California vegetable experience for those with "nature deficit disorder" (high school, gardens)

[TrueTimbers]

Originally Posted by user_id

You mean the delusion, almost every animal and plant we eat has been manipulated genetically by man....

Yes in the context you speak of indeed virtually every plant and animal we eat has been genetically manipulated by man... I do it myself! I select which stock to breed to give me the attributes I desire, same with saving seed from plants that performed the best in the given environment...

modification or manipulation has many "hues" or "tones" to it. Sure selecting a strain of wheat to grow in a given environment, or a cow that produces the best milk on the type of pasture you have is as old as agriculture itself.

Step down from the macro definitions, lets look at what kind of manipulation or modification is "healthy" what kinds are not... For me coaxing a characteristic out of a plant or animal I desire is different than taking apart the plants DNA and inserting DNA that would have never their in nature is manipulation...

But lets stick to the dirt. Gotta get down in the dirt to take a closer look..

I personally see a big difference in using bio dynamics to nurture and coax productivity out of the soil, verses a "strong arm" approach of applying energy intensive anhydrous ammonia to dead soil to force plants to grow. It is not the same kind of manipulation...

Read the book I posted the link too. Then we can discuss it..

Please lets try and not have this spiral into bickering.. We all need a break from that... For me it is not healthy, it deadens the mind, clouds the beauty of the day... Makes me closed and defensive not open and loving..

Is anything good about the project in big sur to YOU??????

If not why not let us who find it fullfilling and fascinating carry on our conversation..

[dclamb3]

Originally Posted by TrueTimbers

Please lets try and not have this spiral into bickering.. We all need a break from that... For me it is not healthy, it deadens the mind, clouds the beauty of the day... Makes me closed and defensive not open and loving..

Is anything good about the project in big sur to YOU??????

If not why not let us who find it fullfilling and fascinating carry on our conversation..

Well said

[TrueTimbers]

Originally Posted by jaijai

Science and spirituality / mysticism are not mutually exclusive ... are not diametrically opposed.
As science progresses their convergence is ever more apparent.
To be solely (and arrogantly and ignorantly!) materialistic / rationalistic is pure folly.
The fundamental reality which quantum physics describes is not at all incompatible with the fundamental reality testified to by mystics down through the ages.
And though i joke about myself, the label "hippie" is just that and i'm certainly no new age ninnie.

Out of the physicists I have know, it seems a disproportionate number of them, have some pretty unique spiritual/mystic beliefs. Just personal observation of the hundreds of physicists I have known through the years.. An open, intelligent, thinking, mind peering over the rim of our knowledge into the abyss of the unknown undiscovered indeed requires imagination..

As usual I share your viewpoint...

[TrueTimbers]

Originally Posted by dclamb3

Well said

Thanks... for being such a bright sunny person.. I just love your posts and your attitude about life... I get that nice comfy secure feeling like when you are in a room with people you respect and trust..

[dclamb3]

Originally Posted by TrueTimbers

Thanks... for being such a bright sunny person.. I just love your posts and your attitude about life... I get that nice comfy secure feeling like when you are in a room with people you respect and trust..

Aww, thanks. I'm truly very flattered. I feel the same way about several of you, too.

I've had my moments recently, though (as some of you have witnessed).

Usually high stress due to ill family and/or pup + lack of adequate sleep due to caring for and/or worrying about them + being pushed at the wrong moment = me snapping. lol Hey, I'm only human :\ Otherwise, I'm pretty level-headed.

Luckily, a lot of that is starting to pass (fingers crossed, just one more surgery, thank goodness). I like my loved ones (and myself) healthy and happy

Then, just after that, it'll be warm enough to go outside and then I'll be so happy I won't even be able to stand myself.

[nullgeo]

dclamb3, jaijai, true -- I have been enjoying my relative quiet. Indeed, I am looking at a rainbow as I type this in the cockpit of my boat -- which is right now tied up in Rainbow Bay, literally, that's the name of this place. But, just for a moment or two, I am going to pipe up ... this is for youse guys

User, I didn't post this thread to "get more people interested in agriculture" that a science class would do better. I posted as a snapshot that would be interesting to a certain group of California folks. So this isn't a "how to" or "why don't you get on board this fabulous new age discovery" topic. If you prefer agriculture in a science classroom, why don't you just go sign up for a session and leave the rest of us to enjoy ourselves the way we see fit? Roger that?

As for the "touchy-feely 'spiritual' reverence for creatures" that you ridicule as unique to "disassociated modern man" -- humans have been revering nature since long before recorded history. Ok with you on that, pal?

Like TrueTimbers, I have faced bears in the wild numerous times -- and they impress the beejeebees out of me ... and it runs deep. I would venture to guess you have never had any such similar experiences, so maybe you should just stick with what you know (which is exactly what?, by the way? Besides Wikipedia, that is).

As for agriculture "being science": agriculture developed substantially long before science ... and it is certainly arguable that the more "science" has gotten involved, the less healthy agriculture has become. The science seems to be applied with the intent of economics -- not health. You know: making money for the conglomerates.

So a quick recap:
• this thread isn't for you or for developing the public's interest in "agriculture"
• humans have revered and honored animals (and plants) since forever
• some humans like that reverential experience
• modern "scientific" agriculture sucks -- and isn't executed to foster good health of people, nor the land it depletes

Now back to your regularly scheduled programming ... and I'll have another handful of nuts and seeds and apple slices. Good day.

[dclamb3]

Originally Posted by nullgeo

dclamb3, jaijai, true -- I have been enjoying my relative quiet. Indeed, I am looking at a rainbow as I type this in the cockpit of my boat -- which is right now tied up in Rainbow Bay, literally, that's the name of this place. But, just for a moment or two, I am going to pipe up ... this is for youse guys

He's back!!! :clapping:

That sounds fantastically delightful. I'm living vicariously through you today.

[Woof]

Originally Posted by TrueTimbers

....... (One who leaves $100 a bottle of single malt scotch in little cups for the Devas.......

I'm sorry, but that's just plain evil. Someone get the stake and the kindling!

[Woof]

Originally Posted by user_id

Yes, as this thread shows, there certainly are....but agriculture is inherently scientific so the fact that its so enamoured today with new agers is a bit strange...

Anyhow, I think you're going to get more people interested in agriculture by focusing on the science than posting about hippie/new ager groups...

You'd be surprised at how little we ordinary people are interested in the chemical scientific methods of agribusiness corporations.

[Hawk J]

Originally Posted by jaijai

Split peas are dried peas and then are found to be naturally split once the skin falls off.
I think that there are specific peas used to dry and split .... some green and some more yellow in color.
I'm like you .... i love split pea soup but i'm not crazy for peas although fresh and raw from the garden i do love.

I love to eat summer sweet pea's raw, & chew on the skin. It's sweet...