Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I didn't like how the maid Jane talked to Lord Grantham like if she was the only one with the power to make him happy. I think she mentioned she loved him but how could she if she really doesn't know him? I'm glad she is gone but also really, really surprised no one caught them.
I think his lordship and the parlor maid is the most Far-fetched sub-plot yet. Totally ridiculous IMO. Which is not to say that it never happens in real life but in this case I didn't buy it at all.
Hmmmmm...well, last night's show was thought-provoking.
Bates and Anna. I loved how Anna took charge and insisted Bates make the arrangements that they get married. The more I see of Anna, the more I like her. She handled Richard perfectly, told the right people what happened. She got Mr Bates, and then had her way with him. They are a lovely couple, and I don't think Anna could love a murderer. Bates is a good man. Anna is a smart woman. Mrs Bates was much too self-centered to take her own life purposely. That said, regardless if Mr Bates bought the poison, and had motive to kill the heartless harridan, I would suspect that Mrs Bates treatment of Mr Bates is a pattern in her life, and that she's left behind many people with motive and opportunity to kill her.
Lord Grantham and Jane: The relationship didn't feel genuine. It was contrived. He was lonely, and more than that, he specifically has states that before the war he felt he had a purpose, now he's not only lonely but he's feeling lost and at loose ends. From a writer's standpoint, his attraction to Jane underscores that his life is in crisis, and also gives the character a grounding point to give his blessing to Sybil and Branson. But the attraction wasn't true to the character. Lord Grantham has demonstrated a great deal of self-control and discipline that would have to be overcome in order for his character to give in to a baser attraction to Jane. He doesn't see his wealth and standing as being an entitlement, he sees it as a responsibility filled with obligations. And Jane's character has never been fleshed out enough to justify the attraction the writers want the viewers to believe exists between them. (As a side note: I thought that giving Jane the business card and basically a stepping-stone for Freddie will be bad, because it could look in the future as if Jane's son is the lord's bastard, who might make claim on the estate in the future.)
Richard and Mary: I didn't dislike Richard at first. He's a social climber, a man who is willing to use his wealth and power to advance himself socially. Ambition is not a bad thing. And knowing yourself, acknowledging that you are willing to buy yourself a wife and entry into her social status, is not a bad thing either. He was honest. He's worked hard to achieve what he's had. He's willing to pay for what he wants. But he's also willing to lie, cheat, and steal, isn't he? He has no moral compass. And Mary might not be the soul of compassion, she can be cold and hard-hearted, and if she were a social climber, she and Richard might be a good match for one another. But she's not a social climber, and since she won't be Richard's partner on his march to glory, she's just a possession to him, a tool he plans to make use of. The fact that he is trying to spy on her tells us that he's also not as secure as he pretends to be. That and the fact that he's threatened her several times now. If he felt secure in their relationship, he'd have no need to spy and threaten. And wedding vows aren't going to make him feel more secure. Which doesn't bode well for her marriage. That kind of insecurity paves the way for abuse. And his remark about getting rid of the mansion he supposedly bought for Mary, because it's too close to Downton, that's another clue that he's potentially abusive. Abusers like to isolate their victims, it makes them easier to control, and removes them from their support system.
Matthew and Lavinia: That overhead shot of the dead Lavinia, the bed perfectly made around her, that really was a cliche shot. The sacrifice. And so we have the sacrifice of Lavinia, who didn't die of the Spanish flu, but instead, of a broken heart. Because she discovered that Matthew loves Mary. Well, duh, she's known all along that Matthew loves Mary. Only a complete dunderhead could miss the longing glances, the uncomfortable pauses, the things everyone else says about Matthew and Mary. Lavinia has known from the moment she set eyes on the two that there was an undeniable connection between Matthew and Mary, that she would always be competing with "what could have been". She died of Spanish flu. And I don't think that she was anywhere as self-sacrificing as she pretended to be, because otherwise she would have been out of the picture ages ago.
Thomas. I actually felt sorry for Thomas when he discovered he's been scammed. That he was willing to step up to the plate and work for his place at Downton Abbey is a good thing from him. But he's a cad at heart. And all the time he was stepping up, I couldn't help but think that there's the butler for Richard. Mr Carson has too much character. Richard and Thomas are the perfect pair, two social climbers who think that money can buy anything.
For the first time, I watched the episode on PBS vs downloading it from Amazon the next day. Kinda wish I had taken the second route. This episode takes a lot of strength to get through.
The Dowager did not disappoint when I rubbed my hands in anticipation of her usual zinger "don't be defeatist dear. It's very middle-class." Robert shows himself capable of matching his dear Ma-ma in one-liners, though his remarks seem more mean-spirited. To Cora: “If you’re turning American on me, I’m going downstairs.â€
Just A LOT happened. I understand that this was a two episode compression into one for the American viewer. IMO, it would have been better left as two. What has previously been a leisurely view of Downton Abbey life has suddenly turned into a whole lot of events crammed into a short period of tv time. I didn't particularly care for that.
Next week, I'll wait and d/l the Amazon version. If there is to be as many plot lines tossed at me, I'd rather be able to watch the episode with an ability to take a break between peaks of drama.
(the wording of the link is meant more in snark than as a spoiler - the recapper is quite acidulous in their discussion of the episode)
I absolutely agree with you. The UK version split these episodes. I would have to watch mine to see if anything was left out. Nothing leaped out at me.
The pacing was really weird in this episode, like Fellowes had to cram everything into the season finale. And it would have made more sense for the flu epidemic to have hit Downton when it was still a hospital (all those sick and wounded people coming in and out) rather than late in the epidemic when the household was fairly isolated.
Yeap, right there with you. I think it was obvious it was going to happen. But also thought it was going to go all the way; good thing it didn't.
I thought it was really weird how he kissed her once and then how she pursued him and then for him to say, after no time at all, "I want you with every fiber of my being" So, weird and so desperate. He obviously is having problems with Cora, he snapped at her left and right.
I may be totally off base but I don't think it is over with them. I know she is gone but it's just a feeling.
The pacing was really weird in this episode, like Fellowes had to cram everything into the season finale. And it would have made more sense for the flu epidemic to have hit Downton when it was still a hospital (all those sick and wounded people coming in and out) rather than late in the epidemic when the household was fairly isolated.
I agree. I felt like we were all running from one thing to another.
I didn't like how the maid Jane talked to Lord Grantham like if she was the only one with the power to make him happy. I think she mentioned she loved him but how could she if she really doesn't know him? I'm glad she is gone but also really, really surprised no one caught them.
I think this "quick" side thing will at some point bite the Lord in his arse. It happened fast and ended fast. I really don't trust that that is the end of it. Maybe this Jane has done this type of thing before. I think Fellows was off the mark with the writing of this.
It is on PBS. Not sure if the channel is standard everywhere...or you can watch it on Amazon or the PBS website.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
