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View Poll Results: Do you support giving Ukraine F-16s
Yes 201 39.88%
No 254 50.40%
Unsure 49 9.72%
Voters: 504. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 04-23-2024, 08:37 PM
 
Location: Durham NC
5,275 posts, read 3,855,183 times
Reputation: 3801

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Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
I do, and let me tell you how I personally perceive the latest events on Ukraine, what took place in Congress.

For starters, to make things clear, I always considered Russia to be in the right in this Ukrainian conflict, and US in the wrong ( that infamous "F*** the EU" of Nuland back in 2014, made the picture pretty clear I think.)

But Russia being in the right, doesn't mean PUTIN being in the right, starting from the fact that he failed to protect Donbass from Ukrainian nationalists back in 2014, with his bragging at that point, that he "managed to avoid the war, that the West was trying to trick him into."
Fast forward, once the inevitable happened ( i.e the war that was simply postponed, but not cancelled out all together,) and Putin teamed up with China and Iran, this fact was not easy to ignore ( even for the anti-war forces in America).

So while Putin enjoys his authoritarian rule, pretending that "the whole of Russia is united behind him," he hoped to use American multi-party system ( and difference of opinions) to his own advantage, thinking that the West would get tired of this war politically and financially, and will bring it to an end, thus making him a winner automatically.

But anti-war Republicans I think, as much as they've had enough of this war, couldn't miss this side of the story at this point already - that it's not just Russia that was benefiting from the end of war as the result of lack of funds, but Russia, united with China and Iran.

And that's why they decided to play safe, and not to hand Putin what he was looking for - i.e. the benefits of US multi-party system, that he was hoping to use to his own advantage.
Instead, they decided to act as united front, along with the Democrats. Which has put now Putin in a difficult position.
See, as long as he was doing away with the likes of Navalny, the kind of internal Russian opposition serving Western interests, Putin's actions were justified in the eyes of many in Russia.
But once he killed Prigozhin, who in no way could have been accused of being "Western asset," this changed a lot.
See, Prigozhin dared to criticize those handpicked by Putin for their failures during this war, their corruption and inefficiencies. And even though he avoided ever using Putin's name, he was assassinated as someone who dared to criticize Putin's authoritarianism.
Which in turn proves that Russia is NOT as united behind Putin personally as he advertises.

So as I've said, while he was counting on using American "weakness," suppressing any criticism and dissent in Russia simultaneously, Republicans didn't hand it to him, as he hoped.

So I feel sorry for Mike Johnson kinda, since he now carries the brunt of it all, but Putin was deprived of the victory, the way he planned it. So now we are coming to an impasse, with both sides ( Russia and US,) having numerous pros and contras to lose/win this war, and what will come out of it, remains to be seen.

I can only guess that the assassination of Prigozhin will cost Putin dearly among other things, not to mention his betrayal of Donbass back in 2014.
21 people voted against this package. Guess out of how many votes? This vote only strengthens Putin's support in Russia. Quite a few Americans actually hate Russian people for no damn reason. You are aware of the insanity in this country now? It is on display right here.
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Old 04-23-2024, 09:21 PM
 
19,223 posts, read 27,857,953 times
Reputation: 20334
Interesting news from Russia.
Minister of defence deputy, Timur Ivanov, was arrested for bribe, along with a bunch of underlings. He was supervising construction, buildings, that type of things for Russian MOD.
I'm curious, if Gerasimov will be next. The way it goes in Russia, if you take, you ALWAYS share with the man above you, or you do not last long.
Interestingly, Ivanov had special troop protecting him, allowed to shoot to kill anyone, who'd attempt to detain him. The ONLY time he was without his protection was while meeting with the very upper country management.
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Old 04-23-2024, 09:48 PM
 
Location: Honolulu, HI
24,929 posts, read 9,673,925 times
Reputation: 23256
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post

Every country has its problems. My biggest concern for Russia isn't now but what happens when Putin is no longer the leader. That's the challenge with such a larger than life fixture of Russian leadership going on decades and decades (official or otherwise). Going to be a large power vacuum if not handled properly and that can be bad.
I disagree.

We waited to see what would happen with North Korea and Iran, surprise, they just selected another bad guy to run the country. Business as usual.

We can do hypotheticals all day, but at the moment, bad countries exist and it won't come to and end just because their current leader dies.
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Old 04-23-2024, 10:25 PM
 
26,893 posts, read 22,760,405 times
Reputation: 10078
Quote:
Originally Posted by lancers View Post
21 people voted against this package. Guess out of how many votes? This vote only strengthens Putin's support in Russia. Quite a few Americans actually hate Russian people for no damn reason. You are aware of the insanity in this country now? It is on display right here.

I don't believe so.

I think it's the other way around - it will only add frustration to all the mistakes he already made before, which are already scrutinized, like his failure to timely respond back in 2014.

So the resolve to win this war will not subside - I don't think so, however it will make Russians to be more discerning in their decisions/opinions - let me put it this way for now.
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Old 04-24-2024, 05:38 AM
 
2,389 posts, read 1,113,578 times
Reputation: 3491
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocko20 View Post
I disagree.

We waited to see what would happen with North Korea and Iran, surprise, they just selected another bad guy to run the country. Business as usual.

We can do hypotheticals all day, but at the moment, bad countries exist and it won't come to and end just because their current leader dies.
North Korea it's "All in the Family".....

Iran is not strictly a dictatorship ....it's a bunch of "bad" clerics....

There is no 40 year old Vlad Putin Jr
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Old 04-24-2024, 08:01 AM
 
Location: Durham NC
5,275 posts, read 3,855,183 times
Reputation: 3801
Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
I don't believe so.

I think it's the other way around - it will only add frustration to all the mistakes he already made before, which are already scrutinized, like his failure to timely respond back in 2014.

So the resolve to win this war will not subside - I don't think so, however it will make Russians to be more discerning in their decisions/opinions - let me put it this way for now.

Let's try to get past the Putin didn't react in 2014 already. That's in the past and can't be changed. What this recent vote in the US for more for Ukraine has shown the Russian people is that the US has no desire for any negotiations and that The West wants to destroy Russia even at the expense of bankrupting themselves.
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Old 04-24-2024, 08:10 AM
 
5,228 posts, read 3,171,954 times
Reputation: 11158
Quote:
Originally Posted by lancers View Post
Let's try to get past the Putin didn't react in 2014 already. That's in the past and can't be changed. What this recent vote in the US for more for Ukraine has shown the Russian people is that the US has no desire for any negotiations and that The West wants to destroy Russia even at the expense of bankrupting themselves.
Another view of this, in a context much larger than the war in Ukraine, is that the goal of U.S. foreign policy is to stifle the BRICS countries and prevent their economic rise and financial competition that might weaken the current dominance of the USD. The real question is when did the American electorate approve this undeclared, forever “war” against half of the world?
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Old 04-24-2024, 08:13 AM
 
2,383 posts, read 1,002,131 times
Reputation: 1444
Quote:
Originally Posted by michiganmoon View Post
161 Ukrainian children that were claimed to have been kidnapped by Russia have just been found inside Germany.

Russia denied kidnapping children and said orphanages were evacuated from the frontlines, but they're properly accounted for. Some media are still claiming they were kidnapped by Russia. No word on how these kids got to Germany and if Russia put them there.

At least they're located.

The ICC has brought charges against Putin over this a year ago.

Al Jazeera notes that the West including the US has waged wars killing children, starving children, making orphans of children, and misplacing children all over the globe and the ICC has looked the other way.

https://english.almayadeen.net/news/...sia-found-in-g
Of course. The US operates under the "international rules based order" where the US sets the rules and everyone else follows the order.
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Old 04-24-2024, 08:15 AM
 
Location: Honolulu, HI
24,929 posts, read 9,673,925 times
Reputation: 23256
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTB365 View Post
North Korea it's "All in the Family".....

Iran is not strictly a dictatorship ....it's a bunch of "bad" clerics....

There is no 40 year old Vlad Putin Jr
Then NATO would've never been created. Sweden and Finland never would've joined NATO after 70 years.

You don't become Putin without having another version of Putin ready to replace you when you're gone. There is no 40 year old Gorbachev ready to replace Putin. Just another version of Putin. Something the West predicted a long time ago, hence NATO.

Russia had a long time to change, surprise, they never did. Germany changed. Japan changed. Italy changed. Russia? Nope.

Last edited by Rocko20; 04-24-2024 at 08:24 AM..
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Old 04-24-2024, 08:35 AM
 
2,389 posts, read 1,113,578 times
Reputation: 3491
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluesclues5 View Post
Of course. The US operates under the "international rules based order" where the US sets the rules and everyone else follows the order.
Not true....

But if it is true ....what is wrong with that? ....
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