Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
1) 60% of Americans believe that children are 'better off' with 1 parent at home.
2) There have been numerous studies which find that children with a stay at home parent have an advantage from both a behavioral, emotional and academic standpoint- both in the formative years and when they reach school age
3) Because a parent (mother) may not necessarily "double the family income" by returning to work- somebody made a good post earlier about the costs associated with a parent returning to work. Full Time Daycare, in some states, can run about the same as a year of college tuition per child. For families with multiple children under school age (like myself), this alone would leave very little financial gain. Considering we would also be in a higher tax bracket, it would make no sense.
They however left out another figure which they did not calculate.
"Take, for example, a 28-year-old, college educated woman who makes $48,500—the median annual salary for college-educated Americans between the ages of 25 and 34—who plans to leave the traditional workforce for five years. If you do the quick math, her decision to become a full-time unpaid care giver might appear to make sense: She’ll leave roughly $240,000 on the table in the form of her lost wages over five years, but she won’t have to spend tens of thousands of dollars a year on child care.
But then look again. According to the CAP calculator, which draws on data from the national census, the Bureau of Labor Statistics, and the non-partisan group, Child Care Aware of America, our 28-year-old mother will also give up $213,018 in lost retirement assets and benefits and $244,811 in lost wage growth. If you add that to her $242,500 in lost wages, that’s a staggering total income loss of more than $700,000. Suddenly, taking five years off looks, well, kind of financially insane."
They however left out another figure which they did not calculate.
"Take, for example, a 28-year-old, college educated woman who makes $48,500—the median annual salary for college-educated Americans between the ages of 25 and 34—who plans to leave the traditional workforce for five years. If you do the quick math, her decision to become a full-time unpaid care giver might appear to make sense: She’ll leave roughly $240,000 on the table in the form of her lost wages over five years, but she won’t have to spend tens of thousands of dollars a year on child care.
But then look again. According to the CAP calculator, which draws on data from the national census, the Bureau of Labor Statistics, and the non-partisan group, Child Care Aware of America, our 28-year-old mother will also give up $213,018 in lost retirement assets and benefits and $244,811 in lost wage growth. If you add that to her $242,500 in lost wages, that’s a staggering total income loss of more than $700,000. Suddenly, taking five years off looks, well, kind of financially insane."
Yep!!! My wife and I talk all the time about how much money women who chose to be SAHMs/SAHWs leave on the table income wise AND give up in retirement and benefits, so they really LOSE way more money in the longrun than they think they save. Yeah, you can stay at home until your child(ren) enters kindergarten...but it might mean you have work until you are 70 something years old, unless your husband is fortunate enough to be a millionaire or something.
On the same note, another thing worth mentioning is that women who choose to take years off to be SAHMs but who eventually want to---or in some cases HAVE to---return to the work world later on often find it SUPER difficult to find employment again, due to the huge unemployment gap in their work history. Especially if their background is in a field like IT, which requires you to stay fully abreast on the latest technology and trends. A lot of employers may think, "Awww, that's great that she stayed at home to raise her kids! Good for her!!!" But then when it comes time to make a decision, they will go ahead and hire the candidate with the steady work history over you who took 5 years off away from the field to be a SAHM.
Just some things to think about that people usually DON'T think about, when it comes to being a SAHM.
Last edited by NoClueWho; 01-25-2018 at 02:57 PM..
Yep!!! My wife and I talk all the time about how much money women who chose to be SAHMs/SAHWs leave on the table AND give up in retirement and benefits, so they really LOSE way more money in the longrun than they think they save. Yeah, you can stay at home until your child(ren) enters kindergarten...but it might mean you have work until you are 70 something years old, unless your husband is fortunate enough to be a millionaire or something.
On the same note, another thing worth mentioning is that women who choose to take years off to be SAHMs but who eventually want to---or in some cases HAVE to---try to return to the work world later on often find it SUPER difficult to find employment again, due to the huge unemployment gap in their work history. Especially if their background is in a field like IT, which requires you to stay fully abreast on the latest technology and trends. A lot of employers may think, "Awww, that's great that she stayed at home to raise her kids! Good for her!!!" But then when it comes time to make a decision, they will go ahead and hire the candidate with the steady work history over you who took 5 years off away from the field to be a SAHM.
Just some things to think about that people usually DON'T think about, when it comes to being a SAHM.
And all that depends on how many kids the family has. At 50k a year it doesn’t take much for childcare for 3+ kids (especially if more than one is less than school aged) to exceed take home pay if not negate it.
Also, in lots of scenarios it helps the working parent’s career when one parent is solely responsible for the household instead of both parents having to juggle childcare responsibilities with work obligations. The family can divide and conquer if you will especially if one parent has a challenging career. Say what you like but society still doesn’t give men a pass to leave work early to go ‘pick up the sick kid’ from school because the wife is at work and can’t leave. It happens, but its still frowned upon for the most part.
Lesson being, there’s no easy answer or decision on this topic. Each family does what’s best and the answer doesn’t always come down to dollars and cents.
.
Yep!!! My wife and I talk all the time about how much money women who chose to be SAHMs/SAHWs leave on the table income wise AND give up in retirement and benefits, so they really LOSE way more money in the longrun than they think they save. Yeah, you can stay at home until your child(ren) enters kindergarten...but it might mean you have work until you are 70 something years old, unless your husband is fortunate enough to be a millionaire or something. .
But just out of curiosity, why do you and your wife care so much about other women leaving the workforce to be SAHMs? It really doesn't affect you and your wife and it's none of your business. You don't know what their personal finances are like anyway. Not everyone has to be an 8 to 5 slave like you are. Some people invested well, inherited money, are trust funded or have a spouse who earns a good salary with a good life insurance policy if something should happen. But you seem to believe most SAHMs are too dumb to do the math on what it will cost to stay home with their kids for a while.
If you want to know the true monetary worth of a SAHM, try this: post an ad on craigslist like this: "Need FREE childcare, forty hours a week". See how many people will respond to it.
Oh, and the IT field is a joke. Where I live, the vast majority of those jobs go to people on H1-B visas.
Maybe I am being naive but I don't understand all the comments about DAD working hard all day and having to work extra at home because he needs a break too? How hard is it to look after a kid for few hours? How much break is the SAHM asking for? Why can't he watch the baby while watching nightly news or clean up after dinner. Single guys go home after work and take care of house duty. Do the bedtime routine? the kid is his too.
Everyone makes it sound like the mother is asking for working father to take on the entire nightly duty from 7pm - 7am. It is just few hours, feed the baby food while you are eating your dinner.
They however left out another figure which they did not calculate.
"Take, for example, a 28-year-old, college educated woman who makes $48,500—the median annual salary for college-educated Americans between the ages of 25 and 34—who plans to leave the traditional workforce for five years. If you do the quick math, her decision to become a full-time unpaid care giver might appear to make sense: She’ll leave roughly $240,000 on the table in the form of her lost wages over five years, but she won’t have to spend tens of thousands of dollars a year on child care.
But then look again. According to the CAP calculator, which draws on data from the national census, the Bureau of Labor Statistics, and the non-partisan group, Child Care Aware of America, our 28-year-old mother will also give up $213,018 in lost retirement assets and benefits and $244,811 in lost wage growth. If you add that to her $242,500 in lost wages, that’s a staggering total income loss of more than $700,000. Suddenly, taking five years off looks, well, kind of financially insane."
I noticed they failed to subtract money she would have spent on childcare in five years from that $700,000 figure.
But SAHMs aren't the only ones who lose time out of the workforce. So do working people who go through long term unemployment. And during the Great Recession years, that was a lot of people. Even if a woman wants to work there is no guarantee of continuous employment at a good salary with benefits, during the time her kids are young.
My issue about SAHM complaints is that they complain about things that they have to do, that working mom's also have to do. Example: Get up when kid is sick. Do working mom's take vacations without their children? Do working mom's not have to cook dinner, clean the house, juggle kids appointments, settle disputes? The same exhaustive list, also without pay?
Here is the issue with the bolded, yes we do the same thing but YOU as a working mom do NOT have to do what I do during the day. When I worked I didn't have to make lunch and snacks or do the clean up from them, I didn't have to change the diapers during the time I was at work, I didn't have a mess to clean up when I dared to just go to the bathroom (this morning my two-year old pulled a chair up to the fridge water dispenser my husband forgot to lock this morning and made a huge mess when I dared to sneak a pee and that is a mild example), I didn't have to potty train, I didn't have to stop everything and just hold a child who is cranky for the entire day, I didn't have to absorb eight straight hours of unfiltered emotions, I didn't have to do the same play over and over and over again, I didn't have to pick up toys or constantly monitor that she wasn't getting into something, etc. I *still* have to do the things you do after work but people constantly dismiss that the day to day duties of taking care of a child IS STILL WORK. Would you dare tell your child's caretaker that they do not do anything all day? Does the fact it is your own child magically make the day to day tasks take less effort? And sometimes things are harder because you have your kids, like grocery shopping or making an important phone call. True I have flexibility now that I did not have working and I don't have such a tight time table in the evenings but I had no idea that I would be working so hard during the day, with little to no break. I am way more mentally and physically exhausted as a SAHM than I ever was working. If you can vent about having to do all that after a day's work, why can't I? I have also put in a day's work.
I can see your viewpoint if the kids are in school full time (although I swear after my youngest makes it to school, I will need a few years break just to recover! ) but as someone with young children, the "I do it all and work" statement is just as offensive as "at least I am raising my children and not daycare" (which I don't believe BTW). Whether working full-time, part-time, from home, or not at all, they all have their pluses and minuses when it comes to parenting and it ALL EQUALS HARD.
Quote:
Originally Posted by glamatomic
This shouldn't be about who has it harder - Stay at Home or Working Parents. All parents have challenges for different reasons. I know that we probably all look at parents in different circumstances and think the grass is greener (I know I do at times)...
But in making it a "who has it harder" competition between Mothers, we are only making ourselves more miserable and resentful.
True. I don't think I have it harder or better than anyone else, I just hate when my contributions are dismissed. I'm sure that is a universal feeling.
I'll start with the typical recital of I how know every not single SAHM complains. This thread is based on enough first-hand observations of complaining SAHM moms that I wanted to ask so I could better understand. The complaining annoys the crap out of me, but I thought if I understood it better, maybe I wouldn't be so irritated.
I know several SAHMs who seemingly do nothing but complain and are extremely resentful. If you didn't know better, you would think they have the worst lives. They complain about everything from chores, to shopping, to husbands and whatever else they can think of. These are women with nice houses, no reasons to be materially stressed, and husbands who seem to be good men with well-paying jobs. One even has a cleaning lady. All of this is compounded when they get together and it becomes a contest to see who has the worst life and the biggest clod of a husband.
I know staying at home with kids all of the time is hard as hell. There is no way I could or would want to do it. But at the same time, I am having trouble understanding why the SAHM moms seem to complain more than the working moms who have jobs AND have to manage kids and a household (because it still is primarily the women leading on both of these). Particularly, since staying-at-home is often a choice whereas having to work often is not.
I have a few theories. I'm curious if SAHM think any of these are the reasons for the complaints or if there are others:
1) Lack of adult interaction. Talking about poopies and having Paw Patrol on in the background is probably difficult and mentally frustrating.
2) Feeling of inferiority for not working. I know one of my friends who is a SAHM has this issue. She has a MA in International Relations and she is resentful that she stays home and is wasting her education.
3) Feeling of imbalance in household duties. All of the SAHMs I know complain about the husbands not doing enough. It's as if they think hubby leaves for the day and goes and just has a grand old time all day long. As a SAHM, what do you expect from husband in terms of pitching in around the house?
Anyway, just wanted to see if anyone could shed some light on why SAHMs seem so miserable. My purpose is not to criticize but to better understand.
It's really the mob mentality on a smaller scale.
Remember all those demonstrations you saw on college campuses in the 70s? Most people probably didn't even know what they were protesting. They just went because their friends went and did not want to be seen as different.
I'm sure on the moms is legitimately complaining, but the others just do it because they want to fit in and think they are supposed to be complaining.
I don't think your 2nd theory is right though. Particularly because international relations is a pretty worthless degree unless you are going to be in the presidential cabinet.
The 3rd theory is not right either. I'm sure they wouldn't want to go work in an office environment.
I'll add another theory: Complaining is just a semi-acceptable way to relate. After all, it's better than bragging.
I agree with maciemom that it's mostly venting. But many people mistakenly believe that the easiest way to connect with someone else is through a shared "negative." It's easier to build a combat unit when you have a common enemy.
So their complaining is a way to do that. It makes them seem relatable too.
I'd rather someone brag about what they like to do than whine about what they hate doing.
I was a stay at home mom, and I never complained. That life rocked.
Not every single moment, of course, but on balance it was fabulous. Get up, decide what to do fun that day. Playgroup? The children's museum meet up group? Gymboree and then McDonalds outdoor playscape afterwards? Children's reading time at the library, and then the park for a picnic later?
One time we all went to the lake - about 10 moms and all our kids. The day was bliss. One of the moms brought beer - just one each for the afternoon. Lovely day, we felt rich with blessings. As we were packing up we all decided to tell our husbands that it was difficult - you know, hot, some of the kids squabbled, ants in the food, carrying lots of heavy stuff from the parking lot to the car. We didn't though. ;D
Hahahahaha. Women who complain about being a SAHM have no perspective of that - that they can manage their days any way they want.
I think it depends how they raise their kid.
If the kid wants to do stuff all the time, it's probably great. If the kid wants to be on their phone all the time, it's probably terrible.
It's for this reason I won't babysit a kid I haven't already known or interacted with before.
I'm not committing to telling a kid who just wants to be on her phone all day that she's great just because.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
) but as someone with young children, the "I do it all and work" statement is just as offensive as "at least I am raising my children and not daycare" (which I don't believe BTW). Whether working full-time, part-time, from home, or not at all, they all have their pluses and minuses when it comes to parenting and it ALL EQUALS HARD. 