Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Excerpt from the NY Times Article "Missing in Action"
"Another particularly credible witness is Leonard Walls, a retired Air Force colonel who was then a full-time pilot instructor at the base. "I was there pretty much every day," he said, adding: "I never saw him, and I was there continually from July 1972 to July 1974." Mr. Walls, who describes himself as nonpolitical, added, "If he had been there more than once, I would have seen him."
So where was he May 4, 1972 to November 1972 and other periods? I don't know many soldiers that could be missing for that time period and not end up in the brig. The only thing factual about this was that for some unknown reason he was never declared AWOL and put in the draft, gee I wonder why?
Your links are out of date. Others have come forward who said they remember seeing Bush. Again, his official National Guard records show he was never AWOL. It's a fantasy dreamed up by the libs.
Quote:
He volunteered to go to Vietnam, sure in his dreams.
You insult every man and women has ever served in the National Guard or Reserves with your hatred for anything Bush.
I hate to burst your bubble but, serving in the Guard IS conciderd being in the Military and served your country.
President Bush served and wore the uniform of the united States Military. AND earned an honorable discharge. Get over it.
I served in the regular Navy with many Reserves and Guardsmen. Some of the lost thier lives so you can belittle thier service.
You should, but I doubt you are, be ashamed for such assinine statements.
Since you are so sure to jump on the Bush tit explain to me ho can ANYONE serve for 5-6 and only be promote once, eventhough in the Army (which you are unfamiliar with) a promotion to Captain is pretty much automatic in such a long period of time. Unless you did not show for drills, was a complete screwup, or was not worthy of promotion and if that was the case they would (should) have booted him out or sent him to vietnam.
He served his country? by what standards? not showing up for service while many underpriviledge (not wealthy) were drafted and died? Is that serving your country honorably? Comparing that COWARD with the thousands of men and women that gave their lives while he sat back in the states and fueled the political machine that started it in the first place and than had the audacity to grandstand and do it from the whitehouse!
How dare you question my loyality to this country's service men and women! My father served 20 years in the USAF (Korea/Vietnam), I served 20 years in the USAF(Desert Storm/Shield) and now my son is presently serving in the USAF(Iraqi Freedom). What are you doing now for the troops except backing a war mongering coward! Me, I'm a certified service officer helping vets get the benefits that they deserve, since those very same politicians that you defend so proudly are so busy denying them. My full time job is working in the VA hospital helping them get better and readjusting them for life back home.
So again I ask you what are YOU doing for the vets? Apparently your 4 and out is about as much as you could handle and you rather jump on the Faux bandwagon and defend a well connected coward and bury your head in the sand when the truth is right in front of you. Come to think of it when I originally posted the question of Bush's rank to everyone on this forum, NO ONE could even attempted to explain it including you. Which brings to mind that I really don't really believed that you even served.
EVERY MILITARY AND EX MILITARY PERSON KNOWS THAT YOU CANNOT SERVE THAT MANY YEARS IN THE MILITARY AND NOT GET PROMOTED AT LEAST TWICE! BUSH'S MILITARY SERVICE WAS DOCTORED TO SERVE HIS POLITICAL NEEDS! END OF STORY!
Yea, first off....national guard today and national guard when Bush went were two very different prospects. Back then it was more just to make a little extra cash and play soldier for a couple weekends. And yes there are still very legitimate questions about Bush's period when he supposedly served in any capacity at all, even in the Guard.
I am sure if Fox could have answered those questions back in 2004 they would have had a 2 hour special documentary with all of his proud fellow National Guardsmen telling us what a great standup and hardworking guy Bush was. The fact that to this day we do not see anyone stepping forward like this is pretty telling.
Since you are so sure to jump on the Bush tit explain to me ho can ANYONE serve for 5-6 and only be promote once, eventhough in the Army (which you are unfamiliar with) a promotion to Captain is pretty much automatic in such a long period of time. Unless you did not show for drills, was a complete screwup, or was not worthy of promotion and if that was the case they would (should) have booted him out or sent him to vietnam.
He served his country? by what standards? not showing up for service while many underpriviledge (not wealthy) were drafted and died? Is that serving your country honorably? Comparing that COWARD with the thousands of men and women that gave their lives while he sat back in the states and fueled the political machine that started it in the first place and than had the audacity to grandstand and do it from the whitehouse!
How dare you question my loyality to this country's service men and women! My father served 20 years in the USAF (Korea/Vietnam), I served 20 years in the USAF(Desert Storm/Shield) and now my son is presently serving in the USAF(Iraqi Freedom). What are you doing now for the troops except backing a war mongering coward! Me, I'm a certified service officer helping vets get the benefits that they deserve, since those very same politicians that you defend so proudly are so busy denying them. My full time job is working in the VA hospital helping them get better and readjusting them for life back home.
So again I ask you what are YOU doing for the vets? Apparently your 4 and out is about as much as you could handle and you rather jump on the Faux bandwagon and defend a well connected coward and bury your head in the sand when the truth is right in front of you. Come to think of it when I originally posted the question of Bush's rank to everyone on this forum, NO ONE could even attempted to explain it including you. Which brings to mind that I really don't really believed that you even served.
EVERY MILITARY AND EX MILITARY PERSON KNOWS THAT YOU CANNOT SERVE THAT MANY YEARS IN THE MILITARY AND NOT GET PROMOTED AT LEAST TWICE! BUSH'S MILITARY SERVICE WAS DOCTORED TO SERVE HIS POLITICAL NEEDS! END OF STORY!
What a bunch of hate filled rant.
You challenge my knowledge of the Army when you admit you were in the Air Force. I guess in your mind being in the AF makes you an expert in the Army.
You challenge, "by what standard". Obviously he met the standard because he earned AN HONORABLE DISCHARGE. If you don't believe it, provide documentation to refute. Don't just blast out accusations.
I never questioned your loyalty. I do resent your accusations about National Guard and Reserves being cowards and not really serving.
I served 2 tours in Viet Nam and believe that gives me the right to defend the my fellow servicemen who served and gave their lives.
You state you help the vets and I don't challenge that statement but, by your disdain for National Guard and the Reserves do you ONLY help those vets that did not serve in the Guard or Reserves? I doubt it. You don't ask, you try to help them all.
And you childish remark about what I am doing for the vets has nothing to do with the issue at hand. You know nothing about me or what I do or don't do.
You are the one who has his head in the sand about the issue. Your hatred has blinded you to the FACTs that are out there.
Get up to speed with the facts.
from: Factcheck :
"Newly released records reflect payments and credits for Air National Guard service meeting minimum requirements, despite a six-month gap."
[SIZE=3]"With Democrats openly accusing President Bush of being "AWOL" from his Air National Guard service during the 1970's, the White House released personnel and payroll records showing Bush was paid and credited for service during the period in question. And despite a six-month gap in service while working on a Senate campaign in Alabama, Air Force Reserve records show Bush was credited with enough points to meet his requirements for that year.'[/SIZE]
Yea, first off....national guard today and national guard when Bush went were two very different prospects. Back then it was more just to make a little extra cash and play soldier for a couple weekends. And yes there are still very legitimate questions about Bush's period when he supposedly served in any capacity at all, even in the Guard.
I am sure if Fox could have answered those questions back in 2004 they would have had a 2 hour special documentary with all of his proud fellow National Guardsmen telling us what a great standup and hardworking guy Bush was. The fact that to this day we do not see anyone stepping forward like this is pretty telling.
Sorry to burst your bubble but thousands of reserves served in Viet Nam.
One example,from:Reserve Forces in the Vietnam Conflict "On May 13, 1968, 12,234 Army National Guardsmen in 20 units from 17 states were mobilized for service during the Vietnam War. Eight units deployed to Vietnam and over 7,000 Army Guardsmen served in the war zone. Company D (Ranger), 151st Infantry, Indiana Army National Guard arrived in Vietnam in December 1968. As part of the II Field Force, the Indiana Rangers were assigned reconnaissance and intelligence-gathering missions. Operating deep in enemy territory, Ranger patrols engaged enemy units while conducting raids, ambushes and surveillance missions. "Delta Company" achieved an impressive combat record during its tour in Vietnam; unit members were awarded 510 medals for valor and service. The gallant record of Company D, 151st Infantry symbolizes the Army National Guard's performance in Vietnam. (National Guard Bureau web site, Image Galleries). The only ground combat maneuver unit from the reserve components to serve in Vietnam, D Company 151st Infantry from Indiana, was also the only LRRP unit in the National Guard. It served nearly a year "in country", mostly in II Field Force, during which it suffered two men killed in action and over one hundred wounded."Do some reaearch before making dumb statements.
simetime, if you have REAL evidence that bush did not meet is obligations, show it. the all of his political opponents tried since the time he first ran for governor of texas, and every election since then, and NOTHING has been found to prove that he did not deserve his honorable discharge.
as for his only being promoted once, so what? as i said there may be reasons he wasnt promoted to where you think he should be, no slots available, perhaps his record, while good enough for an honorable discharge, was not good enough for a second promotion.
again if you have REAL evidence, bring it, until then stop harping on the lack of promotion deal, and the fact that he DID receive an honorable discharge. i accept the kerrys awards as there in no REAL evidence that he didnt earn all of them. why cant you accept bushs record? do you really hate bush that much?
You challenge my knowledge of the Army when you admit you were in the Air Force. I guess in your mind being in the AF makes you an expert in the Army.
You challenge, "by what standard". Obviously he met the standard because he earned AN HONORABLE DISCHARGE. If you don't believe it, provide documentation to refute. Don't just blast out accusations.
I never questioned your loyalty. I do resent your accusations about National Guard and Reserves being cowards and not really serving.
I served 2 tours in Viet Nam and believe that gives me the right to defend the my fellow servicemen who served and gave their lives.
You state you help the vets and I don't challenge that statement but, by your disdain for National Guard and the Reserves do you ONLY help those vets that did not serve in the Guard or Reserves? I doubt it. You don't ask, you try to help them all.
And you childish remark about what I am doing for the vets has nothing to do with the issue at hand. You know nothing about me or what I do or don't do.
You are the one who has his head in the sand about the issue. Your hatred has blinded you to the FACTs that are out there.
Get up to speed with the facts.
from: Factcheck :
"Newly released records reflect payments and credits for Air National Guard service meeting minimum requirements, despite a six-month gap."
[SIZE=3]"With Democrats openly accusing President Bush of being "AWOL" from his Air National Guard service during the 1970's, the White House released personnel and payroll records showing Bush was paid and credited for service during the period in question. And despite a six-month gap in service while working on a Senate campaign in Alabama, Air Force Reserve records show Bush was credited with enough points to meet his requirements for that year.'[/SIZE]
Let me explain dear friend of faux news, for one I did serve in the Army guard/reserves, and unlike your boy bush have people who remember me serving with them although briefly. I did not like it and therefore returned to the AF.
a honorable discharge simply means that you did not get in any major trouble and served your time. Unfortunately the discharge code is not being considered either. There are individuals would were forced to leave the military due to a variety of reasons both good and and not so good and still got Honorable discharges. If you would take time to look at the bottom of your DD214.
Your service time in Vietnam has nothing to do with Bush's lack of involvement in his. Actually I would think that you also would be offended by his absence from combat. To further prove your ignorance a veteran service officer my duty is to aide ALL QUALIFIED VETERANS regardless of military affilations, not just one branch.
And since you are so hell bent on proving the inconsistencies of his service to be wrong, please explain why his dumbazz never got promoted more than once in 5 years?
I have to admit your loyality to someone who obviously had many strings pulled for him while he was in the service baffles me and many other REAL VETERANS. Please explain why do have so much faith in him? Is he a relative? Did he do you a solid at one time? Really what is it?
simetime, if you have REAL evidence that bush did not meet is obligations, show it. the all of his political opponents tried since the time he first ran for governor of texas, and every election since then, and NOTHING has been found to prove that he did not deserve his honorable discharge.
as for his only being promoted once, so what? as i said there may be reasons he wasnt promoted to where you think he should be, no slots available, perhaps his record, while good enough for an honorable discharge, was not good enough for a second promotion.
again if you have REAL evidence, bring it, until then stop harping on the lack of promotion deal, and the fact that he DID receive an honorable discharge. i accept the kerrys awards as there in no REAL evidence that he didnt earn all of them. why cant you accept bushs record? do you really hate bush that much?
When you deal with the rich and powerful it takes alot more investigative research than is available, but consider this Kerry did serve in Vietnam but people were convince that he did not, go figure. money and power can change alot of things.
His promotion is the ONLY thing that could not be altered because promotions ALWAYS leave paper trails. I'm going out on a limb and say that you never were in the military, but that does not really matter at this point. Whenever someone gets promoted there is usually some sort of ceremony and especially someone of his family's stature normally make a big deal of it with pictures and what not. The controversy revovles around the fact that no one remembers him or has even seen him at drills. In the army officer ranks 2nd Lt, 1st Lt and Capt ranks are automatic and the slots are the same. Only when you go up into the field officers rank of Major and above are slot positions are put into play. This is the reason that I put so much emphasis on his rank. You cannot get promote without anyone knowing regardless of the power/money that your parents hold.
The civilian world focused on his honorable discharge do you think that he would have gotten out with anything but one? The other thing that a previous pollster mentioned is that he had no skill other than having a degree. How did they determine what plane he could fly or his job in general?
Let me explain dear friend of faux news, for one I did serve in the Army guard/reserves, and unlike your boy bush have people who remember me serving with them although briefly. I did not like it and therefore returned to the AF.
a honorable discharge simply means that you did not get in any major trouble and served your time. Unfortunately the discharge code is not being considered either. There are individuals would were forced to leave the military due to a variety of reasons both good and and not so good and still got Honorable discharges. If you would take time to look at the bottom of your DD214.
Your service time in Vietnam has nothing to do with Bush's lack of involvement in his. Actually I would think that you also would be offended by his absence from combat. To further prove your ignorance a veteran service officer my duty is to aide ALL QUALIFIED VETERANS regardless of military affilations, not just one branch.
And since you are so hell bent on proving the inconsistencies of his service to be wrong, please explain why his dumbazz never got promoted more than once in 5 years?
I have to admit your loyality to someone who obviously had many strings pulled for him while he was in the service baffles me and many other REAL VETERANS. Please explain why do have so much faith in him? Is he a relative? Did he do you a solid at one time? Really what is it?
Let me explain dear friend of Faux news, what an assinine statement.
I find it ironic you bring up you and your family's military record as some kind of authoritive reasoning for your opinions and I bring up mine but, mine don't count.
Couldn't handle the Army, huh. Too tough for you. Had to go back to the soft Air Force.
You have made many accusations about Bush's service but I have not seen any data from you to support your claim.
P.S. Your juvinile name calling does nothing to make you credible. In fact it does just the opposite.
Bush served and got an Honorable Discharge. Get over it.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
