confidential.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-28-2022, 09:59 AM
 
Location: East Lansing, MI
28,353 posts, read 16,389,243 times
Reputation: 10467
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chas863 View Post
While that system appears to be a good one AS FAR AS IT GOES, it is not a COMPLETELY secure system because the ballot itself (as far as I know) has no unique identifying marks.

So, once all the mail-in ballots have been tracked at every step of the way, what is to prevent someone from dumping a bunch of ILLEGAL ballots into the boxes/containers at the vote counting centers after the ballots have been removed from their tracking envelopes? It is my understanding that this is what happened during the 2020 general election.

There is no way (as far as I know) to distinguish legal ballots from illegal ballots without introducing some kind of tracking system on the ballot itself which would mean that a person's vote would no longer be confidential.

Who would have these "illegal" ballots, where would they get them, and how would they get "dumped" into the boxes prior to tabulation?

In short - that absolutely did not happen.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-28-2022, 10:09 AM
 
3,048 posts, read 1,152,768 times
Reputation: 3718
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chas863 View Post
I see no correlation whatsoever to false allegations of wrongdoing and voting. Hell, someone could photograph your car in the supermarket parking lot or the local church and make the same allegations of wrongdoing. You can't go around with your license plate covered all the time for fear that someone is going to make false allegations about you. As has been stated repeatedly, you have ZERO right or expectation of privacy in a public place.
If someone posted a photo of my vehicle with my license plate visible and falsely accused me of stuffing a ballot box, you don't think I'd have anything to worry about? I do. A couple of years ago, employees of our public health department were followed home from work and their families were targeted for abuse. Librarians have been screamed at over books that aren't even on the shelves. I have a very good friend who is a local elected official, and you should hear and see the threats she receives. There are a lot of crazy people in the world, who are just looking for a reason to go off. If you haven't encountered any of them, count your blessings.

Last edited by kj1065; 10-28-2022 at 10:17 AM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-28-2022, 11:22 AM
 
18,104 posts, read 15,683,109 times
Reputation: 26808
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chas863 View Post
While that system appears to be a good one AS FAR AS IT GOES, it is not a COMPLETELY secure system because the ballot itself (as far as I know) has no unique identifying marks.

So, once all the mail-in ballots have been tracked at every step of the way, what is to prevent someone from dumping a bunch of ILLEGAL ballots into the boxes/containers at the vote counting centers after the ballots have been removed from their tracking envelopes? It is my understanding that this is what happened during the 2020 general election.

There is no way (as far as I know) to distinguish legal ballots from illegal ballots without introducing some kind of tracking system on the ballot itself which would mean that a person's vote would no longer be confidential.
Each ballot has a unique number (unique identifying mark) and is recorded in a DB at election headquarters to a specific person's name/address. Further, the return envelope also has the unique number and within the return label it identifies the person who that ballot was assigned to. Further, many choose to use the USPS and 1 stamp to send the ballot back. That's what I use. No drop-off box. The USPS also tracks it.

No system is perfect, but this one works well. You can't get an absentee ballot without registering and requesting one. That's tracked. They don't just send ballots out willy nilly. If you don't request through the official process, you don't get an absentee ballot. You have to have two witness signatures, and their addresses on the return envelope - or - notarized by 1 notary on the return envelope. I use that method.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-28-2022, 11:30 AM
 
Location: Arizona
13,281 posts, read 7,321,255 times
Reputation: 10104
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chas863 View Post
While that system appears to be a good one AS FAR AS IT GOES, it is not a COMPLETELY secure system because the ballot itself (as far as I know) has no unique identifying marks.

So, once all the mail-in ballots have been tracked at every step of the way, what is to prevent someone from dumping a bunch of ILLEGAL ballots into the boxes/containers at the vote counting centers after the ballots have been removed from their tracking envelopes? It is my understanding that this is what happened during the 2020 general election.

There is no way (as far as I know) to distinguish legal ballots from illegal ballots without introducing some kind of tracking system on the ballot itself which would mean that a person's vote would no longer be confidential.
I can only speak for the system here in Arizona, but a ballot has to be inside an envelope which is linked to the voter. They won't accept ballots which are not inside the envelope which is linked to the voter. There is no concern with someone dropping 100s of ballots in a drop box. It's obvious to me you have no idea how mail in voting works. This is the main problem with the ignorance out there someone makes wild claims of drop box stuffing people think you can stuff ballots in a box without any security controls.

Here in Arizona our mail in system has been debated by republicans, and democrats for years way before Trump came along and this is the system they worked out. When covid happened we never changed our system it was the same for years. The very same republicans who approved the system before Trump came along made wild claims that Arizona early voting system was full of fraud after Trump lost. It was like their minds were wiped clean of their entire history and now they act like they were not involved in our voting system. What did they do nothing but make themselves look like fools this is why Karen Fann is no longer around.


Arizona state constitution requires ballots to be casted in secret which means a ballot cannot be linked back to the voter it's been that way since 1930.

Last edited by kell490; 10-28-2022 at 11:42 AM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-28-2022, 12:20 PM
 
6,005 posts, read 3,739,793 times
Reputation: 17099
Quote:
Originally Posted by hooligan View Post
Who would have these "illegal" ballots, where would they get them, and how would they get "dumped" into the boxes prior to tabulation?

In short - that absolutely did not happen.
Ever heard of a "copy machine"? They were invented and became commonplace about 60+ years ago. Amazing little devils. You should check them out someday.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-28-2022, 12:25 PM
 
Location: East Lansing, MI
28,353 posts, read 16,389,243 times
Reputation: 10467
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chas863 View Post
Ever heard of a "copy machine"? They were invented and became commonplace about 60+ years ago. Amazing little devils. You should check them out someday.
Again, you simply don't understand how elections work - specifically in AZ. Go read through Stephen Richer's twitter feed, he's done at least one full explainer of the processes and safeguards.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-28-2022, 12:27 PM
 
6,005 posts, read 3,739,793 times
Reputation: 17099
Quote:
Originally Posted by lottamoxie View Post
Each ballot has a unique number (unique identifying mark) and is recorded in a DB at election headquarters to a specific person's name/address. Further, the return envelope also has the unique number and within the return label it identifies the person who that ballot was assigned to. Further, many choose to use the USPS and 1 stamp to send the ballot back. That's what I use. No drop-off box. The USPS also tracks it.

No system is perfect, but this one works well. You can't get an absentee ballot without registering and requesting one. That's tracked. They don't just send ballots out willy nilly. If you don't request through the official process, you don't get an absentee ballot. You have to have two witness signatures, and their addresses on the return envelope - or - notarized by 1 notary on the return envelope. I use that method.
If each ballot has a unique number that is traceable, then our system of privacy regarding how we vote no longer exists. I thought that the bedrock of our voting system was based on confidentiality of how a person votes. Hell, if we're going to stamp a tracking number on each ballot and register it to a specific voter, then we have ZERO privacy in how we vote. If that's not an invitation to intimidation and abuse, then I don't know what is.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-28-2022, 12:30 PM
 
6,005 posts, read 3,739,793 times
Reputation: 17099
Quote:
Originally Posted by kj1065 View Post
If someone posted a photo of my vehicle with my license plate visible and falsely accused me of stuffing a ballot box, you don't think I'd have anything to worry about? I do. A couple of years ago, employees of our public health department were followed home from work and their families were targeted for abuse. Librarians have been screamed at over books that aren't even on the shelves. I have a very good friend who is a local elected official, and you should hear and see the threats she receives. There are a lot of crazy people in the world, who are just looking for a reason to go off. If you haven't encountered any of them, count your blessings.
Where would they get pictures of you "stuffing a ballot box"? Simply taking a picture of you and your car is NOT proof that you stuffed a ballot box. LOGIC 101.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies > Elections

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:49 AM.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top