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Old 08-04-2018, 11:34 AM
 
Location: Phoenix
30,392 posts, read 19,184,321 times
Reputation: 26297

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oklazona Bound View Post
That is totally false. He was under investigation before Trump even announced his run for POTUS. But if you want to ignore the facts go right ahead.
yeah Mule-ear has known of these allegations since 2005 and only criminalized his actions to try to get at Trump....manafort is a political prisoner and the Demonics don't want to give up their capture.
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Old 08-04-2018, 11:47 AM
 
30,181 posts, read 11,815,563 times
Reputation: 18698
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tall Traveler View Post
yeah Mule-ear has known of these allegations since 2005 and only criminalized his actions to try to get at Trump....manafort is a political prisoner and the Demonics don't want to give up their capture.

It was 2014 and not Mueller of course. And if he is innocent like you seem to believe Trump could have already pardoned him. What is he waiting for?

Do you actually know anything about Manafort and some of the people he has done business with? Ferdinand Marcos for one. In fact 3 of the top 4 Kleptocrats did business with Manafort. His specialty was taking money from these ruthless despots who stole billions from their people. Not illegal but highly unethical. A POS in my opinion if ever there was one.

And he simply stole $19 million from a Russian Oligarch.

But to you he is pure as the driven snow.
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Old 08-04-2018, 11:54 AM
 
Location: Long Island
57,317 posts, read 26,236,916 times
Reputation: 15654
Quote:
Originally Posted by godofthunder9010 View Post
The crimes that Manafort is on the hook for did not occur during the Trump Campaign and have nothing to do with the Trump Campaign. Therein lies the problem. The witch hunters found a witch, but it wasn't who they were looking for. Since the money laundering ring also equally implicates Tony and John Podesta, the money laundering ring taints both Trump and Clinton campaigns fairly equally. Both campaigns were run by the same cabal of crooks.
He was broke in 2016 when he entered the Trump campaign, he received bank loans right after he left the campaign. It does not appear that there is any criminal activity by Trump but he sure showed bad judgment hiring Manafort if nothing else. Manafort received funding from the Russian party and did his best to support their puppet in Ukraine so there is no surprise that he would be investigated in the Russian probe. It is amazing he would take the risk of being in the spotlight with all his baggage but people who think this investigation amounts to singling out Manafort are mistaken.
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Old 08-04-2018, 12:08 PM
 
Location: alexandria, VA
16,352 posts, read 8,101,791 times
Reputation: 9726
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oklazona Bound View Post
It was 2014 and not Mueller of course. And if he is innocent like you seem to believe Trump could have already pardoned him. What is he waiting for?

Do you actually know anything about Manafort and some of the people he has done business with? Ferdinand Marcos for one. In fact 3 of the top 4 Kleptocrats did business with Manafort. His specialty was taking money from these ruthless despots who stole billions from their people. Not illegal but highly unethical. A POS in my opinion if ever there was one.

And he simply stole $19 million from a Russian Oligarch.

But to you he is pure as the driven snow.
Good post. I agree 100%. As to why Trump hasn't gone ahead and given Manafort a pardon my guess is timing. If Trump gave Manafort a pardon now the "optics" would be bad and it would hurt the Pubs in the November election. Then the Dems take over the house, initiate impeachment proceedings...well, you get the picture. So Paulie will have to cool his heels in the clinker until after at least the November mid-term election, and maybe even the 2020 election. And if he follows omerta all that time he'll get his pardon. I believe that's what Trump was signaling to Manafort the other today when he tweeted about how unfairly Manafort was being treated, worse than Al Capone, etc. Trump was basically saying to Manafort--"Hang in there Paulie, and keep your mouth shut. And when the time is right you'll get a full pardon".
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Old 08-04-2018, 12:44 PM
 
Location: Lyon, France, Whidbey Island WA
20,836 posts, read 17,115,957 times
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One must be convicted to be pardoned.
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Old 08-04-2018, 12:46 PM
 
30,181 posts, read 11,815,563 times
Reputation: 18698
Quote:
Originally Posted by r small View Post
Good post. I agree 100%. As to why Trump hasn't gone ahead and given Manafort a pardon my guess is timing. If Trump gave Manafort a pardon now the "optics" would be bad and it would hurt the Pubs in the November election. Then the Dems take over the house, initiate impeachment proceedings...well, you get the picture. So Paulie will have to cool his heels in the clinker until after at least the November mid-term election, and maybe even the 2020 election. And if he follows omerta all that time he'll get his pardon. I believe that's what Trump was signaling to Manafort the other today when he tweeted about how unfairly Manafort was being treated, worse than Al Capone, etc. Trump was basically saying to Manafort--"Hang in there Paulie, and keep your mouth shut. And when the time is right you'll get a full pardon".
Manafort may not have much if anything that would nail Trump.

We will see impeachment proceedings if the dems take the house. They will want to do it as soon as they take over even if Mueller is not done. Like Bill Clinton conviction is difficult. Not very many GOP will want to go down with helping to remove a GOP President. And it would take more than 30% of the GOP in the Senate to convict him. So Trump is not going to leave the office early. Only way in my opinion would be if Mueller uncovered some big financial connection to the Russian government to Trump with Trump making decisions as POTUS based on those connections. And if that was true you would expect that there would be hotels and are sorts of ventures for a decade or two in Russia with Trump's name on it and that is not the case. All that seems to exist is one Miss Universe pageant. And there are endless urban legends swirling around that.

I don't that Manafort has that much if anything that could be used against Trump as regards to collusion. Trump's biggest problem is his firing of Comey. If there was collusion it was through ignorance of campaign laws by his inner circle not intentional. Obstruction with the Comey firing is likely.
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Old 08-04-2018, 12:48 PM
 
30,181 posts, read 11,815,563 times
Reputation: 18698
Quote:
Originally Posted by AADAD View Post
One must be convicted to be pardoned.

No that is not true. Nixon was pardoned and was not convicted yet. Pardon's can be before the conviction.


https://www.nytimes.com/1988/01/05/o...on-590688.html
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Old 08-04-2018, 02:00 PM
 
21,430 posts, read 7,464,101 times
Reputation: 13233
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oklazona Bound View Post
No that is not true. Nixon was pardoned and was not convicted yet. Pardon's can be before the conviction.


https://www.nytimes.com/1988/01/05/o...on-590688.html
Correct.

And no one has to accept a pardon, the person is free to reject it.

Accepting the pardon is an admission of guilt.
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Old 08-04-2018, 02:57 PM
 
Location: Columbia, SC
37,195 posts, read 19,232,404 times
Reputation: 14919
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oklazona Bound View Post
As far as Manafort being broke. $19 million vanished into thin air. My guess is at least some of that is hidden away somewhere.



I read a Slate timeline on Trump and Manafort. Depending on who you believe they first met either in 1980 or 1988. Trump used the lobbying firm run by Manafort and Stone for some of his real estate projects for several years. And Manafort did buy a condo at Trump tower.



As far as them keeping regular company that is probably not correct. More like acquaintances. And it was Manafort who was begging the Trump campaign to work on it and offered to do so for free. It was a personal PR move for Manafort to give him some breathing room from his creditors.
All I have to go on is the word of his daughter.

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry...b03cd20b832fe0
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Old 08-04-2018, 03:02 PM
 
Location: Columbia, SC
37,195 posts, read 19,232,404 times
Reputation: 14919
Quote:
Originally Posted by godofthunder9010 View Post
The crimes that Manafort is on the hook for did not occur during the Trump Campaign and have nothing to do with the Trump Campaign. Therein lies the problem. The witch hunters found a witch, but it wasn't who they were looking for. Since the money laundering ring also equally implicates Tony and John Podesta, the money laundering ring taints both Trump and Clinton campaigns fairly equally. Both campaigns were run by the same cabal of crooks.

The core issue is that associating with a criminal does not make you a criminal. I can go visit a dear friend in prison but it doesn't make me guilty of the crime that he is in there for. Visiting them doesn't even make me a bad person. So I don't understand the Dems jumping up and down for joy over catching Manafort.

Trump did what he said he would do. He brought a lot of experienced politicians onboard as an answer to critics that he didn't know how to do the job of President. Unfortunately, politicians are very corrupt people and Trump will always have a very corrupt talent pool to draw from.

It would probably be a lot of fun to do a deep investigation of everyone in our federal government, but I suspect we'd be left with 1/10th of the members of the Senate and House and we'd absolutely gut every federal bureau, all while creating a prison overpopulation crisis in DC. Might be fun to keep score and see which party had more former Senators and Congressmen thrown in prison. That's likely to be a pretty equal race.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RnwCsSs535w
This is only the first set of indictments being dealt with. There is another trial in September. There are several hundred sealed indictments in the courts in D.C. and SDNY that have been piling up since last November.

There is a reason the indictments are not all being released at once. Stay tuned. Mueller is going to surprise everyone.
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