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i can only go by the records that were released. as far as i am concerned, bush served the full time, and was honorably discharged. unless you have concrete evidence otherwise, nothing changes those facts.
again, i will not denigrate kerrys service to this country. he served in vietnam, and even though there is some evidence that one of his purple hearts should not have been awarded, I ACCEPT THE FACT THAT THE MILITARY MADE THE AWARDS, did you not read that the first time i wrote it? until concrete evidence comes out that in fact kerry did not deserve one if his purple hearts, again i accept the fact that he was awarded them, and nothing changes those facts. kerry also was honorably discharged. i will NOT denigrate the service of ANYONE who serves in ANY branch of the military, with the possible exception of those who in fact committed crimes while in the military, and were convicted of said crimes, and as a result received a bad conduct or dishonorable discharge.
Well I guess the quote below do you have any evidence? Did you also have similar questions relative to Bush's service?
Quote:
"for instance i believe that john kerry used every loophole to get out of vietnam service early, and there is evidence that at least one of his purple hearts was awarded for no good reason,"
Quote:
in 2001, north korea may have had a nuclear weapons program, but there was never any no fly zone established, the north koreans had never used chemical weapons, and while a state of war still exists, again only a cease fire was signed not a peace treaty, the cease fire has remained intact for more than 50 years. and there was no condition that north korea had to submit to weapons inspectors, or any other UN inspection detail.
The cease fire is a rather tenuous one, remember when they murdered the US soldiers and South Koreans at the DMZ, assassinations attempts on South Korean leaders in the 1970's and 1980's. Its not their good nature that keeps them in check its the constant occupation of 30,000 US troops in addition to the South Koreans. The world and the North Koreans would most certainly be better off without KIm Sung.
Quote:
again bush volunteered to go to vietnam but was turned down because he didnt have enough flight hours, and the F102 program was ending. but presidents through the ages have had to send soldiers to war, and in war soldiers die. it is an unfortunate consequence of war. as for the wars in afghanistan and iraq, both of those wars had the blessings of congress. clinton sent soldiers to bosnia, somalia, and other places, and i dont remember a vote from congress before hand authorizing the efforts. remember that the commander in chief has the authority to wage a war for 90 days WITHOUT approval from congress. after that congress can choose to defund the effort, which during the clinton years, congress chose to support the president, and it was a republican congress by the way.
If Bush truly wanted to go to Vietnam as a pilot why did he join a unit that would never be going there and train on an aircraft that would never be used? certainly his fatehrs connections could have made his wish come true. There were plenty of other ways to get to Vietnam as a pilot, that (volunteering) truly sounds rather incredible since it was at that point safe bet he would not go.
I don't have sympathy for anyone who used connections to avoid the draft and then send soldiers off to war whether its the president or congress. I have greater issue with the manner in which Bush avoided being sent to Vietnam.
This is still news or should have any interest to anyone????? What was Obama's military service? Why is he sending soldiers to fight in Afghanistan if he has none???? What was Clinton's???
Can you document that during the Vietnam era? I don't recall that being the case. It would seem if that were the case it wouldn't have taken daddy pulling strings to join the guard.
If you knew history you wouldn't have to ask for it to be documented.
End result... Bush served and Clinton was a draft-dodger.
What is sad/disturbing/pathetic is that this thread has 123 (124 with this one) responses while the original thread concerning a uptick in suicides in the Army this one was split off from has 82.
All over the documented military record of a former President. A record many choose to ignore while saying they "know" it's incorrect and quoting demonstrably fake documents. The funniest response has been on the order of "I know they're fake but the information is still true".
What is sad/disturbing/pathetic is that this thread has 123 (124 with this one) responses while the original thread concerning a uptick in suicides in the Army this one was split off from has 82.
All over the documented military record of a former President. A record many choose to ignore while saying they "know" it's incorrect and quoting demonstrably fake documents. The funniest response has been on the order of "I know they're fake but the information is still true".
Hello....Hello...earth to caller....Bush is no longer the president...it IS time to let go little ones Why don't we instead discuss the anointed ones military record eyh
Huh, this post has NOTHING to do with Obama's nonmilitary record
i dont know enough about guard or reserve service to be able to answer that one, except through supposition. perhaps there were no slots available? perhaps he only did the minimum required time? not enough flight hours(the reason he was rejected for service in vietnam)? i couldnt tell you. i know that my aunt served four years in the navy, full time and reached the rank of lieutenant. is she supposed to have gone higher? i dont know.
Officer ranks in the navy are different than the Army and Air Force
the records show that bush served honorably in the guard, and until you come up with real certified proof that he in fact did not serve honorably, despite several attempts by his opponents to prove it, then you need to honor his service. for instance i believe that john kerry used every loophole to get out of vietnam service early, and there is evidence that at least one of his purple hearts was awarded for no good reason, BUT i still accept that kerry served in vietnam honorably, and that the military felt he deserved his purple hearts, and thus i accept that.
as to the iraq war, there are a few things you are conveniently forgetting;
1: there was never an end to the gulf war in 1992, just a cease fire. thus a state of war still existed between iraq and the coalition forces.
2: there were terms associated with the cease fire agreement including that saddam would submit to un weapons inspectors, that there would be two no fly zones set up for iraqi aircraft, and that coalition aircrart would enforce the no fly zone.
3: the iraqis continually violated the cease fire agreement by firing on coalition aircraft
4: saddam continually tried to stop the un inspectors from doing there jobs, and even kicked them out of the country a few times.
5: there was intelligence that saddam had WMD's in his possession, we know that he in fact DID use chemical weapons against the kurds, and the iranians, and that he was still hiding those weapons. the democrat leadership made those claims starting in 1998, a full tow years BEFORE bush was elected to office. so if bush lied, then so did clinton, kerry, gore, gehpardt, kennedy, and many other democrats.
6: there were a total of 23 reasons why we restarted the war in iraq, only two of them had to do with WMDs.
7: clinton signed into law the iraqi freedom act which REQUIRED the US to work for regime change in iraq, thus bush was following the law.
8: both the UN AND congress voted for the use of force in iraq, which makes the war LEGAL.
Lets be specific Bush may have "served" honorably papaerwork wise since that could be altered with the right influence, but by other military members who really served at the time it was at most questionable.
According to what ever records there are Bush completed his service, no one will be able to prove otherwise since the records are destroyed. Based on interviews with people he supposedly served with and the entire history only the truly naive would believe that he actually served his time as was required. I am kind of surprised that his father allowed this since he was a true war veteran.
Kerry did have a student deferment, nothing unusual there he actually enlist edin the naval reserve serving on active duty for 4 years. He faced hostile fire in his time in Vietnam regardless of your opinion regarding purple hearts he could have been killed. We can’t say the same for Bush yet the right seems to want to prop him up as the more honorable of the two.
Relative to Iraq there is enough blame to go around relative to the lack of debate and the approval of both sides of the aisle but President and his staff were at the head of the debate. Almost all the reasons you cite for going into Iraq make me wonder why we didn’t choose North Korea, WMD’s, refusing inspections and a total mad man at the helm. So didn’t the white House make the case for North Korea?
The debate rages on in the end because Bush entered into the longest war in US history sending soldiiers off to die while he made sure that he would never be in that position.
There was no money to be made in attacking Korea
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Why don't we instead discuss the anointed ones military record eyh 
