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Context matters in conversations. AGAIN, NG will cost between 60 and 100 million, based upon current estimates with an unknown duration time. I'm guessing the 100M will be for about a year, because that is comparable (IIRC) to what Obama spent for a year of NG at the border.
So you are complaining about it just as I said! Did you also complain when other administrations did it or just because Trump is doing it now? I haven't seen you complain once about the over $100 billion a year that illegal aliens cost us. Yet you're concerned about the costs of securing our border?
So you are complaining about it just as I said! Did you also complain when other administrations did it or just because Trump is doing it now? I haven't seen you complain once about the over $100 billion a year that illegal aliens cost us. Yet you're concerned about the costs of securing our border?
Because many disagree with the number you use.
I think it is odd to use the same amount of money something that was like 100% worse than it is now, but I think it is the best option out of what has been proposed.
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Are you referring to the NG or the wall? The wall has already proven to work and is cost effective it also helps the Border Patrol do their jobs more effectively. Your analogy is not a good comparison to that.
As for the NG, did you scream and fume when other administration sent them to the border? Does it have to be a crisis for them to go there? A caravan has already admitted they are going to try and enter our country and illegal immigration is still a problem at our border. Do you guys just hate that it's Trump trying to do something now?
Point taken. But you must admit the situation on the border is not what it was when Bush did Jump Start. The border was out of control. Southwestern cities were seeing swarms of illegals moving through and gunfights on the freeways. It was not as bad but surging again with the recovery when Obama sent the NG. But both those administrations implemented increases in BP agents, tech improvements, and augmented physical barriers put in place which were effective. Not only that but Mexico's economy has recovered and they can absorb far more workers than during the last couple decades. So we are at a near 50 year low in crossings which raises the fair question of whether Trump's action is out of national security or a political motivation.
^ Interesting, I'll admit those #'s for former POTUS Obama caught me off guard.
I've said before how awful it was during the Clinton administration. We literally had bands of 30 to 50 illegals traipsing across our property and neighborhood every single night. People were camping in our orchard and stealing cars in our neighborhood to go north. It was just horrible.
I give credit to both Bush and Obama for digging us out of that hole.
Bush extended the wall that Clinton had built, increased border patrol staffing and funding. He added border patrol checkpoints along freeways and back roads, and we started seeing border patrol agents patrolling more away from the border. We also got new border patrol helicopters, which helped quite a bit too. He also deployed the National Guard to provide support to Border Patrol operations. They did things like surveillance and flying helicopters, which freed up the BP to cover a wider area.
Obama then convinced Congress to approve a bipartisan bill that provided additional funding for the border patrol. That added agents, but also -- perhaps most importantly -- also funded more technology for patrolling the border. Under Obama, high tech drones started being used to patrol the border and are now covering the entire southern border. There are also sensors that have been placed along the border in areas that can't be fenced for geographic reasons. And, now when you drive along many freeways and roads close to the border, your car passes sensors that automatically scan your car to see if you have "illegal" cargo. There are a lot of other visible ways that we can see that the border is better protected than ever, and I am sure that there are many we don't know of too.
Obama also called in the National Guard to assist the border patrol. It was a smaller force than under Bush, but that was partially because of the technology that had been deployed.
So, yeah, we have seen a MAJOR improvement where I live since the dreadful days of the 1990s. I can't remember the last time I had an illegal come through my property.
That's not to say that there aren't many illegals already IN the U.S., or that all parts of the border areas have had the same success. It's also very clear to me that as the border has been better protected other ways of illegals arriving have not received the same attention. We also still have a very messy immigration system and that definitely needs fixing because it has a lot of loopholes that allow people to come on a short term visa and just never go home.
That's where I personally would like to see more attention placed. Perhaps the National Guard will be deployed in some of those areas too (doing things like clerical support for visa processing, e-verify, etc.)
So you are complaining about it just as I said! Did you also complain when other administrations did it or just because Trump is doing it now? I haven't seen you complain once about the over $100 billion a year that illegal aliens cost us. Yet you're concerned about the costs of securing our border?
Probably because that 100 billion a year nonsense has been repeatedly debunked.
I guess red meat for the base isn't cheap these days huh?
This is all it is. It's a political matter - not a matter of need.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wintergirl80
You are correct. I just read on ABC News this morning this group is only temporarily stopping and some will apply for visas in Mexico and the rest have all intention on continuing heading to U.S....
Its absurd that some fellow Americans see this as no problem and instead are making snide, mocking comments to those of us who want these people stopped.
They are heading to the US to LEGALLY APPLY for asylum.
This is all it is. It's a political matter - not a matter of need.
They are heading to the US to LEGALLY APPLY for asylum.
It's not a problem. Trump can LEGALLY deny them.
See? Problem solved.
Right now, the so-called "caravan" of 1000 people is 3000 miles from the U.S. border. They haven't even made it to Mexico City.
So, they are not an imminent threat at all.
Think of a group of people walking from New York to Los Angeles, and that's about how far they still need to go to get to the U.S. border. Most of the group are never going to make it anywhere close to the U.S. and, as noted, if and when any of the group do show up at the border, their request for asylum can be turned down.
I am within walking distance of the border crossing that they are supposedly heading towards and I am not losing any sleep or living in fear about this.
Point taken. But you must admit the situation on the border is not what it was when Bush did Jump Start. The border was out of control. Southwestern cities were seeing swarms of illegals moving through and gunfights on the freeways. It was not as bad but surging again with the recovery when Obama sent the NG. But both those administrations implemented increases in BP agents, tech improvements, and augmented physical barriers put in place which were effective. Not only that but Mexico's economy has recovered and they can absorb far more workers than during the last couple decades. So we are at a near 50 year low in crossings which raises the fair question of whether Trump's action is out of national security or a political motivation.
It was all of this and worse. We bought our house in 1988. Things were fine until 1993/94 when all hell broke loose and it just kept getting worse.
I couldn't even let my kids play in our yard because we had so many illegals running through our property every day and night.
It was a nightmare.
As I said, I give credit to George Bush for getting things back under control, and Barrack Obama continued what Bush had started.
Things are much better now. It is absolutely nothing like it was in the 1990s. THAT was a true crisis.
Again, that's not to say that we don't still have OTHER issues related to illegal immigration that we need to fix. We definitely do. And certainly, the border should continue to be protected by the border patrol, and I have no problem with the National Guard supporting that effort, as they did under both Bush and Obama.
However, at least from where I sit (and also drive as I drive along the entire California border at least 3-4 times a month), the number of illegals sneaking across the border on foot today is not the emergency some are portraying it to be. And the Federal government's own numbers back that up.
Its impossible to debunk a number in dollars when we don't know how many are in the US.
I agree - we don't have firm numbers on how many illegals are in the U.S. so we really don't know what the balance sheet looks like.
We do, however, have almost 100 years of official Federal data that show us how the numbers of illegals sneaking across the border have changed over time.
I shared that data going back to Jimmy Carter's administration in post #86.
The data indicates that the number of illegals sneaking across the southern border last year was the lowest it's been since 1971.
The President should be trumpeting that fact! It shows that his attempts to discourage illegals from crossing the border are working great.
Instead, despite the Federal data, he is trying to convince us that there is a national emergency at the border the likes of which has never been seen before.
Again, to be clear: I am not saying that illegals aren't arriving in other ways; I have no doubt that they are. Nor am I saying that there are not millions already here. Or that they don't cost taxpayers money.
Last edited by RosieSD; 04-05-2018 at 02:19 PM..
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Did you also complain when other administrations did it or just because Trump is doing it now? I haven't seen you complain once about the over $100 billion a year that illegal aliens cost us. Yet you're concerned about the costs of securing our border?
