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I hope we can keep this thread in some modicum of moving forward...and of being polite to each other regardless of whether we vehemently disagree.... it crept because the original premise does Mj increase violence in south America... moved to domestic use. Proponents provided Colorado as one example of legalization working well... my information provided... disagrees ..factually
I asked some simple questions.. and I am going somewhere with this
What would you give up for unfettered MJ use?
One person by default would in my opinion give up their job
Anybody worried about violence in South America should be advocating for freedom by demanding the full legalization of all drugs in every nation in South America and North America.
Agreed 100%. Same page.
I'll restate WHY we have a Police problem in this country.
I asked some simple questions.. and I am going somewhere with this
What would you give up for unfettered MJ use?
One person by default would in my opinion give up their job
Next question
Would you give up food?
Ill respond at length later today
Thanks
I don't think you're going to get many posters to buy into your little trip into fantasyland on this one. You might as well just go ahead and go to where ever it is you're going to.
It isn't an either/or proposition, it never has been an either/or proposition, and it never will be an either/or proposition.
I hope we can keep this thread in some modicum of moving forward...and of being polite to each other regardless of whether we vehemently disagree.... it crept because the original premise does Mj increase violence in south America... moved to domestic use. Proponents provided Colorado as one example of legalization working well... my information provided... disagrees ..factually
I asked some simple questions.. and I am going somewhere with this
What would you give up for unfettered MJ use?
One person by default would in my opinion give up their job
Next question
Would you give up food?
Ill respond at length later today
Thanks
I don't get your point with this: smokers give up their lungs for cigarettes, they willingly pay more for insurance, diabetics give up their limbs for sugar (we see that all the time, every single day), beer drinkers take a chance of giving up their licenses when they drive home from the baseball game with their buddies, hard liquor drinkers give up brain cells and liver function....so what is your point? That mj is worse than all those? That all those things should be illegal too? What is it, exactly?
I don't drink coffee
My wife never wore an unimportatant trinket... she lives a non materialistic life...also a reason we are lifetime vegans... grow our own food.. and live lightly on the earth...my wife sews much of what she wears.. my uniforms are made in the USA..... but thanks for the false flag arguements... look over here discourse... pretty lame...
marijuana production in comparison is very destructive ....do you deny this?
Do you deny your marijuana isn't causing death and destruction ?
If you deny your marijuana isn't causing death and destruction then are the 1000s of people dying for it in other places to feed Americas thirst... are those reports incorrect?
Or is reality impossible to personalize
Inquiring minds want to know
Can you answer these questions honestly?
Marijuana is an inanimate plant. It isn't causing ANYTHING.
The illegality in most places in the US DOES create a demand for illicit traffic in marijuana.
Because this demand is being met by criminals (instead of people growing their own or being able to buy legally produced marijuana from a dispensary), there is criminal activity surrounding the production of marijuana. This has allowed the drug cartels to become as powerful in Mexico as the Mafia grew to be here during Prohibition.
Once prohibition was lifted for alcohol (but not for marijuana), the violent criminal activity surrounding its illegal production and distribution dried up overnight.
The same will happen once marijuana is legal all over the country, and its starting to happen now.
This will cause a spate of drug cartels desperately fighting each other and the police for a bigger piece of the shrinking pie of illegal marijuana supply and distribution.
The same thing happened right after prohibition was lifted, and then it stopped.
So - the way to bring down the drug cartel's involvement with marijuana is OBVIOUSLY to legalize it here so that the illegal trade will be cut off in favor of locally, legally grown product.
The way to INCREASE drug cartel violence and perpetuate their hold on Mexican lives and politics - is to keep it illegal in this country so there is continued, lucrative demand for their product.
If you are in favor of continuing marijuana prohibition in this country, you are supporting the continued reign of terror of the drug cartels throughout Central America, and parts of the USA as well. You might as well be a criminal yourself.
Marijuana is an inanimate plant. It isn't causing ANYTHING.
The illegality in most places in the US DOES create a demand for illicit traffic in marijuana.
Because this demand is being met by criminals (instead of people growing their own or being able to buy legally produced marijuana from a dispensary), there is criminal activity surrounding the production of marijuana. This has allowed the drug cartels to become as powerful in Mexico as the Mafia grew to be here during Prohibition.
Once prohibition was lifted for alcohol (but not for marijuana), the violent criminal activity surrounding its illegal production and distribution dried up overnight.
The same will happen once marijuana is legal all over the country, and its starting to happen now.
This will cause a spate of drug cartels desperately fighting each other and the police for a bigger piece of the shrinking pie of illegal marijuana supply and distribution.
The same thing happened right after prohibition was lifted, and then it stopped.
So - the way to bring down the drug cartel's involvement with marijuana is OBVIOUSLY to legalize it here so that the illegal trade will be cut off in favor of locally, legally grown product.
The way to INCREASE drug cartel violence and perpetuate their hold on Mexican lives and politics - is to keep it illegal in this country so there is continued, lucrative demand for their product.
If you are in favor of continuing marijuana prohibition in this country, you are supporting the continued reign of terror of the drug cartels throughout Central America, and parts of the USA as well. You might as well be a criminal yourself.
How about reducing the overarching problem by addressing the root cause... human desire.. bam..problems solved... absent that appropriate regulation
I asked and have kept asking several questions and have made several statements supported by the articles posted.
Does mj use in the USA increase violence in south america
A simple truth ... yes
What would you give up for it... and this was illuminating
Posters want to get high and think it actually increases their mental acuity ...
Can we agree this premise is false
Being high on mj does not increase ones mental acuity ...
Can we then have stoners working critical jobs making high quality decisions while toking up off duty... when THC remains in the body much longer than say alcohol for example ... remember they are both poisons.
Then I asked... would you give up food... because here in California its becoming an either or because of our drought ... can we support a plant that isn't required for life or nutrition that burns 6 gallons of h2o per day to grow it?
My premise is absolutely not... throw in all the other environmental damage ...even from granny 12 plant and the risk v reward isn't worth it.
Would you give up welfare for mj?... no answer.. but I know the answer already but was hoping for honesty... based upon California ... the answer is hell no... so drug users expect the American tax payer to support not only users getting high... but users using a drug that kills motivation... seems pretty clear to me... why should we enable this faulty behavior?... please tell me?
We know legalization would increase people failing drug tests ... we see already that the attitude from drug users is just move the bar then there isn't any problem anymore... false conclusion
As you toke up today someone is being murdered ..kidnapped.. raped.. and subjugated because of your desire to be high and want this benign drug
As posts continue and people read the responses of proponents they get to see the attitudes of users.. the arrogance .. the demands .. the in your face behavior that created the resulting restrictive ordinances we see here in California. I only see more of the same.
The article I provided from Colorado disputed the claims that mj is working well there... is there dispute as to the validity of " Haze"
Last edited by notmeofficer; 04-14-2015 at 09:42 PM..
How about reducing the overarching problem by addressing the root cause... human desire.. bam..problems solved... absent that appropriate regulation
I asked and have kept asking several questions and have made several statements supported by the articles posted.
Does mj use in the USA increase violence in south america
A simple truth ... yes
What would you give up for it... and this was illuminating
Posters want to get high and think it actually increases their mental acuity ...
Can we agree this premise is false
Being high on mj does not increase ones mental acuity ...
Can we then have stoners working critical jobs making high quality decisions while toking up off duty... when THC remains in the body much longer than say alcohol for example ... remember they are both poisons.
Then I asked... would you give up food... because here in California its becoming an either or because of our drought ... can we support a plant that isn't required for life or nutrition that burns 6 gallons of h2o per day to grow it?
My premise is absolutely not... throw in all the other environmental damage ...even from granny 12 plant and the risk v reward isn't worth it.
Would you give up welfare for mj?... no answer.. but I know the answer already but was hoping for honesty... based upon California ... the answer is hell no... so drug users expect the American tax payer to support not only users getting high... but users using a drug that kills motivation... seems pretty clear to me... why should we enable this faulty behavior?... please tell me?
We know legalization would increase people failing drug tests ... we see already that the attitude from drug users is just move the bar then there isn't any problem anymore... false conclusion
As you time up today someone is being murdered ..kidnapped.. raped.. and subjugated because of your desire to be high and want this benign drug
As posts continue and people read the responses of proponents they get to see the attitudes of users.. the arrogance .. the demands .. the in your face behavior that created the resulting restrictive ordinances we see here in California. I only see more of the same.
The article I provided from Colorado disputed the claims that mj is working well there... is there dispute as to the validity of " Haze"
You're whole response, Mr.Riddler, can be broken down by what you just said:
HUMAN DESIRE.
Have you ever heard of supply for demand?
Human desire shapes EVERYTHING in this world! What HUMANS WANT, suppliers make available.
Are you ignorant by choice, or just dumb?
As for the rest of your claim, you are completely out of line.
If you and Atlanta paid any attention, there have been posts upon posts that show that MANY contributing members of society are cannabis consumers.
As for your drought in Cali, are you SERIOUSLY going to blame that on cannabis growers? Are you in tune with what Nestle has been doing?
It's not even worth breaking down your B.S. point by point, as anyone with a working brain can easily refute the B.S. you spew.
There is NOTHING TO GIVE UP, except for YOU and YOUR job. Cannabis has been around a lot longer than you or eye have been on this planet. YOU are waging war on a plant that MAN put limitations on. YOU are part of the things that can LOSE by repealing prohibition.
As a public servant, don't you think that the money spent prohibiting cannabis could be better spent? Arent there bigger crimes out there to be fought against? Wouldn't you rather battle the cartels on things that REALLY matter, like meth, cocaine and opiates, you know, things that RUIN lives?
Is there an answer here?... or any worthwhile addition to the thread?
As a self professed drug user do you dispute the premise the articles made?
As an aside... I see what I can only term mood swings by your direct responses to me...from polite to angry... does MJ help you "smooth" out? Do you find it has a calming effect upon you?.. and do you experience a ... how should I term it... a hangover of sorts when you smoke often and then stop.. and if you do.. how long does this happen and when can you gain control of your emotions again?
No attack here.. since I dont use drugs at all I am interested in the perspective of one who does use them regularly... and what..if any... negative effects upon your psyche.. you perceive heavy use has.
All the legitimate evidence I see shows heavy marijuana use and withdrawal can create temporary psychosis
Thanks for sharing...
So how do we gauge your swings? First: All users/dopers are never to be trusted!
Then: I stand by it being rescheduled and it can help a limited number of people.
Are you trolling at this point? just looking to get a rise out of folks?
So how do we gauge your swings? First: All users/dopers are never to be trusted!
Then: I stand by it being rescheduled and it can help a limited number of people.
Are you trolling at this point? just looking to get a rise out of folks?
"Dopers" ( Websters classical definition of the word)cannot be trusted... legitimate MM patients are not in the mix.. all other are fair game
As OP this thread was started with a premise... proponents decided they wanted to take it in another direction..it happens on city data.... and it certainly happens with people who use drugs when divided attention becomes difficult and makes it hard to stay on track.... but Im still always coming back to premises
As to my personal beliefs
I am.. and have been always consistent.. for several years.... but thanks for asking for continued clarification.. as it is the internet and hard to get nuances .
Perhaps you would like to answer the above questions.. and share your own experience with drugs and how use is working for you in your life?... no pressure... just a question
And to my other questions...
Please.. feel free to answer them as well
I know one thing and profess this publicly...when I provide discourse on this forum I am never under the influence of anything... so you get pure me... which is really like how I like to deal with everyone.. the pure them.. unadulterated by any substance...
How about you?
Thanks for sharing
Today... reading the CNN article someone is dying for "your" pot.
How about reducing the overarching problem by addressing the root cause... human desire.. bam..problems solved... absent that appropriate regulation
Just say no... Nancy Reagan tried that 35 years ago...and it failed.
Your solution... is crap times 20...if you talked to a roomful of addiction experts about your strategy...you would be laughed out of that room.
Quote:
Originally Posted by notmeofficer
I asked and have kept asking several questions and have made several statements supported by the articles posted. Does mj use in the USA increase violence in south america
A simple truth ... yes
South America...Central America...whats the diff?
Your unable to stay on topic...in a thread you started. Do you actually think...that you will be taken seriously?
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